[P4A] Shadow Labrys vs. Teddie (Kuma)

[Urichinan]

Discuss the Teddie (Kuma) match-up here.

This post will be updated with information about the matchup as things are discovered.

[Gyokuran]

I'm just having so much trouble dealing with Kuma, any advice?

[flytai45]

if i was good enough, i would have tried this on my own but all teddies i play spam that horizontal claw whirlwind move and it seems safe on block, but i ASSUME that it can be punished if you instant block? any thoughts??

[-Seo]

if i was good enough, i would have tried this on my own but all teddies i play spam that horizontal claw whirlwind move and it seems safe on block, but i ASSUME that it can be punished if you instant block? any thoughts??

You only have to instant block one of the hits of the whirlwind claw and you can punish with 5A when he lands (should be CH too). If he's throwing it out randomly, you can 2B him right out of it as he's airborne during the move, though it's easier to react to the B version and you're better off just instant blocking the A version.

[Adelheid]

His counter is real dumb and is great at stopping you from running your best mixup on him

You can't OS against it by getting out of the way of the explosion and having Asterius strike it, 'cause it's unpunishable if it activates

Real silly!

[Arifureta]

Are there no recovery frames when he lands after that counter?

[Adelheid]

Are there no recovery frames when he lands after that counter?

He's fully invulnerable for its recovery. Thankfully it has very few active frames, so you can still run oki by varying your timing and not always being meaty in order to beat it, but... It's real good.

[.ShotS]

He has better neutral, he can zone for days, everything basically kills the bull and he gets to disrespect basically all of Shabrys' best setups. Easily her worst match up for right now.

I need to play this match up more so I get used to item order and how to deal with his normals.

[Adelheid]

When playing Teddies, I pretty much only go for laser oki. The different versions of laser come out with different timing, as I've outlined on the wiki, and there's enough ways you can mix them up that you can force a guessing game on him when he tries to counter.

In this matchup, I feel that all meter should go towards SB laser as a means of disrupting him and forcing a way in; it's difficult for him to snipe it. Titanomachia, too, is useful when you awaken. Teddie has a lot of ways to disrespect you, as dotShotS has mentioned, and it's important to work the few reliable things you have.

[Angry Guy of DE]

Teddie pretty much only needs to 5B, 5D, and press BD sometimes for most of the match. Teddie can zone really well in this match because normally he can't cancel off a whiff but if he hits Asterius...yeah...5B to 5D. 8C gets Asterius out of the way and momentarily stops him from tossing items or else he'll eat a fist. Same thing with wake-up, 8C and mixing the C and D command grab is really useful since if he does his dp too soon (or too late with command grabs) he'll eat some damage and have to start to respect what you do.

His 2B is good, but it seems pretty baitable if you jump over him and aside from the corner his damage is generally pretty tame without meter. His items however are able to do a ton of dirty stuff, two things come to mind with a Teddie I played at Xanadu:

Buckets into Teddie Ball: Stuck in blockstun and you get hit by the unblockable ball.

Muscle drink and Shuriken (or is it a wind spinner?): Get pushed into the drink when the spinner comes back, and then you get hit by whatever Teddie wants.

Its a hard matchup, maybe 6-4 Teddie's favor, but use of 8C makes Teddie have to be reminded that 5B on whiff isn't cancelable into anything so it will make him have to think past that.