Zouf Report post Posted September 27, 2013 That first match against HK, just wow. Konan has such an incredible hit confirm Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kiba Report post Posted September 27, 2013 Awesome! I confess, I wasn't really prepared to watch the tiny little postage-stamp-sized minimized videos. It's cool man I know it was difficult to watch the matches in that condition. I suspected there would be a reupload since I figured that other matches were missing. That first match against HK, just wow. Konan has such an incredible hit confirm Definitely Konan's hitconfirm is something to take note of. I especially like how he does IAD j.B > 5A/5C. Speaking of Konan, notice how he omits 5A in the corner 5C > 2CC > 236C > (5A inserted here) > 5C > 2C > 236B > 214B > 22B. I was wondering why players did that and now I've noticed that 5A actually scales the damage. 5CC > 22D > 6C > CT > Stuff was originally 4.3k, but without the 5A, it deals 4.4k. 5A also seems to cause 236B to ocassionally whiff as seen in some past matches with Kuresu. I know it was only 100 damage less but I'm all 'bout that max damage. Also I have noticed something. This isn't new though since Surf and I touched upon it some pages back. It was the ground ender vs air ender debate. Midscreen it doesn't really matter what ender you use. Aerial enders (> j.214X) have you closer to the opponent and 9 times out of 10 they're probably going to roll back to get away from you, thus increasing your 'corner carry' further. The ground enders have good corner carry and give you some time to charge a little, followed up with a dash. In the corner the difference is a little more significant however. The ground enders are the preferred choice because 22B has more untechable time than j.214X (excluding j.214D of course), and the opponent cannot roll past you (unless you're very close to them), which secures your oki. The air enders have less untechable time and so the opponent can easily roll out of the corner even if you charge cancel it. You won't have enough time to punish the roll, and you'll have to start from scratch getting them into the corner. The only advantage the air enders have is that they deal slightly more damage, about 100 - 300 more depending on the combo. This is why you see players doing 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214B > 5C > 2C > 236B > 214B > 22B and getting the SMP effect, because they want to stick to the 22B ender (though I do not know why they optimise it by doing the 6A > 5CC > 623C > delay j.214A route - Konan did it a few times). The only other time the air enders are used is when they have no choice, for example, when they're hitting an aerial opponent with j.BB and they have no charge. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Airk Report post Posted September 28, 2013 This is why you see players doing 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214B > 5C > 2C > 236B > 214B > 22B and getting the SMP effect, because they want to stick to the 22B ender (though I do not know why they optimise it by doing the 6A > 5CC > 623C > delay j.214A route - Konan did it a few times). Probably because Japanese players need to practice too, and don't feel comfortable enough with that version to worry about the extra damage. Kinda sad that our air enders are still mostly useless, though I guess they're sortof valid midscreen, which is better than before. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zouf Report post Posted September 28, 2013 Kinda sad that our air enders are still mostly useless, though I guess they're sortof valid midscreen, which is better than before. ehh? J.214X is pretty good in CP. It doesn't give us enough time to charge but we gain the okizeme, and can keep the pressure. That's a huge improvement from CS (I kept doing j.214A RC just to keep the pressure after an air combo, now it's free) If anything it's the best buff she gained in CP compared to CSEX, that and the huge increase of damage Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kiba Report post Posted September 28, 2013 Zouf is correct. Regarding j.214X, like Zouf I too resorted to using RC to maintain pressure, and other times I'd only use one jump so I can air dash afterwards. Probably because Japanese players need to practice too, and don't feel comfortable enough with that version to worry about the extra damage. Yeah, that's fair enough really. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Errol Report post Posted September 28, 2013 yeah, the shittiness of air combos is one of the worst things in EX, can't wait for that to be gone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kiba Report post Posted September 30, 2013 9/25 Playspot Big One Suya (VK) vs Usagi (TS) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Airk Report post Posted October 1, 2013 ehh? J.214X is pretty good in CP. It doesn't give us enough time to charge but we gain the okizeme, and can keep the pressure. That's a huge improvement from CS (I kept doing j.214A RC just to keep the pressure after an air combo, now it's free) I'm confused. How does this reconcile with The air enders have less untechable time and so the opponent can easily roll out of the corner even if you charge cancel it. You won't have enough time to punish the roll, and you'll have to start from scratch getting them into the corner. ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kiba Report post Posted October 1, 2013 I think he just means the oki from j.214A/B/C is better in CP than it is in CSE. You land next to the opponent. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zouf Report post Posted October 1, 2013 Yes that's what i meant Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kiba Report post Posted October 2, 2013 9/30 Athena Nipponbashi Tenho (BU) vs Tera Luna (TS) | Part 2 The Bullet could use the burst a little more at times because he gave Tera some free wins. Part 1, at 3:07, you see 22D CH > 6C > CT > Stuff into j.214D ender for 4.5k which was nice (of course if he wasn't going for the kill j.214D would not be needed and 4.4k would still be good). It may be good at some points to burn the charge after a blocked 236X because the high reward comes with very low risk. In CP 22D is safer being -4, so you can't be punished even if it's instant blocked (although range may be something to consider). At 5:54 in part 2 you see Tera use 3CC > RC > air dash again, but the significant thing about it is that he RC'd 3CC on whiff. Bullet doesn't seem to have a hard time punishing a blocked 3CC so be careful using it against her. Apart from all that, there's quite a bit of mashing at certain points in the match. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ginseng Report post Posted October 2, 2013 but the significant thing about it is that he RC'd 3CC on whiff. I paid close attention to check this, because you shouldn't be able to RC on whiff in this game. It was actually blocked on both hits of 3CC. It only looked like it whiffed. The barrier loss and meter gain on the Bullet player proves this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Errol Report post Posted October 2, 2013 i think we've seen 3cc rc'd on whiff in previous videos. I think jin can rc 623d(block)>followup(whiff)>rc too. you can see the guard effect on the first hit of 3c in this video, but not on the 3cc. she was low enough on life to have passive meter gain. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ginseng Report post Posted October 2, 2013 Pretty sure it jumped up from 90 to 93 in the video on the "whiff". But maybe it's just a prerequisite of having one of the hits in a "multi-hitting" move in order to be roman-cancelled. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Errol Report post Posted October 2, 2013 that video is really blurry, looks more like 90 to 91 to me. anyway you can clearly see the guard effect when 3c is barrierd and not when 3cc should've hit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zouf Report post Posted October 2, 2013 3CC can be RC'ed on whiff if 3C was blocked in CP. We've already seen it in another video Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Adam0812 Report post Posted October 2, 2013 Nice that Tsu can get some sick damage off 5b and 5c CH > mugen. Especially 5b due to its range. The air OD to win the round was very cool as well Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ginseng Report post Posted October 2, 2013 Ah looking at it again, you guys are right! My mistake! Not like I have credibility anyways hahaha. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kiba Report post Posted October 2, 2013 I think jin can rc 623d(block)>followup(whiff)>rc too. I'm just confirming that this is true. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kiba Report post Posted October 3, 2013 10/3 Kouhatsu Tsubaki vs Jin Tsubaki vs Hazama Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Airk Report post Posted October 3, 2013 I'm just confirming that this is true. This actually raises the interesting question of "Is this a special property of some moves, or is it a change to how 'followups' work?" Because there're times when it would be really nice to be able to fix a 5B (hit) > 5BB (whiff because f*ck you, 5BB) with a rapid cancel. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Errol Report post Posted October 3, 2013 I think this is just a change to how 3c works. in EX and earlier 3c and 3cc were basically considered separate moves. in CP 3c/3cc behave just like Jin's 623D. In CP, you can go into 3cc almost immediately, and 3cc will not autocorrect direction if they are on the other side of you (3cc oki dead). Again same as Jin's 623D. Other tsubaki moves haven't changed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheGreatReptar Report post Posted October 3, 2013 3CC oki isn't dead Errol. 3CC has a hitbox in the back now. It's just harder to space. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Errol Report post Posted October 3, 2013 whatchu say? tsubaki got back? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheGreatReptar Report post Posted October 3, 2013 She's always had back. I guess she just sticks it out a bit now while doing her backflip for 3CC. Wish I had the video of it on hand, but I've definitely seen it hit backwards. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites