[+R] Justice Strategies & Tips thread

[MikelAL93]

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The Justice Strategies & Tips thread

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Credits:

• Kiba for his Elizabeth Tips & Tricks thread which I used as a basis.
  
• Myself, Jourdal, Goldenrody, and Kursiv for posting multiple match videos from nicovideo onto YT.
  
  
  Table of Contents:
  
  1. Introduction
     
     
  2. Offense
     - Omega Shift
     - Blockstrings
     - Oki, Frame Traps, Cross/Mix-ups and Safe jumps etc.
     - Unblockable Setups
     
     
  3. Defense
     
     
  4. Tips & Tricks
     
  1. Introduction

  Important Links

  A.)

  Dustloop Wiki (Justice)

  B.)

  System Guide

  C.)

  Notation Guide

  D.)

  Frame Data

  E.)

  Youtube Guide

  F.)

  Q&A Thread

  2. Offense

  The Pros and Cons of Omega Shift

  Omega Shift is Justice's version of Sol's Dragon Install that is introduced in Accent Core + R. The pros of this move include the addition of another option to her game plan: By building meter so she can activate Omega Shift to transition to an offensive playstyle, and the return of her old mobility options (triple jump, dash, triple airdash). The recovery in the faint animation is faster than in DI.

  However, the cons of Omega Shift are that it requires 100% Tension, and like Dragon Install, will last for a set amount of time (10 seconds); so it wouldn't be worth it to sacrifice all of the meter that you have in your Tension Gauge to regain Justice's old mobility options prior to AC+R. Remember to use this move wisely depending in your situation like you would with Dragon Install. Two more disadvantages with OS are that the dashes during that mode are not as fast as they used to be, and your guard gauge will be full.

  Blockstrings

  Oki, Frame Traps, Cross/Mix-ups and Safe jumps etc.

  1. 
     Notes:
     
     
     

  Unblockable Setups

  1. 
     Notes:
     
     
     

  3. Defense

  1. 
     Notes:
     
     
     
  4. Tips & Tricks

  [*]

  Notes:

Edited February 26, 2013 by MikelAL93

[Pichy]

I've wound up with a Vita, so I'm testing the hell out of, well, everything while on breaks at work. Here's a rough outline of some stuff before I check on things like proration values and framedata.

Rundown of Justice's Moves (shift to wiki?)

5P

Hits twice. Mashable even on the second hit. Gigantic hitbox. One of the best jabs in the game. Use it. Lots.

5K

Hitbox reaches to the part where her tail curves around. Gatlings to everything. Good poke.

c.S

Single hit. HUGE anti-air hitbox. Gatling into 6P if you want to hitconfirm into an anti-air combo. Otherwise, this'll probably come out if you're just hitting S near the opponent while waiting for the lazy hitconfirm off 5S.

5S

Dizzy's 5S on crack. Huge horizontal reach, and hits 4 times no matter how far away you were. Hitconfirms into S Michael Sword are ridiculously easy thanks to this thing. Trick a Pot into playing footsies and just laugh when they attempt to Hammerfall.

Also cranks up the guard bar like nobody's business.

5H

Second-farthest reaching normal. Gatling into it when you can for extra damage before the inevitable S Michael Sword.

5D

Testament's 5D but a bit more ambiguously animated. Reaches a bit further than 5K, so you can toss it in after that instead of a 2D if you want to be a cool guy. Now we just need to work out a worthwhile Impossible Dust combo for her so we don't just go SPSPSdjSD Michael Sword.

2P

Mashable. Pretty standard 2P for anyone else, but is far and away Justice's worst normal. Nowhere near the reach of say, Faust's, and it hits Mid to boot. Just use 5P.

2K

One of her two lows. Reaches about the same distance as 6P, so you can actually do a wonky high/low game if you space things right. Also knocks the opponent up if you use it to OTG. Too bad they took away Michael Sword's groundslam...

2S

Big reaching normal, but it hits mid. Only gatlings to 5H, so use this if you've already hitconfirmed and don't want to scale your combo with 5S.

2H

j.S... on the ground! Hits mid, and hits twice. Knocks the opponent up but is neither jump nor special cancellable. You can juggle with nukes off this fellow, but you have to link into them. Pretty good way to end combos off a FRC air S-Michael Sword.

