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Lord Knight

[CP] Litchi Faye Ling - Gameplay Discussion (Read first post!)

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1- I think you IB'ed the first hit of Lambda's 3C then used the autoguard. It works for Makoto when you can IB then Parry Lambda's 3C

Itsuu takes 8f to actually get autoguard so i dont think that's possible, and it was not after litchi blocking.. however, the fact that makoto can do that is very interesting and may be relevant.

2- Maybe they hit Litchi too late?

I dont think so, iirc punishers that just barely hit before the staff arrives(like 20f punishes IIRC) punished it reliably when i tested it.. it may have something to do with chains or projectiles, though.

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2)normally, when someone blocks litchi's dp, they just hit a button to punish and the dp's falling staff followup just falls right through them and doesnt actually hit them as long as they hit litchi in time.

however, sometimes it hits them anyway. i dont see any pattern in this and i've seen it in arcade footage too, like with a ragna punishing with 5b 5c but being hit by the falling staff during 5c. what causes this? is it just a glitch?

If you fail to punish Litchi immediately the hitbox will remain active on the falling hit, but if you punish it for real it will lose its hitbox.

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Itsuu takes 8f to actually get autoguard so i dont think that's possible, and it was not after litchi blocking.. however, the fact that makoto can do that is very interesting and may

I'm still not sure about it. Will test it tomorrow.

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Just gonna repeat this here but lambda's 3c is only a low on the first three hits... I dunno. I thought it was only the first but it's actually the first three. I feel like I remember being able to just stand block after the first hit. oddness. Maybe the 2nd and 3rd hit don't actually hit if the first one is blocked at range or something like that.

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If you fail to punish Litchi immediately the hitbox will remain active on the falling hit, but if you punish it for real it will lose its hitbox.

I dont think so. Testing with mu trying to punish litchi's DP on block:

-If you 6c ASAP, you hit litchi and the staff doesnt hit you.

-If you time 6c slightly late, either litchi is able to block and the staff hits you or you get hit out of startup.

There is no situation here where both litchi and mu get hit because mu hit "too late" in some vague way. The situation i'm talking about is where litchi gets punished but the opponent still gets hit by the staff.

Also, thanks for the point about lambdas 3c, errol.

Edited by Mightfo

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I dont think so. Testing with mu trying to punish litchi's DP on block:

-If you 6c ASAP, you hit litchi and the staff doesnt hit you.

-If you time 6c slightly late, either litchi is able to block and the staff hits you or you get hit out of startup.

There is no situation here where both litchi and mu get hit because mu hit "too late" in some vague way. The situation i'm talking about is where litchi gets punished but the opponent still gets hit by the staff.

Also, thanks for the point about lambdas 3c, errol.

Sorry, I phrased it backwards.

If you punish Litchi too early, the falling hit will retain its hitbox, if you punish litchi with a later timing, for some reason it loses its hitbox.

Try punish it on whiff with ยต 5c or 2c and she will be hit out if it after CH'ing litchi.

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Tsubame has 4 different active frames. between the third and fourth hit (end of rising, start of falling staff) there is a notable lag that is not shown in the frame data but is obviously there. As COr basically said, during the time -after- the active for the falling staff starts, if litchi is hit, it loses its hitbox. It doesn't lose it's hitbox if she is hit early because it is during the lag period, meaning there is no hitbox.

Tl;dr the fourth hit of tsubame is no longer a dp, just a projectile.

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I think it's because the staff... "entity" hasn't been instanced in the game code until it re-enters the screen. Only once it's back on the screen does the game code remove it's hit box if Litchi gets hit. I could explain it better I know.

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TD explained it as clear as you're going to get if there's still any confusion. If you punish during the period where Tsubame has hit it's 3rd point (full rise) but before the 4th (falling), it will retain it's hitbox. It will lose it's hit box in the 1st, 2nd and 4th points.

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TD explained it as clear as you're going to get if there's still any confusion. If you punish during the period where Tsubame has hit it's 3rd point (full rise) but before the 4th (falling), it will retain it's hitbox. It will lose it's hit box in the 1st, 2nd and 4th points.

Next time I need a tl;dr, ill ask you for help. You do it better.

As for the lambda 3c vs litchi itsuu situation, at first I was thinking what Errol said.

