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LunaKage

[CP] Noel Vermillion - Q&A Thread

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Yep.

 

Ground hit Drive Starter > d.5A > d.6B > d.5C > d.6C > Astral

Normal Combo Route into > j.D > d.6B > d.6C > d.2D > d.6B > 22C~66 > 6C > Astral

Normal Combo Route into > j.D > d.6B > d.5C > d.6B > 22C~66 > 6C > Astral

665B > 6A > 6C > Astral

 

Just to name a few key ones.

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Is there any good ways to confirm into 6A?  I've been trying to do it via 5B > 2B > 6A or 5C.  Still not getting it down.

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you can do the following to help learn the different ways to go into 6A:

 

5A / 2A > 2B > 6A

 

5A / 2A > 5B > 2B > 6A

 

5A / 2A > 2B > 5B > 6A

 

5A > 5B > 6A

 

5B > 6A

 

2B > 6A

 

2B > 5B > 6A

 

5B > 2B > 6A

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On many characters you can also launch grounded opponents with 6A and a gatling into 5B will hit them as they go up, making 6A much less of a commitment. A string as simple as 2B 6A 5B can be done on autopilot and hitconfirmed with no effort whatsoever into sj.C j.D combo, and if it's blocked from 5B you still have most of your pressure/mixup tools left. If find this to be especially useful in situations where a kinda meaty 2B is the most you'll get, like after a midscreen 22B dash up crossunder their neutral tech, or the midscreen "fake combo drop" d.6B 214D where you end up with a bit of frame advantage over people who instinctively tech and mash.

 

I didn't test this extensively though, from recent memory I know it whiffs on Bang but hits a few other characters.

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Ah, I feel silly for my previous post now when the posts before mine went over it.

How do I go about dealing with an Azrael player?

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On many characters you can also launch grounded opponents with 6A and a gatling into 5B will hit them as they go up, making 6A much less of a commitment. A string as simple as 2B 6A 5B can be done on autopilot and hitconfirmed with no effort whatsoever into sj.C j.D combo, and if it's blocked from 5B you still have most of your pressure/mixup tools left. If find this to be especially useful in situations where a kinda meaty 2B is the most you'll get, like after a midscreen 22B dash up crossunder their neutral tech, or the midscreen "fake combo drop" d.6B 214D where you end up with a bit of frame advantage over people who instinctively tech and mash.

 

I didn't test this extensively though, from recent memory I know it whiffs on Bang but hits a few other characters.

 

Should I expect myself to get blown up if the 5B is insta-blocked though? I'm quite new to the CP scene, and her normals look a lot more pathetic now. Not sure what's airtight and what's not.

 

Also, back in my "cuddle in corner and watch CP loketest" days, I saw people dash cancel 22B oki into crossups or whatnot. At least, that's what I think I saw. But after checking the data, it seems this has no longer been possible for awhile. What exactly does the "oki" part of our 22B oki look like now?

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22B oki is very versatile actually, in both setup and execution, leading for numerous ways to keep our opponents guessing. Here are a few of my favorites:

 

Corner 22MAX > 662B

Will catch all rolls and no tech/late tech if done correctly, if your opponent neutral techs you have frame advantage leading to:

 

Corner 22MAX > 662B(Whiff)

At this point you can either Grab, or use j.D for a throw bait, remember that a CH j.D can lead into a Muzzle Filter combo, and deal a whole lot of damage, especially in the corner. Also since you have frame advantage you can hit a 5A to catch your opponent from mashing or jumping, a 2B will accomplish the same thing, but will hit low, and will net you a bigger reward for catching people trying to mash or jump. You can 4D most reversals in the game except for Growler and Tager's command grabs, to beat growler simply backdash and punish his recovery, and you can use either j.D, 2D or a simple jump to bait Tager's command grabs.

 

Corner 22 > 5D > d.5A

beats all rolls, and late techs, and beats some character's no teching, leading into a combo back into oki. For a mixup go into either d.6B or d.6D, to bait most DPs you can use d.4D, which will beat DPs off the ground into d.2D > d.6B > 236D > combo, or will beat grounded DPs like Jin's 623C into d.6C > 214A for huge damage, also beats most supers. For Growler simply allow the d.5A to recover and then punish, for Tager's command grabs use d.2D > d.6C > 214A for huge damage on CH. Baiting Makoto's DP is slightly difficult since it soars over d.4D, but you can beat it by whiffing d.4D and following up with a LATE d.2D > d.6C > 214A > 5B > 5C > sj.C > j.D > d.2D > d.6B > d.5C > d.6B > 236D > 6C(2) > 6B > 22 to reset back into oki.

 

Corner 22 > 5D > d.6A

this one will allow the d.6A to hit meaty, which will beat all attempts at poking out or jumping out.