2D

Her only other low-hitting move. HUGE reach, almost as long as 5H. Combos into S Michael Sword, like all her S and H moves bar 2H.

6P

Godlike anti-air. Hits twice, but only once against airborne opponents now Gatlings into S, H and D, and can be gatling'd into by 5K and cl.S, allowing for you to tack on a bit more damage if you're smart.

Is also an overhead that is faster than 5D, making this your go-to mixup normal of choice most of the time.

6H

Hits twice, pulling them in on the first hit like Pot's 2S. Second hit launches. Combos off throw and Valkyrie Arc, making this to pretty much be your bread 'n butter launcher. Whenever you do launch people, the easiest combo is just j.S j.D dj.S j.D and then either S or H Michael Sword.

j.P

Good for mashing in blockstrings, but that's about it. Has a worse air-to-ground hitbox than it looks like it should.

j.K

Forkfoot. Amazing normal for playing air footsies with. Gatlings to S, H and D, so you can do things like j.K j.D as a nice safe blockstring.

j.S

2H but in the air! Standard combo filler, and has the best upwards reach of her air normals, making it good while rising to hit someone above you.

j.H

By far the best jump-in normal. Causes knockdown if it hits an airborne opponent, making this a good combo ender if you're close to the ground and want the largest amount of time to try setting up oki.

j.D

MASSIVE horizontal reach, and would be an utterly terrifying crossup attack if she had even one airdash. Gatlings from j.S and is both jump and special cancellable. Good move.

Special Moves

236P: Valkyrie Arc

THE COUNTER. Beats pretty much everything once it's active, but it's got startup. When it works, the attack is identical to her throw, leading to the usual 6H into whatever combos. Same proration as well, IIRC.

623K: S.B.T.

Her DP. Massive vertical reach. Can be FRC'd. Not sure if the old links off the thing still work, but I'd assume not since all her normals are a teensy bit slower. Still, very good DP.

22PKSHD: N.B.

NUKES. After the startup for a nuke is done you can cancel the later recovery frames into another nuke input, and do this forever provided there's a button's nuke not on screen. Nukes travel until you let go of their button, at which point they explode. If you get hit, nukes vanish.

Nukes can be FRC'd pretty much instantly after you've input them.

Trajectories are:

P - Horizontally, low to the ground. About where her 2P is.

K - Horizontally, at her head height.

S - Launches from the knee, and goes in an arc that's about 50 degrees.

H - Launches from the shoulder at about an 80 degree angle. Maybe 83.

D - Launches from the shoulder, but has a more curved arc than H.

Catching people with piles of these leads to sweet nuclear raves.

41236 S/H (air OK): Michael Sword

FWOOSHING. Gigantic hitbox, knocks down. There's two versions of it now, and they can be done in the air as the bog standard combo enders.

S version - Single hit and just causes knock down. Pretty much guaranteed to send the opponent to the corner. Is faster, so it combos off more normals.

H version - Slower startup, but has two hits and causes wallbounce. Can only be comboed into in specific situations, such as 6P, 5H Michael Sword. Not off a raw 5H though. Also builds a ton of meter on block, making it pretty sweet for ending blockstrings with.

Air S Version - Can be FRC'd, which causes the opponent to fall straight down. This lets you continue the combo either by relaunching with 6H, or doing a 2H into nukes. How you followup depends on the other guy's weight, really.

Air H Version - Wallbounce, and much easier to combo into thanks to j.D having lots of hitstun.

Whether you end with S or H version in the air depends on the matchup. There are some characters you want waaaaaaaaaay away from you (such as Kliff), and there's others who will destroy you if you plonk them in the other corner, such as Faust or Zappa. Choose the ender as you see fit.

Air versions can also be TK'd, but hit mid. The big advantage to doing TK michael swords is to shrink your hurtbox

236D: Saperia Trance

FWOOSH. Dash attack, and her only Force Break. Causes wallbounce, and is pretty much unreactable. Can be used as a ghetto movement tool, and to do silly shenanigans like whiffed Saperia Trance, land, throw.

Overdrives

632146S: Imperial Ray

Had its input changed for some reason.

Spinning red laster that hits a million times. Use this if you're OTGing in an attempt to kill someone on low health, as it doesn't give a damn about damage scaling. Can also be FRC'd now, and comboed into off 6H.

