[CP] Carl Clover Gameplay Discussion (Changelog in OP)

[wiredgod]

What I'm wondering is: With 1.1 is it possible now to do midscreen summon combos from any starter on any opponent or not?

ie. the good starter > Cantabile > summon > combo with Nirvana

I've seen some video's where people do the midscreen cantabile > summon into 4D > combo,

but I've also seen a lot of videos where there is no followup after the cantabile. What are the specifics for the summon combo to work?

Also Carl had an airdash cancel in CT where he would drop quicker than normal. I know that got removed sometime in CS,

but I've seen some BBCP videos where Carl does some sort of airdash cancel (although noticeably slower than in CT)

What's up with that?

 

The only reliable way to cantabile > summon > continue combo is if you counter hit on the cantabile or rapid cancel after the cantabile hits.

 

I'm guessing the abbreviated airdash you mean is the 2C > allegretto cancel

[Psykotik]

Hello everyone

i used to play Carl in BB:CT and I'm now gettign back into BB with CP.

Still trying to get used to all the new system changes while missing the Clap loop and overhead allecan. Carl seems much harder to play than in CT.

What I'm wondering is: With 1.1 is it possible now to do midscreen summon combos from any starter on any opponent or not?

ie. the good starter > Cantabile > summon > combo with Nirvana

I've seen some video's where people do the midscreen cantabile > summon into 4D > combo,

but I've also seen a lot of videos where there is no followup after the cantabile. What are the specifics for the summon combo to work?

 

 

While it's possible to do summon combos off any ground starter, the main issue with summon combos is that you have to summon Ada ASAP during your ground string so she can recover in time to follow up the cantabile. Most Carl players usually do this too late so they can only end w/a cantabile knockdown + oki. 

 

Also Carl had an airdash cancel in CT where he would drop quicker than normal. I know that got removed sometime in CS,

but I've seen some BBCP videos where Carl does some sort of airdash cancel (although noticeably slower than in CT)

What's up with that?

 

I assume you're talking about Carl's kara glide? It's been removed in CSEX and CP, although you can do a similar fast fall if you airdash + activate OD.

 

Could you show me the CP videos where Carl does this airdash cancel? I might be able to explain better if I watch it.

[Schwinguini]

So it's possible with a realy early summon?

Is it guaranteed on everyone at any screenposition or really situational?

I'm refering to combos like this one at 1:20: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=iOjyT0JuYPE#t=80

 

 

regarding the kara glide:

 

Yes that's what I'm talking about. I can't find the video tho, so either it was my imagination running through with me, or it was the airdash + OD.

Too bad that's gone tho.

[Pen_Ninja]

So it's possible with a realy early summon?

Is it guaranteed on everyone at any screenposition or really situational?

I'm refering to combos like this one at 1:20: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=iOjyT0JuYPE#t=80

 

It'll work as long as you summon Ada early enough that she recovers in time to hit your opponent before they tech out of cantabile.

You can't solo combo out of cantabile (non-CH) without Ada so you need to either have her around before the combo starts or summon her before cantabile even starts.

[someonewhodied]

Recently I've been catching a lot of people with 623C(blocked)>RC>microdash grab

 

Just an idea for people to try out.

[Raiza57]

Several tier list have been released, and the majority of them placed Carl at S-tier..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsqmU3v0hVA

~Shiro

[JG]

Several tier list have been released, and the majority of them placed Carl at S-tier..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsqmU3v0hVA

~Shiro

The other day i was talking about this with pen ninja. I accept that Carl is strong, but  i just don't see too many players performing well with him, especially Itoue, Ryusei and Eesuke. So at least for me, is hard to imagine him as an S class. 

I like CP Carl, but i still believe that he lack some of the EXT magic. EXT Carl was better overall or maybe i feel that way because Kyaku isn't playing anymore.... He was the N-otoko of Carl.

I wonder how many bad matchup Carl have in 1.1. 

[Errol]

he is the absolute least played character last I remember, there are a lot performing well considering that.

[Rishtopher]

I've been reading about that list in the Gameplay thread. It's just saltiness and overreactions imo. I think Carl is great, just not God-tier great lol.

