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Kiba

[CP] Tsubaki vs Terumi

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Terumi in my opinion as semi-difficult match for Tsubaki. I advise starting the match by staying on the ground and reacting to whatever your opponent throws at you. Most are keen to spamming air 2D (I think that's the command), where he slams you to the ground and has more leverage to pressure you. The fact that Terumi's BnB's not only usually do around 3k but can get heat quickly is reason enough to punish him into the corner as soon as possible. By doing so, you're in control of the match flow. You never want to be put in a position wher Terumi is pressuring you, especially if he has 50 heat. Overall, all I can really say is punish where needed and stop him from gaining too much heat.

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Honestly I thought this was one of Tsubaki's easier matchups.

You can charge in this matchup but it'll have to be in short bursts because Terumi's mobility is really good. If he's jumping around like a clown and doing j.2D there's usually nothing you can do about it. If you try to AA it he may just get CH. When I'm under pressure I usually don't have to worry. The only thing I look out are the throws (which btw has really small range), because the command grab is kinda slow, he doesn't have any overheads apart from his super (which he would only be using in combos), and he can do overhead stuff from 5C (it's a leaping heel kick that hits twice) so you should be blocking high everytime he does 5C since he has no low followup options.

If you have him on the defense, abuse it. He can't do much without meter and his counter loses to throws I believe. Also his 6C? I think (a short range kick) is +4 on block so please don't be fooled into thinking it's unsafe. You can't even outpoke him on IB.

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Honestly I thought this was one of Tsubaki's easier matchups.

You can charge in this matchup but it'll have to be in short bursts because Terumi's mobility is really good. If he's jumping around like a clown and doing j.2D there's usually nothing you can do about it. If you try to AA it he may just get CH. When I'm under pressure I usually don't have to worry. The only thing I look out are the throws (which btw has really small range), because the command grab is kinda slow, he doesn't have any overheads apart from his super (which he would only be using in combos), and he can do overhead stuff from 5C (it's a leaping heel kick that hits twice) so you should be blocking high everytime he does 5C since he has no low followup options.

If you have him on the defense, abuse it. He can't do much without meter and his counter loses to throws I believe. Also his 6C? I think (a short range kick) is +4 on block so please don't be fooled into thinking it's unsafe. You can't even outpoke him on IB.

The sliding spinkick is 6B. 6C is the three running slashes. Also a few corrections:

1) TK j.2D is a very fast albeit highly telegraphed overhead. I think it's 19-20 frames (14 + jump startup). It's a very short starter so he won't get huge damage off it but he can always burn some meter for free damage or just go for meter build + oki. Note that 5A, 5C(1), and 2C are his only jump-cancelable moves so you can try to predict it and mash it out with 5A or 5B, but be careful since he can also go low off 2C with 3C and if you are mashing he will frametrap you for 5k+. At the same time don't let him get too happy with the j.2D spam since it's +infinity on block and he will just keep doing it forever and building meter in the process.

2) 6B is +4 on block and invul to lows but you can easily mash it out with standing moves. It's pretty obvious animation-wise since he doesn't have anything else with a long delay that involves a slide, so just mash if you see him suddenly shift forward mid-blockstring. He can technically frametrap you with 6C mash so if you autopilot too much he may start doing that. It's unsafe and can't be comboed without meter though so he's not too likely to do it.

3) If he has meter to burn and is running blockstrings liberally on you, you need to get out ASAP. CA, burst, whatever. Terumi has an absurdly fast high/low off 5C RC (10f overhead versus 9f low) which you do not want to give him the opportunity to run on you multiple times. If he does land it you will likely eat 3k, he will build the meter spent back, and just keep doing it till you die.

4) Terumi is the god of troll resets. Honestly I could list all his bullshit resets that lead to one-touch-death shenanigans but that'd take forever. IMO you're better off just watching your opponent to see which resets he likes to do or just don't tech when in doubt. In general if you see him doing an SMP move twice he is likely going for a reset, get ready to block that shit.

5) Terumi runs around like an asshole at fullscreen, will zone you out at midscreen with drives, and is pure death at very close range since his normals are basically all +infinity on block with super fast startups and great hitboxes. Fortunately that means he's not fantastic between close and medium range which is where your 5B and 2B can easily reach him. Spacing is important, if the opponent doesn't know how to space Terumi can basically do whatever he wants and that's not too much fun.

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Is there anything we can do to stop him from running around in neutral and spamming j.5D? It's pretty annoying how safe it is.

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I try to air grab, but that doesn't always work unless you time it perfectly because of how great a hitbox it has. You have to get him in the startup because the AA will never ever hit him.

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You pretty much have to respect jD. I suppose if they are just going totally crazy with it you could AA them with DP. But Terumi doesn't really get anything off it unless it's a CH and air hit if I'm not mistaken. He also can't really go in and pressure you after it if you block it from far away.