632146H: Michael Blade

SUPER FWOOSHING. Ludicrously good fullscreen reversal that OTGs and can be FRC'd. Also floats the opponent, so you can followup with 6H if you're close enough. The ultimate in just do it moves. Get used to blowing all your meter on this.

46463214S: Omega Shift

Justice Install. Costs 100 tension. Gives back her ability to run and airdash, and gives her 3 airdashes and 3 jumps just like the old days. Alas, all the restored mobilty options are far, far slower. On top of this, the recovery on the super is extremely long and your guard bar is filled to max. So basically, you spend all your meter in the hopes that you can get multiple mixups into full combos and kill your opponent in the span of about 14 second, and when you inevitably fail to do so they get the optimal setup to do a ToD on you. Never use this super. EVER. Two Michael Blades, a point-blank Michael Blade FRC or four nuke FRCs are all much better ways to spend your meter.

46463214H: Gamma Ray

First 50 tension is spent on the intial launching hit, which can then be FRC'd. Need to see if that has positive proration, since otherwise there's no reason to do it for reasons I'll explain in a bit.

After the first hit, Justice fires the wave motion cannon and destroys some floating continents around Jupiter. If your opponent's got less than 25 tension and is low on health, you're going to get a chip kill. There's just that many hits.

(Throw/Valkyrie Arc) 6H xx Gamma Ray combos on everyone who doesn't have Sol in their name. Scales like hell off the throw or VA, but does ludicrous damage off a raw 6H. If you've got 100 tension and know you can hitconfirm, it's actually a solid 50% or more off most of the cast's life. More if they have a bad guts rating.

Edited April 27, 2013 by Pichy

[Pichy]

Quick Guide to Justice Oki:

Do nuke, do another nuke with FRC, do 6P.

Tips and Tricks:

Justice's backdash is as good as Potemkin's, if not better. Abuse the hell out of it - you're going to be in unfavourable positions a lot.

TK michael swords shrink her hurtbox and have a ton of blockstun. Good to just toss out in neutral game if you need some meter and don't care if it hits or not.

Don't go nuts with nukes on Pot. Sure you're a zoner, but slidehead and flick aren't going to let you have more than one nuke on screen.

Superjump j.H is your friend.

[MikelAL93]

Interesting stuff you have there, Pichy. Thanks for the info.

I'll definitely put all the info regarding Justice's attacks (normals, specials, etc.) to the wiki soon enough, but thanks again for your impressions on Justice in AC+R.

[Kaizen]

I don't know how this wasn't mentioned in the frame data, but 6P forces crouching on hit. Since it hits on frame 10 against standing opponents, you can combo into it out of everything that gatlings into it, provided that you're close enough. Since it's also much easier to confirm a combo into H Michael Sword on crouching hit than counter hit, 6P should probably be used in combos a lot when you need to keep the opponent close to setup oki.

It obviously also makes for a great reset because it hits on 18 against crouchers (except against Pot), which we've already established with 2K. 2P could also be useful for tick throws, and 6P resets, since it's Justice's only normals that's plus on block (+1).

[Pichy]

H.Sword RC 6H j.S j.D dj.S H.Airsword j.H is also (as far as I've been able to find myself/observe from matches) her optimal 50 tension combo. The easiest combo is c.S 6P 5H H.Sword into the aformentioned stuff.

Also I should've mentioned ages ago when I wrote all those posts that you can only combo into Ground H.Sword off of 6P into 5H due to the forced crouch, or off a 6H. So you can also do 6H H.Sword RC into the good air combo (or end with an S.Airsword if you don't want the other guy near you at all).

In turn, j.S is the only air normal that combos into H.Airsword, and only off the first hit.

While I'm tired and rambling, it's worth noting that people like TON have resorted to only doing 6H xx 22S in the corner off throws/counters now, as it does almost as much damage/builds almost as much meter as an air combo and has better positioning, along with more time to do actualy, you know, okizeme.

[Kaizen]

I've been screwing around with 2H lately, and I think it might end up being one of Justice's most important normals. Not only can you link it into H/D nuke and c.S against heavier opponents, but it also links to j.P, j.K, and j.S. This means that Justice gets free launches and air combos if she can combo into it. Rather than simply being forced to go for knockdown out of it, you can opt to go into something like xx > 2H , j.S > j.D > j.S(1) > H Air Michael Sword, j.H for near knockdown, and j.S(1) > j.D > dj.S(1) > j.D > S Air Michael Sword for far knockdown. So, you know. The usual loafs and margarine.

Also, turns out for Corner Throw > 6H > 22S, you can instead do 6H > 22H/D > 22S for a little bit more damage and the same oki opportunity. Against anybody who's not a heavyweight, you can tack on more with 2 or 3 22Ps as well.

I'm not expecting her to shoot to top, but I really think she isn't nearly as trash as everybody was writing her off as. No mobility sucks, but there's some pretty sick combo potential that isn't being utilized (obviously because most people capable of playing Justice in tournament likely haven't touched +R training mode). On paper, she honestly sounds good. Amazing set of normals. Pot tier backdash. Decent defense (5 guts for 1.03 defense is a fair trade). Three awesome overdrives. Extremely high meter gain (builds meter faster than Johnny). Ludicrous throw range. Ridiculous damage, good mixup, easy combo execution and can combo from pretty much anywhere kind of easily. Her hitbox was shrunken and they matched her burst startup to AC standards, which is why she and Kliff got the same buff over the patch (and Dead Angle still isn't throw invincible. ).

I really hope that I'm right in thinking that, post-console release, she ends up being perceived as better, and players really start wrecking shit with her.

[xlolxlolx]

defensively she doesnt really have too much going for her without 50 meter along with the fact that stronger zoners and characters with good pokes are gonna shut her down so she cant play the obstacle course or footsie game, not to mention how much trouble she has getting in against most of the cast after a ground combo ending with slash michael blade

[Kaizen]

She has DP, Backdash, and Pot Ground Throw range, in addition to Michael Blade. The frame data listed on her DP makes so little sense that I have the feeling that something is wrong. Hell, her jab and 2K were listed as overheads before I started editing her wiki page.

Yes, she is outclassed in both projectile whoring and when in direct face-to-face range, but at midscreen her pokes are amazing. I get the impression that they'd feel a lot more threatening if Justice players started going for longer combos that end in nearby knockdown, like xx > air S Michael Sword FRC > 2H > nuke. She might not have backdash to Pot Buster, but between 6P, 2K, and 55 pixel ground throw, I'd start sweating under that kind of pressure.

[xlolxlolx]

her "dp" only gives her low invuln, it will lose or trade with most mid/high, there really is no reward you gain from backdashing in her case imo, simply FDing a move pretty much pushes her out of range for any kind of mixup possible if she backdashes close up

[Notwhoyouthink]

On a sorta random note, unless my memory is wrong of what they were fooling around with justice in her dragon install sorta mode she is actually weaker then she was in the orginal AC. I tried doing her orginal basically instant kill combos and they didnt work anymore. Shes more of a toned down version of that actually =/ Lame.....

[Pichy]

Yeah, that's my problem with the thing. You spend 100 meter and then don't deal anywhere near enough damage or gain enough momentum to even land a kill. At least 6H xx Gamma Ray still does like 190 damage even off a throw.

[Digital Watches]

Man, I've been mad loving the shenanigans this character offers. Stuff I've been doing in matches:

- Low j.H into 2K/Fuzzy 6P mixup

- High N.B. FRC, saperia, let go of bombs for crossup as soon as they're out of blockstun

- Combo into j.D->j.swordH (Doesn't combo) recover into tech trap airthrow.

- j.swordS FRC as a fast-fall

- TK Swords to beat lows.

- Aforementioned Empty TK Saperia ... throw

Edited August 19, 2013 by Digital Watches

[Digital Watches]

Also: Shit, I can't test this until I have my PS3 in front of me but... with 4F startup isn't j.P going to come out before low TK j.sword FRC lands? I'd think j.K ought to work too. I don't actually know how long you float. But anyway this could be a pretty good high-low since it falls pretty fast and 2K confirms into damage now (As presumably would a low j.P or j.K (Both of which hit high) You can probably also do fuzzy guard mixups from this setup (If it works). May well be able to do j.K->dj.D (What's doublejump startup again?) At any rate, K-dj.K or P or S should almost certainly work, which would WCS combo into what, saperia or another j.sword FRC?