 

Also, in regards to Carl being underplayed: Do you guys have trouble in Carl mirrors? What do you do?

I don't think I've ever played a Carl mirror in CP. I already have like 0 Carl matchup experience due to playing my same 3 friends for years til just now.

[Niko]

Carl is definitely strong, but I don't see how a character with such obvious weaknesses can be true god tier -- i.e. better than characters like Kokonoe, Azrael, Litchi, and Rachel -- considering the characters who usually hold that top spot are there precisely because they don't have any big weaknesses.

 

Until we see all the top players switching to Carl, resulting in nee-san mirrors for the majority of grand finals in tournaments (like we have always seen with all the past S tier characters) I'm with Rhistopher and will call these lists SALT.

 

Will be interesting to see how many Carl players will make Top 8 at EVO for one, and how well they will do going forward.

[Raiza57]

The other day i was talking about this with pen ninja. I accept that Carl is strong, but  i just don't see too many players performing well with him, especially Itoue, Ryusei and Eesuke. So at least for me, is hard to imagine him as an S class. 

I like CP Carl, but i still believe that he lack some of the EXT magic. EXT Carl was better overall or maybe i feel that way because Kyaku isn't playing anymore.... He was the N-otoko of Carl.

I wonder how many bad matchup Carl have in 1.1. 

 

Shall we go over the facts?

We have 3 different legit UB setups at our disposal.

JB+3D

Fucco +6C

Fermata>OD>Volante+6C of which, 1 of them is extremely versatile in battle.

Our worst matchups got hit with the nerf bat:

Tao & Valk

Litchi(Not really that much), 

Mu-12(Her DP),

Kokonoe(Dat hurtbox),

Haku-men(For what little threat was left of him)

Our OD now has an actual passive function, regenerating Ada HP. Carl has an anti poke tool to keep ada safe that can be combo'ed from on CH(Cantabile). La Terezzan is a godsend for neutral. Anytime, keyword people, ANYTIME Carl lands a Jc on any opponent (Except Kokonoe & Bullet) he can go directly into a ja fuzzy combo which leads into 2k+UB reset of 4k. For a cost of about 45% of Adas HP. For the most part aside from characters with strong neutral game, Carl really has no bad matchups. This could just be my bias opinion and I could be wrong but excluding: Mu-12, Litchi, Valk, Tao, Kokonoe(Not really),... I feel Carl goes even with Rachel, Hazama, Arakune, Plat, Izayoi, Jin and Azreal.. As for the rest of the cast =/ they get bodied. This is opinionated, but after playing all the matchups it truly does feel like this to me. But now that all of the characters we sucked against got nerfed, I can say we could go even with them. 

So thats 12 characters Carl goes even with, and the other 13 characters those matchups are in our favor even if only by a slight fraction... they are still in our favor. Which would make a S-tier character. Yes he isnt godlike like the other S-tier characters,, but Arks has done a very good job at rebalancing the cast. So even though Carl is top, he isnt all that much better than the rest of the cast... But he is still better. Very much how most people feel Kokonoe is not godlike in 1.1 but still better than most of the cast. Even though I am not a firm believer of that statement.

~Shiro

[wiredgod]

People don't know the matchup and that might be why they bump him up a bit in terms of tier

[Raiza57]

People don't know the matchup and that might be why they bump him up a bit in terms of tier

I am not referring to people, I am referring to other Carls. We know matchups, and they are looking pretty good in terms of Carl. 

~Shiro

[sinder]

Who's going to EVO?

 

I can't go this year, but I'm curious if any carls have to fight some of the Jap Players

[grove03]

Carl mirror is great, it's an all out neutral game where the first hit leads to victory cause setplay!! reminds me of a bit of p4u :D

[Psykotik]

Carl mirrors are fun, it's almost like playing a fighting game

 

Who's going to EVO?

 

I can't go this year, but I'm curious if any carls have to fight some of the Jap Players

 

Me, CrazyApe, Akira-Shiro and Ivysaur will all be at EVO

 

Crazyape and Shiro should make it out of their pools (Kogatan is fighting Shiro first round but he'll probably beat everyone else in his pool). Ivysaur and I have more difficult pools (Kinji's in my pool lolllllll) so there's a chance we could drown in them. I believe we can both make it out though!