But now that I think about it, it that situation, there isn't a way to "avoid" the first three hits which hit low while being able to autoguard the rest.

itsuu autoguard is faster by 4 frames, and would technically block the rest of lambda 3c if litchi somehow did dodge the low hits, but again, this is pretty much impossible to do because even on ib, there is way too much block stun to do anything during 3c, and in fact, 3c is airtight which reiterates my above point.

It is certainly interesting. Most likely a glitch.

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Next time I need a tl;dr, ill ask you for help. You do it better.

As for the lambda 3c vs litchi itsuu situation, at first I was thinking what Errol said.

But now that I think about it, it that situation, there isn't a way to "avoid" the first three hits which hit low while being able to autoguard the rest.

itsuu autoguard is faster by 4 frames, and would technically block the rest of lambda 3c if litchi somehow did dodge the low hits, but again, this is pretty much impossible to do because even on ib, there is way too much block stun to do anything during 3c, and in fact, 3c is airtight which reiterates my above point.

It is certainly interesting. Most likely a glitch.

Could be that the only the later active frames (not lows) hit due to dashing momentum or some such.

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Could be that the only the later active frames (not lows) hit due to dashing momentum or some such.

I tested exactly this, and it worked. As long as you make Lambda whiff the first 3 hits, you can auto-guard the rest of the move.

If you want to try this for yourself, go into training mode and set the Lambda dummy to do 663C, then backdash with Litchi while Lambda is moving forward, then Itsuu. Lambda will whiff the first few hits during the backdash, and Itsuu will guard the rest.

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I tested exactly this, and it worked. As long as you make Lambda whiff the first 3 hits, you can auto-guard the rest of the move.

If you want to try this for yourself, go into training mode and set the Lambda dummy to do 663C, then backdash with Litchi while Lambda is moving forward, then Itsuu. Lambda will whiff the first few hits during the backdash, and Itsuu will guard the rest.

o_o hot damn this is sexii. you think you can show it on video woz???

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I wonder if you guys would be able to put it to more use than the Haku players did when they found out that they could 6D the last 5 hits of 3C.

Edited by toanenadiz

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I tested exactly this, and it worked. As long as you make Lambda whiff the first 3 hits, you can auto-guard the rest of the move.

If you want to try this for yourself, go into training mode and set the Lambda dummy to do 663C, then backdash with Litchi while Lambda is moving forward, then Itsuu. Lambda will whiff the first few hits during the backdash, and Itsuu will guard the rest.

Ha, looks like there is a way! I stand corrected.

But what about mightfo's situation? He didn't say he back dashed or anything, unless he did without realizing it.

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Ha, looks like there is a way! I stand corrected.

But what about mightfo's situation? He didn't say he back dashed or anything, unless he did without realizing it.

Could always be the minute difference of hitboxes between the later and earlier active frames, they are slightly different.

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Ha, looks like there is a way! I stand corrected.

But what about mightfo's situation? He didn't say he back dashed or anything, unless he did without realizing it.

Lambda's 3C doesn't reach it's max range until near the end of it's active frames. Probably around frame 5 or 6 it would be at max range.

Edited by toanenadiz

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Thanks to everyone for the discussion/information/answers!

Yeah, i did not backdash in those situations. Like cor/toan noted, I think it was being guarded later in the active frames due to the hitbox changing across the active frames, but i might be wrong.

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Thanks to everyone for the discussion/information/answers!

Yeah, i did not backdash in those situations. Like cor/toan noted, I think it was being guarded later in the active frames due to the hitbox changing across the active frames, but i might be wrong.

This is most likely what happened. I would assume you were both moving around and your opponent did 3C at a range where it wouldn't hit until later in the active frames, letting you auto-guard the tip of the move.

o_o hot damn this is sexii. you think you can show it on video woz???

Edited by Urichinan

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Hey is it just me or does CH 3c[M] in CP not have the same effect as EX CH 3c[M]. I've seen 2 videos where the opponent can tech, unless i'm seeing things.

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Hey is it just me or does CH 3c[M] in CP not have the same effect as EX CH 3c[M]. I've seen 2 videos where the opponent can tech, unless i'm seeing things.

Sure they weren't caught trying to barrier jump?

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