Edited August 19, 2013 by Digital Watches

[Eshi]

Man, I've been mad loving the shenanigans this character offers. Stuff I've been doing in matches:

- Low j.H into 2K/Fuzzy 6P mixup

- High N.B. FRC, saperia, let go of bombs for crossup as soon as they're out of blockstun

- Combo into j.D->j.swordH (Doesn't combo) recover into tech trap airthrow.

- j.swordS FRC as a fast-fall

- TK Swords to beat lows.

- Aforementioned Empty TK Saperia ... throw

I've been doing a couple of those too. But wow, 6P Fuzzy? So the first hit of the two doesn't whiff and it's a 10 frame overhead? That's disgusting.

[Pichy]

Yeah, 6P does everything (except chain into sweep).

Anyway, I've been fiddling with trying to get anything off whiffed TK Sairsword FRC since you can in fact get both j.P and j.K, but it appears that the FRC puts her in a falling state and you can't jump to get a j.D into a combo off of it. That said, stuff like blocked f.S, TK Sairsword FRC, j.K then just sweep them is going to make their heads explode. Also, potential for investigating if she can JI to get stuff sounds like a thing someone who doesn't suck at the game should do.

[Digital Watches]

Okay, finally got a PS3 to test with again. So first of all, the reason you can't jump after the FRC is because you're probably TKing it with a superjump. If you do the motion 4123658S (FRC) then you'll get a normal jump TK, which will let you double jump. Unfortunately Justice's doublejump is too big to really set up fuzzyguards (Except like, j.D dj.H) with, but you can do a superjump forward TK j.Sword FRC and get two air normals before you land (e.g. j.KS or j.KP or j.PK), which will also fuzzy guard.

Also, for the setup into fuzzy first-hit 6P, j.S actually works a lot better than j.H, because it pushes them out less and thus will work more reliably from more distances.

Additionally, some cool blockstrings/mixup from crossup j.D:

j.D-dj.H (Fuzzy guard)

j.D-2K (Low)

Crossup j.D-2K will also combo, as will crossup j.D-dj.H, but j.D-dj.H doesn't go into anything, so if you confirm the hit with the j.D you should probably go into something else.

Crossup j.D into j.sword can connect or not based on your spacing. This can lead to some shenanigans such as:

j.D-j.swordS, j.D-(Whatever else you were gonna do from j.D, including aforementioned fuzzy stuff). This will hit as another overhead on the same side

j.D-j.swordH, j.D (Re-crosses up, but more reactable. Can also do j.H instead of second j.D). From far enough away, you can throw a j.S and not re-cross up, which is another mixup that goes into damage.

Furthermore, you can do crossup j.D-j.swordS (FRC), which has some cool properties, since you can get aforementioned fuzzy stuff off it, but also, you can get huge combos from it since

Crossup j.D-j.swordS (FRC) 6H will connect from some distances, and as far as I can tell, crossup j.D-j.swordS (FRC) 2H will connect from any distance the sword still connects from.

Edited August 20, 2013 by Digital Watches

[Digital Watches]

Silly impractical fuzzy setups GO:

6P-j.P will fuzzy guard against Zappa or taller. j.P combos into S michael if you're super fast.

Also 5P combos into j.P into Michael. So that's cool.

[Eshi]

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm21595113

So, the first part of this video shows a really sneaky cross-up on may using the pushback of a missile positioned behind her. It's a good setup, but it's not general. Some characters are pushed too far after jD so Justice gets f.S instead of c.S, and for others c.S > 2HS doesn't combo from that distance. Some characters are extremely difficult to connect 1-hit j.41236S on. I want to make this a consistent situation.

The most general situation I can create so far is throw > 6HS > j.HS and requires 50 meter. Different falling speeds after throw make timing the setup from jS > jHS a little wonky and only 5ish damage is lost in exchange for consistency. Land, do 22P FRC immediately, walk forward slightly and neutral jump. The timing on the jump will determine if she crosses up or doesn't, but either way, she can input j41236S FRC in the same direction to hit confirm. I'm 90% sure that this will universally combo into 6HS when she's low enough to the ground. So, she gives up throw damage and requires 50 meter for this, but the reward is enormous (easily half of most characters' health bar).

[GreasyGyro718]

thats nice