[someonewhodied]

Hey i'm going to evo. If matchups call for it I'll rep carl against some characters.

[Pen_Ninja]

I'll be there but my carl isn't where I'd want him to be to play him in tourney

[Raiza57]

Yo, CP2 all DD are enhanced by OD Fermata>3c>Volteldo get hype!!!!!

-Shiro

[KwRIOT]

Shiro probably means Volante(edit) Arpeggio of Oblivion. Unless I'm wrong, in which case...VOLTELDO HYPE begin!   

[9:02 PM]

If you have a choice off a midscreen confirm where the opponent is between Carl and Nirvana, should you go for a combo that leaves them standing to limit their tech options or just take the damage and go for a launcher into an air combo?

In the same vein, a lot of the combo videos I've seen will get a standing confirm, like 5b, 2b, 5c, tenerezza, and instead of doing airdash j. B, j. 2c, j. B, j. C, they'll a sequence with like four or five j. A's in it. Is there a reason for the j. A mash over normals that scale less and still allow a 3D after?

[KwRIOT]

As far as I know, Carl combos all tend to end in j.C or 3C. 3C allows for a follow-up Fermata or ODC > 3C > 632146]D[. From time to time, you'll see a Carl use j.214C to cornerbounce an opponent, but this is strictly for when Nirvana is dead.

 

The point is: Carl has plenty of ways to launch the opponent (623C, 4]D[, 63214]D[ > CT, fully charged 6C, etc...) followed by knockdown with oki setup (3]D[, Fuoco, Volante). This is the preferred gameplan.

 

Multiple j.A's are used to create unblockable resets. Is that what happened in the video?

[sinder]

WAITTTTTTTTTTTT!!!!!

 

Hold on! STOP THE PRESSES!!!!

 

I know I've been MIA for a while, but what is this talk of BB2.0 coming out next month?

Were those patch notes for real?? For Carl too???

 

WTF is going on?!?!?1

 

If this is all true, and I pray to god that it is not, this makes it harder to want to even continue playing BB

 

I really, really, REALLY hope that these changes are going to be as big as people make it out to be, but poor Carl . He is offically the Dr.Strange of Blazblue, EXACT same problems and advantages

 

 

[Raiza57]

WAITTTTTTTTTTTT!!!!!

 

Hold on! STOP THE PRESSES!!!!

 

I know I've been MIA for a while, but what is this talk of BB2.0 coming out next month?

Were those patch notes for real?? For Carl too???

 

WTF is going on?!?!?1

 

If this is all true, and I pray to god that it is not, this makes it harder to want to even continue playing BB

 

I really, really, REALLY hope that these changes are going to be as big as people make it out to be, but poor Carl . He is offically the Dr.Strange of Blazblue, EXACT same problems and advantages

 

Yes, yes, yes and yes. The notes were indeed real... Which is why we posted them, However, there was a second locktest which we know nothing about. So there is a second set of changes that were made without the general publics knowledge. A few japanese got to play, and according to Dogura "Loketest 2 kokonoe looks B- tier", but nothing was reported. IDK why, but no one decided to report things or maybe they couldnt? Or maybe I simply just dont know about them. Ehh, I except there to be one third final loketest before they release BBCP2 in October 2.... or was it October 9th?? One of these IIRC.

~Shiro

[JyakotuKurayami]

Yes, yes, yes and yes. The notes were indeed real... Which is why we posted them, However, there was a second locktest which we know nothing about. So there is a second set of changes that were made without the general publics knowledge. A few japanese got to play, and according to Dogura "Loketest 2 kokonoe looks B- tier", but nothing was reported. IDK why, but no one decided to report things or maybe they couldnt? Or maybe I simply just dont know about them. Ehh, I except there to be one third final loketest before they release BBCP2 in October 2.... or was it October 9th?? One of these IIRC.

~Shiro

Where are the current notes for CP2.0? Because the only ones I saw were from the first ever loketest.