 

Corner 22B > Delay 2C

This catches all rolls if done right, and also catches no techs and late techs, this one is a little harder to do than 2B version, but gets you more damage on successful punishes, so choose whichever one is more comfortable for you.

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Jesus, guys, why is the hit stop for 22C so short and why is the window for 3C 22C so tight. I'm like, "Hey, I played her a few years ago in CT. Let's pick her up again!" Meanwhile, I'm just grinding this one thing for like 5 hours. I remember it used to be like, "Yes! He's crouching!" Now it's, "Please, please, please, please..."

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In CP various characters have certain things that got changed to be tighter in execution for no reason imo. in the new patch to come soon the hitstop on 22C is increased alot so following up after a 22C will be alot easier. however the issue of transitioning from a 3C to a 22C will still be there so its best to practice that consistently until it sticks to your execution.

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Should I expect myself to get blown up if the 5B is insta-blocked though? I'm quite new to the CP scene, and her normals look a lot more pathetic now. Not sure what's airtight and what's not.

 

The point of 5B is not to end on that normal, but rather the fact that you can cancel into everything from there. If you're looking for airtight safe stuff, ending in 2B or 2C is safe but won't accomplish much seeing how much pushback you generate and how Noel's stagger pressure is kinda bad these days. If the opponent blocks 2B 6A 5B, that was the safe part but now it's over and you need to commit to something. Trying to get out of a blockstring safely this early on goes against what Noel is supposed to do which is work hard and make the guy block so you can do drive strings that lose to some things, but beat other things and offer good combo and knockdown conversion.

 

What I'm trying to say is, most of the time if you're getting blown up for something with Noel during your pressure, well good news is you probably had an option that beats what the other guy did, cleanly, and now you can try that next time.

 

 

Jesus, guys, why is the hit stop for 22C so short and why is the window for 3C 22C so tight. I'm like, "Hey, I played her a few years ago in CT. Let's pick her up again!" Meanwhile, I'm just grinding this one thing for like 5 hours. I remember it used to be like, "Yes! He's crouching!" Now it's, "Please, please, please, please..."

 

I feel exactly the same way. 22C is one of those things that's getting buffed (hitstop goes from 0f to 6f from what I read), so there's that. However I don't think there's any change to the 3C 22C window, which is a shame because I am really bad at it and I think it's really stupid (because I'm really bad at it).

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Yeah, so I just remembered that I can hold a button down. So there's that.

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The window for 3C > 22C is really tight, but it's not hard. I didn't really practice it much and my success rate is about 95%

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we talking about online Luna...i think thats the real problem behind it for these guys. so they will have a harder time due to that alone. offline is an entirely different stoy imo since its easier that way but then again it is tight in general.

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Nah, it's offline. I just forgot that I could hold a button down. It's pretty free now. There should be a guide on buffer tricks so I can be more lazy with my execution.

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I'd write one, but I don't use them, so I wouldn't even know where to begin lol

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I was trying to practice some 22b oki... and I set the dummy to roll backwards in mid screen.  I can't seem to punish the roll with dash 2b at all after the 22b (hit once); did it like maybe 2 out 10 tries.  Dummy seems to tech and roll way too fast for me to dash after it with a 2b.  Is there any easy way to do this or should I just give up on oki midscreen with her?

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you have to practice the run up 2B part in general it may also depend on how youre ending the combo into a 22B midscreen as the distance the 22B grounds your opponent can be manipulated depending on the last drive you used although mostly all of them end the same distance. i could give a helping demonstration online if you want a visual in a room real quick i can help with other questions if you have any online.

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well I'm practicing with this basic mid screen combo

  • (j.B/j.C) > (5B/2B) > 6A > sj.C > j.D > (d.6B) > d.6C > d.2D > d.6B > 22C~66 > 6C > 6B > 4D > d.2D > d.5C > (d.5A) > 22B (2.7k-3.3k, 19%-23%

I did try again tthis time by taking out the d.5A at the end and that seems to make things easier, but I'm still too late with my 2b afterwards.

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you have to run a little bit longer to catch them roll teching. if youre trying to catch them as soon as they roll tech then 2B will whiff because of invul frames of the tech. So you have to 2B after the white flash of the tech. if you time this right you should hit them which requires you to kinda chase them slightly longer for 2b to connect if you get the idea. in short delay the timing of the 2B as you run for the follow up and you should catch them.

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I'm still finding this quite hard.  If I dash for too long, the dummy will block and if I try to 2b too fast, it's too short.  The window for the hit to connect seems tight for me at the moment.  Will need to practice this a lot.

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yeah just practice on it bro. its not that hard actually once you know the timing to hit 2B. again if you need me to come in a room to help you if you like im free just ask.

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