[P4AU] News & Gameplay Discussion

[Red]

Does this mean no more Unblockable setup combo from Fire break for Yukiko? Sounds like a huge nerf.

 

Yes. No more for her or Adachi, and S.Yosuke to a point.

[RWA Announcer]

I don't know whether to be sad about that, since that's what made him fun to me, or to just be happy and start drooling over Evil Smile, Gun Shot and Mandala buffs?

[Red]

I don't know whether to be sad about that, since that's what made him fun to me, or to just be happy and start drooling over Evil Smile, Gun Shot and Mandala buffs?

 

To be fair spin state reset has always been dumb to begin with. I don't really care that much about Evil Smile since I barely use it and Mandala buffs have yet to be fully explained. Rage should still be in but a few moves could get changed.

 

Adachi could potentially get Freeze and Charm (I dunno about you but I can pretty well Imagine full 5C stomp being a freeze after the final hit)

 

And we haven't even talked about how mad can he get in pressure now if Gunshot>Stance becomes an actual thing.

 

Overall I think the system got a lot of quality of life improvements (They might have gone a bit overboard with Shadow Buffing) so I'm happy overall

 

Biggest issue for me is not being able to burst Shadow's attacks. I guess I'll have to manage my burst properly with them now.

[Speakeasy]

I want to hold myself back, I really, really do, but some of these changes have me all hot and bothered. Not that Margaret needed it by any means, but I'm in love with the idea of a delayable sweep. It won't be quite as useful as Rise's scan delays for free ins since you can't run in with the threat of sweep keeping them from pressing buttons, but I can see it being useful in some situations. Armor on God Hand until the startup will also be fun. I wouldn't be surprised if she's one of the ones that benefits the most from the "unbreakable persona until the attack starts during C attacks" change, whatever that is. Confusion change makes it sound a bit meaningless to put people in it, though.

[Zombiepatrol7]

Because the only time you even SEE AOA is on netplay in sub-optimal connections?  Arcsys probably wants them to be actually viable in an offline environment.

 

Also, stop relying on audio cues for stuff, you're not always gonna get to hear them.  

I was just listing every way someone would react to it, and people do use audio cues(I don't.)

 

As someone said earlier, they were dealt with offline easily with throws and just blocking them. So they're not going to be faster to make them more difficult to react to, they're going to make them more safe on block. How safe are we talking here? Wouldn't it still be just as easy to punish safer AOA offline because the problem is people reacting to the start up? I'm having a really hard time explaining what I mean, can't find the exact words.

 

Do they not want super heavy punishes for a blocked AOA? Is it going to be like 5A/2A punishes only?

 

Thanks for the reply.

 

 

And we haven't even talked about how mad can he get in pressure now if Gunshot>Stance becomes an actual thing.

 

This is just foul and I love it.

[Justice7541]

Can someone explain why AOA being safer is good thing? When it's an armored overhead that can launch, and some characters' AOAs are 26 frames with no unique sound effects + their sprites can be often obscured by other effects? When sometimes the launch( )/blowback>combo afterward is so strong that CH.5C/B or something > AOA is an optimal punish? Hell, expect to see MORE of them now that everybody and their dog can finally consistently "mash" the hits for D followup FC.

 

Okay, so people were used to it offline and can react accordingly. So what? They're not making faster, so are they literally going to make it like -5 on block or something? Are they going to improve the netcode along with this too so online doesn't suffer the fate of a thousand troglodytes mashing AOA because the netcode makes it safe?

 

Someone please educate me because this must be blind. I'm not trying to be rude or sarcastic or anything like that, I just don't understand.

 

if Arcsys cared about netplay balance Kanji players would be blocked from skipping prefight intros.  But they're not, because Arcsys doesn't give a shit.

[ariveradachi]

.Ken's mediarama and liz diarahan have hitboxes what does what mean I'm dumb please explain

[Red]

.Ken's mediarama and liz diarahan have hitboxes what does what mean I'm dumb please explain

 

I dunno if this is the right explanation but It basically means that they hit. Think of SB Aki's Thunder Fists.

 

So Mediarama now hits.

[SoWL]

I don't see anyone using confusion that often, but it seems there's even less reason to use it now. I mean, the first thing I thought of when seeing it is self-crossups as it ends, but now it, uhh, messes with their combo input? And that's it? Okay then.

[S.D.]

 

 

S-Hold change is negligible since nobody uses it anyway.

Uh, Akihiko players use it, it's kinda important since S-Hold Killrush is invulnerable, unlike the normal one so it's a good way to get in and punish blockstrings that aren't tight.

[Elochai]

The change to S-Hold is actually kinda disappointing to me because now I'll actually have to input issen after cross slash .