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Just recently had a lot of trouble against a Terumi that would continually do never ending 5Ds and microdashes at absolute perfect spacing in the corner. No rushdown or mixup, just 5Ds until I reacted in some way other than blocking.

 

What can you do against this? 5B whiffs. DP whiffs. Reversal super whiffs. Blade super gets punished. Any attempt at running/dashing forward will get punished with either more 5D if you waited too long or one of his normals with a faster startup before you can pull up barrier to protect your advance. I just sat there, took it, and watched as his heat gauge went up by 7% for each hit I blocked.

 

I tried instant guarding the 5Ds but that just did not work because he ends up way too far to punish with anything. Also using barrier just makes him stronger and harder to punish. They must have really buffed 5D in 1.1 because I have never experienced this kind of corner pressure before.

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Instant airdash or superjumping over it? His 5d is not exactly plus on block (-3 on block according to the wiki). Although you might eat a 6a for trying to instant airdash towards him

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See -3 is pretty advantageous for how far away he is left after you block it in the corner, how fast it starts up, and how monstrous its horizontal range is.

Just as you said I would eat a standing 6A if I IAD'd and if I just jumped I would either eat a dashing 6A or get pushed back into the corner if I did air barrier which just starts up the 5D hell all over again.

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It was buffed in 1.1

 

http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=BlazBlue:_Chrono_Phantasma_1.10_patch_notes#Terumi

 

  • 5D: Active frames increased 3F -> 4F. Recovery decreased 23F -> 18F. The closer edge of the hitbox is now taller. Attack level increased 3 -> 4. Frame advantage on block improved -9F -> -3F. Hit stop decreased to 11F -> 9F. P2 improved 74% -> 80%. Other level-related changes apply.

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I guess I'll fix that on the Wiki. :P

 

That said, I don't really see the problem here.  If it's -3 and he's a ways away, just do a short dash 5B.  5B starts up faster than his 5D, and he's at frame disadvantage, so you can dash for 5 whole frames and still hit him out of startup of his next 5D if he does it again.  Theoretically he could react to this with a 5A if he's fast enough, but if he's already trying to dash in it's not going to work out for him.

 

Shouldn't be a problem to just superjump > Airdash out though.  This basically boils down to choice of either dash normal or jumpout.

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jump beats most of his options are a 5d except for his little charge move. and if you IB that, you can punish with 5a. i usually get a couple 5a punishes of that every match. when you have him realizing he can be punished for that jumping or doing anything else is a bit easier.

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The problem is that he can gatling straight into 236D which is a deterrent from me trying to go for the IB punish because I will get frame trapped. His 236D gatling will also catch you if you try to super jump out and it forces you to barrier because it is air unblockable. This further pushes me back into the corner.

 

The Terumi that takes advantage of this corner zoning ability challenged me again today a few times. I tried IB super jump, but nope, I got caught by 236D and pushed back because I was barriering. What went through my mind at this moment is, "Oh yeah 236D is actually punishable on block" so I tried to go for a j.A in an attempt to tag him, but then he went straight into his stomping super which just so happens to have two versions that look exactly the same. The j.A whiffed and I landed and had to guess and I guessed wrong.

 

Apparently the version of this super that hits low will whiff if you air barrier 236D, but I didn't know that at the time. If I had not attempted to jump out, I would have had to face a real 50/50 mixup out of superflash. Being in the corner with him is incredibly scary when he plays it safe.

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you can't beat his stuff 100% of the time. if you guess that he is going to do 236d, you IB it and punish and get out. If you guess he's going to do something else, you might get hit by it. he doesn't actually have a ton of options here, you can play safely by trying to IB 236D if it comes out, and if it does, you get a punish. if he doesn't do 236d you can jump out and probably get in or punish most of the rest. the odds are not really in his favor if you block a 5d.

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Started to test out how effective being patient in this matchup is and I realize now that it isn't a good idea. He gets so much heat off of you just blocking is ridiculous. I need to start learning to instant block everything because his +2 on block 8f startup 5B is starting to irritate me.

 

I just found out today that he can vaporize your projectiles with his j.D and 5D. I don't know why it took me this long to realize it. Also something that has been happening quite is often Terumi's 236D not Hell's Fang hitting me out of 3C without trading and at least giving me the fatal. I don't know if it actually consistently happens or I am just really unlucky, but it is really frustrating when it does.

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Well our 3C has like 10, so I would think it would trade at the least. Hell, our 236C and 236D both have 10 and I FC the hell out of other Tsubakis when I use 3C. It might be the structure of the hitboxes but I think I'm just getting unlucky.

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Yeah; It's a question of hitbox shape.  Trading or not has nothing to do with active frames, really, so long as both moves are active at once, and everything to do with whose hitbox makes contact with whose hurtbox when.

 

That said, I think in this case you are just getting unlucky, but maybe there's some weird interaction we don't know about.

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