I'm glad that holding a button is sufficient for getting AoA hits. This remedies the increase to the # of required hits to score a fatal imo.

The Liz buffs just seem like quality of life stuff, which is okay. I'm actually curious about Minazuki's D Fantasy Fog becoming a strike move. Does that mean it's no longer a counter?

[Doobylover]

.Ken's mediarama and liz diarahan have hitboxes what does what mean I'm dumb please explain

 

It's now like Yukiko's Dia, except Yukiko's made sense in the fact that it was her DP and would have been pretty crappy had it have no hitbox. If Ken's disjointed zoning pissed any of you guys off before ohoho, just wait til' January~

[TheHitmarkersPro]

It's now like Yukiko's Dia, except Yukiko's made sense in the fact that it was her DP and would have been pretty crappy had it have no hitbox. If Ken's disjointed zoning pissed any of you guys off before ohoho, just wait til' January~

Stop, you're making me cry 

[RWA Announcer]

I assumed that just meant our red-haired messiah could now combo into the safest version of his counter, which, combined with harder to punish AOAs. would make his darkness mixups even nastier than they already are.  The Liz doesn't seem like much, but I'll take whatever they want to give us at this point.  As for Adachi, I'm certainly thrilled about the Gunshot into Stance shenanigans, and I'd thought about him getting Charm, but didn't want get to hype for that until it was fully explained, so I wouldn't set myself up for disappointment later.  This may be an unpopular opinion, and I DO play Shadow Naoto more than her original nowadays, but I'd rather be a little crazy and get actual decent usage by people than to be gimped and mostly ignored like they are now.  But then again, I'm a giant lover of all things Setplay too, and I know that doesn't always float everyone's boat, so to each their own.  Things looks pretty nice overall, I just wonder how much more's still left to unveil behind the curtain?

[Narroo]

So, the new Shadow Burst systems sounds like what I thought it might be: It's sounding like it works similar to Tsubaki's Mugen, judging by the "SP Usage during Shadow Frenzy has been adjusted."  A little disappointing since it still will restrict Shadow SP usage a bit, but some shadows might be able to ToD at less than 100 meter.  So, unless Shadow Chie's SP skills kill her Frenzy mode, she's going to be a massive pain in the rear. (I got 30 Meter, a burst, and a hit confirm, you can die now!)

 

As for Sho:

SHO:

- You can now follow Dodge action with an attack (C or D button)

- Soaring Fang is now usable in midair

- Height of each Survival Knife has been adjusted, low knife is now actually a low attack

 

 

That first change is great!  Dodge was always problematic because you couldn't follow up a successful dodge.  You could dodge a heavy attack and still get punished in many cases; dodging was mainly for DP baits during his Rekka or to interrupt pressure chains that heavily relied on "on-block" cancels, such as Sho's own rekka which was still risky to dodge.  You could dodge a few projectiles as well, but not many.

 

Now Sho's dodges can actually be used to punish! I hope!  God save the Queen.

 

As for the other changes:  Soaring Fang may improve his combo potential a bit; His AoA launcher will probably get a few more points of damage and stability, and he might be able to do Soaring Fang A -> JC -> Soaring Fang J.A -> Falling Fang (I think?) and get a nice boost.  I expect certain combos to get a stability and damage boost.

 

Survival Knife's changes may be nice; the height could be a bit wonky on those and wiff often; having the low knife hit low is neat, but he can't really convert  that into a combo realistically, unless he guesses his opponent won't block and preemptively uses Moon Barrage. 

 

Neither of these changes really addresses his problems.  He has terrible neutral at full screen where even Kanji can zone him a bit.  His Oki and pressure is very unsafe with the way Reversals work in this game and his anti-air game is terrible and unstable; certain ground moves tend to end a combo immediately if the opponent jumped, and his one true non-SP anti air will one of them if the spacing and height isn't perfect.

 

 

Of course, this is a loke test, so we'll wait and see.  What I'm hoping is that Combat Knife eventually turns into a Sonic Boom or Kagura Oki Orb so he can have Oki after knock down.  That, and he needs ways to get in "safely," such as some projectile invincibility on his high speed movement (It is not a teleport, you can get hit at all times) and longer invincibility on SP Movement (He needs his SP to deal extra damage, extend pressure, and do good mixups, so it'll be a trade off.)  Finally, I want his air game to be tightened up.  I was his aerial combos to be a bit more stable, and for him to not knock people down if he accidentally hits with 5B(2). I'd like 2B(1,2) to auto-correct so it can reliably be combo-ed into his sweep.

 

If I got everything I've ever wished for, I'd like him to be able to make his DP safe with meter, like a lot of character (Yu Narukami!) can do.  That, and a buff to his AoA so that everyone else's pseudo reversal AoA's don't infuriate you while your AoA's start up can actually be punished on reaction.  (Really, everyone else's AoA should work like Sho's).

[Balguna]

Panic seems pretty useless now.

 

Shadow Frenzies are going to be able to used less often, which is cool, and there's going to be a lot of experimentation now that they're all Burst safe.

 

Feels like S.Yukiko is going to be better than normal Yukiko with the loss of the Maragi unblockable combo.

 

The other most interesting change is the push back of the SP boost from autocombo until the skill. This means a lot of characters' SP gain will be reduced unless they go into a potentially lackluster finisher.

 

And those Labrys changes. Her DP is no longer going to be Bad!

[A.X.I.S.]

- Vile Assault has faster start-up, decreased recovery

- Mediarama now has a hitbox and it hits the opponent

- Now you need to hold D to have Koromaru exit from the screen

- Koromaru now executes his attacks when you release the C-button (Doesn't work with Skills)

 

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

GET WRECKED!

[Angry Guy of DE]

Hm...Asterius has better endurance.  I wonder what the number was increased to since he really only shrugged off A moves and multi-hitting moves, that can help force respecting him instead of just a free 5B or 5C to hit him when he does anything.

Buffalo Hammer getting faster seems nice if it helps with strings since compared to the rest of the cast Slab's normals on block and start-up can get DP'd or supered because of start-up.

Hammer's Upper is now 2C in this game, just a small note.  The flames and the upper had their inputs switched.  Anyway, faster startup can help with catching people trying to set-up something full screen which on CH is a juicy punish.

Chain-Knuckle with faster start-up and recovery is a welcome change.  That move is not really reliable since its just isn't even worth using at the end of strings since it can be reversal'd without Asterius already keeping them in block strings.

So where's Shadow Shadow Labrys?  I want my multiple Brutal impact loops.

[Sashi]

- When you counter opponent's move with Axe Slash its start-up will be faster, it's also harder to punish on block

 

Is this the end to '2AAAA "Oh, she's doing a dp." 5B+D'?!

[WintersWhite]

It's now like Yukiko's Dia, except Yukiko's made sense in the fact that it was her DP and would have been pretty crappy had it have no hitbox. If Ken's disjointed zoning pissed any of you guys off before ohoho, just wait til' January~

 

"Come, this will be fun Koromaru"

I'm perfectly okay with this, but that's just because I main Ken and I want to annoy people who hated him in the RPG games. :p

 

As an Elizabeth subber, I'm pretty happy with her buffs! The Governor of Power needs to be in her rightful position! I'm also digging the AoA change of holding the button instead of mashing it. I'm slow, so this will really help me.

[CommieCanuck]

Now Sho's dodges can actually be used to punish! I hope!  God save the Queen.

Loving this aswell. Giving it more utility/purpose outside of feeling like "tacked on" button feels nice.

I've personally found it fun for predictable aoa's

 

Of course, this is a loke test, so we'll wait and see.  What I'm hoping is that Combat Knife eventually turns into a Sonic Boom or Kagura Oki Orb so he can have Oki after knock down.  That, and he needs ways to get in "safely," such as some projectile invincibility on his high speed movement (It is not a teleport, you can get hit at all times) and longer invincibility on SP Movement (He needs his SP to deal extra damage, extend pressure, and do good mixups, so it'll be a trade off.)  

This I'm gonna have to disagree with though at least for the survival knife bit. I personally like knives the way they are now, I think his mixup and good normals more than compensates for no knife oki. I don't like the thought of having to rely on them as much as opposed to just having them as another tool in the bag for lack of a better word. I think the lower knife hitting low is a cool addition as well, don't think its going to lead to any crazy setups but its a welcomed addition. While I don't think he should be the same terror that minazuki is at full screen neutral(I think this is good in what sets the characters apart, if the opponent managed to "unstick" you I think they deserve some breathing room I don't think he needs apex neutral) I would kill for atleast gaurdpoint of projectile invuln on highspeed movement. Its a real pain in the ass during certain matchups because on the ground atleast you're better off using evade rather than risking the Highspeed movement but then it doesn't cover the same distance that the special does. Apart from Air Version and SB arguably it feels relatively useless outside of when you already have someone locked down,and you already have other mix up/cross up tools aswell so it feels like its not reaching it's full potential, So yeah I think some projectile invuln on nomal HSM would be nice. He's already a fairly solid character though so I don't think I'd be too heart broken if they didn't anyways, its tough but he still seem to make ends meet even in this version.

But yeah its just a location test so time will tell I guess.Curious to see his as well as the rest of the casts nerf list. Don't know how I feel about shadow changes, but it's always nice to see Da Man and Labrys get some buffs.Looking forward to those aigis nerfs aswell.

[Angry Guy of DE]

Give Sho's knife the ability of Kagura's orb oki?

Not going to happen.  The knives are already able to cover his approach and unlike Kagura Sho has way better normal and speed.

Kagura lost the Hard Knockdown oki set-ups

Shadow Labrys lost her meterless command grab set-ups midscreen.

Both of these characters had oki but poor neutral.  Easy rush down and oki to continue easy rushdown is obnoxious.

[Luminos564]

Seems like they once again only list the buffs... Can't wait what kind of nerfs JP players will find tomorrow... 

Anyways, here's the system stuff translated... Character specifics are coming soon...  All done!

 

Shadow:

- Burst gauge added, Reversal Burst is usable

- Attack power increased

- HP amounts has been individually changed

- SP gain amount has been adjusted

 

Shadow Frenzy

- Only usable when Burst gauge is charged (Usable even if you don't have full SP gauge)

- Unburstable

- Adjusted the amount of SP moves use during the Frenzy

- Activating Frenzy with max SP recovers Persona cards

 

All-out Attack

- You can hold the button to do the All-out Rush

- Harder to punish on block

 

Auto Combo

- You have to use Auto Combo until Skill-move comes out in order to receive the "Bonus".

 

Some Persona-attacks

- In most of the C-moves, Persona is invincible during the start-up of the move (Until they actually appear on the screen)

 

First of all, thank you Sourenga.

 

Sheesh, I had to take a break due to my job and wouldn't you know it, right when I get some free time I get to see the NA GGXrd Limited Edition and now THIS. I love life sometimes. I'm actually really happy that Shadow-types are getting potential boosts. It's not a very fun game where you have all these versions of characters, yet they're all so underplayed. I don't particularly want to play them (most of the characters I like don't have Shadow-type anyway) but it is nice to have more variety and have it viable in the long run.

 

Also happy that the AoA attacks are getting an upgrade. I like using them so this is a plus for someone like me.

 

That said what is that "Bonus" thing in the auto-combo mean? And if I am understanding this proper, the Persona C attacks being invincible on start-up means that say for example when starts using 5C (the animation where he quickly crushes the card) those frames are invulnerable until Izanagi appears to do his slash?

 

MARGARET:

- In "God Hand" Persona is invincible until the start-up

- During "Mediarahan" Margaret can take attacks from the opponent, increased HP-recovery when taken hits

- You can now delay his Sweep by holding the button

 

Neato. Been feeling like taking up Margaret for a while at least to sub so this is relevant to my interests.

 

MINAZUKI:

- C & SB Dream Fog now causes super flash when the move is successful. D-version is now a strike move

- Recovery of his D-moves has been decreased, Charged versions are now a little safer

- Destructive Fang is now safer on block

 

Ooooh there's possibilities with this. It's hard enough to catch someone with Dream Fog so it is pretty difficult to make the most of its benefits. Glad that D-version allows it to potentially be combo'd into. I can already see how dirty this can be. D moves lower recovery is very welcome considering how most of the time I am stuck using j2D to fish for some hits and not relying on anything like 5D, 2D and jD. And woot, Destructive Fang is now safer. Very very happy with this, even if the unknown nerfs loom over.

 

ELIZABETH:

- Mabufudyne has faster recovery, A-version is now Super cancelable

- Mahamaon has faster start-up and can KO only under specific conditions

- Diarahan now has a hitbox and hits the opponent

 

Oh Lizzie. Mabufudyne (A) Super Cancel is at least something. I am hoping that Mahamaon conditional K.O means that we get one of 2 things here:

 

1. That is a regular damaging super and only does the overkill damage if it were going to kill the opponent anyway (like Order-Sol Dragon Install Sekkai).

2. If Mahamaon is still K.O but requires specific set-ups, then perhaps Mamudoon will finally be something of a useful alternative. I hate how so many of Lizzie's moves are just not worth using most of the time.

 

Diarahan having a hitbox MIGHT make it a good reversal in Awakening. Just a thought/wish. But I'll rein in my expectations since I got pretty bummed out the last time I saw Lizzie's changes.

 

All in all, call me excited for this. It's nice to see ASW not willing to let P4 Arena die out simply because Xrd is on the horizon.

[Justice7541]

 

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

GET WRECKED!

 

 

Ken's DP gonna be mad dumb if they don't also adjust its on-hit properties.

 

They probably will though, but lol.

[D.R.F.]

Shadow frenzy reminds me of OD