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Kiba

[CP1.1] Valkenhayn Q&A Thread

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Also kiba I believe Bang's overhead only hits at fastest speed against airbourne or standing opponents, against crouchers (so in overhead situations) I think it's 23?

an interesting thing on that, since you can't crouch instantly from a jump (fuzzy), if you time it properly it will overhead on the 18th frame or whatever. basically it is the situation where you bring someone down to the ground with jumping attacks, land before them, and overhead. Not sure how many frames it takes to go to crouching from landing.

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I think overall, wj.C is an option to keep in mind. I don't think it's a substitute for brj. A though.

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an interesting thing on that, since you can't crouch instantly from a jump (fuzzy), if you time it properly it will overhead on the 18th frame or whatever. basically it is the situation where you bring someone down to the ground with jumping attacks, land before them, and overhead. Not sure how many frames it takes to go to crouching from landing.

After testing this looks correct, I'm not sure how you'd keep someone in blockstun for 18f after landing recovery on your end though.

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Hey guys. I really want to pick up Valkenhayn. I'm new to this game but I'm not new to fighting games.

I was wondering if anyone had any advice on Valkenhayn's Challenge #23? I kan't land the 5D 5B part. I've landed it like twice but I don't understand it.

Do I have to delay the w[j.A] late so that I land fast enough to transform and hit them with 5B? This is the only thing I kan think of and I'm not even sure if it's possible to delay it.

Here's the full kombo with the part I kan't land in Red: w[j.C 5B 5C 6D j.A] 5D 5B 5C j.B dj.B j.C

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No, never delay the w[j.A]. You're probably just not inputting the 5D > 5B fast enough. If you're getting w[5B] instead of h[5B] you're inputting the 5D too quickly.

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No, never delay the w[j.A]. You're probably just not inputting the 5D > 5B fast enough. If you're getting w[5B] instead of h[5B] you're inputting the 5D too quickly.

Thanx.

I wasn't really getting w[5B]. I usually just morph and then my h[5B] goes through their invincibility frames..

When I noticed that the bot kept teching I sped up and that's when I did get w[5B] a few times but very rarely. I tend to notice when I'm going to drop it. I guess it's just practice. As long as there's no special trick that I'm missing then I'm fine with that. I just hate practicing something for hours and then realizing that I was doing it wrong.

So I'm going to practice that, work on the listed BnB's, and practice the "wolf break" as well as other mobility options.

Any advice? Any mobility options in particular I should know about?

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Yeah, then it was just a speed issue. No special trick involved. Just gotta grind it out.

Also, just to clarify, it's actually called the "wolf brake" not the "wolf break" as you're quite literally "braking" during a command dash.

For now, my advice would just be to practice a few BnBs and get a feel for his wolf movement. Running around in wolf mode, w[iAD > j.D > j.D], 4D/7Cing, etc. You may also want to try out some of his really basic yet essential blockstrings such as h[5B > 2B > 3C] and w[5A > 5B > 5C > 6D > j.A > j.C] xN.

As for BnBs, try out these 4 first and then move onto others:

Corner:

-5A > 5B > 5C > 6D > j.A > 5D > h[5B > 236A > 2C > tk.214B > 6C > 3C > 236B]

-5B > 3C > 2A > 2C > 6C > 2C > 6B > 5B > 2C > j.B > dj.B > j.C

Midscreen:

-5A > 5B > 5C > 6D > j.A > 5D > h[5B > 5C > j.A > j.B > dj.B > j.C]

-2A > 2C > 6B > 2B > 5C > 236B~236B

If you have any questions about combo notation feel free to ask, we're pretty friendly around here. Additionally, you may also want to check out the Valkenhayn guide here as it has a lot of good info.

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Also, just to clarify, it's actually called the "wolf brake" not the "wolf break" as you're quite literally "braking" during a command dash.

I got the term from reading the post by "EXonestar" on page 4. Didn't even think about it.. lol. "Break" still kinda makes sense somehow. "Brake" has more reason to it though.

I was just going to kall it kancels.. It sort of reminds me of Kabal's Nomad Dash Kancels in MK. Same Back-Forward motions. With notable differences of kourse.

For now, my advice would just be to practice a few BnBs and get a feel for his wolf movement. Running around in wolf mode, w[iAD > j.D > j.D], 4D/7Cing, etc. You may also want to try out some of his really basic yet essential blockstrings such as h[5B > 2B > 3C] and w[5A > 5B > 5C > 6D > j.A > j.C] xN.

As for BnBs, try out these 4 first and then move onto others:

Corner:

-5A > 5B > 5C > 6D > j.A > 5D > h[5B > 236A > 2C > tk.214B > 6C > 3C > 236B]

-5B > 3C > 2A > 2C > 6C > 2C > 6B > 5B > 2C > j.B > dj.B > j.C

Midscreen:

-5A > 5B > 5C > 6D > j.A > 5D > h[5B > 5C > j.A > j.B > dj.B > j.C]

-2A > 2C > 6B > 2B > 5C > 236B~236B

If you have any questions about combo notation feel free to ask, we're pretty friendly around here. Additionally, you may also want to check out the Valkenhayn guide here as it has a lot of good info.

Thanx. All this helps a lot. It's great to have a starting point like this. Otherwise, I tend to get so obsessed on one aspect that I neglect all the others and then when I actually go into a match I realize that I am not quite prepared yet.

Oh, and does this kombo reset the damage kounter after 5C?:

-2A > 2C > 6B > 2B > 5C > 236B~236B

They don't seem to be blocking when set to auto-block but the 236B~236B is kounted as a separate two hit kombo.

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Alright, I'm probably gonna move onto my Valkenhayn today, I played with him a bit already and realized that w.5B doesn't launch anymore. So just so I know, any other changes for Valk I should know about.I know he has two new wolf moves for an overhead, but anything else?

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Hey guys, I'm working on picking up Valk. I've found I really like his mobility and his combos are super swag, and I like to rush people down with buttons so :v:

That said, what would be the best place to start for learning what to do with this character in neutral? Outside of just reading the strategy guide, I mean. I'm not yet sure when it's wise to switch back and forth between human and wolf in neutral, or how I should be approaching my game plan.

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Alright, I'm probably gonna move onto my Valkenhayn today, I played with him a bit already and realized that w.5B doesn't launch anymore. So just so I know, any other changes for Valk I should know about.I know he has two new wolf moves for an overhead, but anything else?

Mostly getting used to the fact that anything concerning wolf mode is now linked to D. brJA is now done with 1DCA. I think that's pretty much all.

Hey guys, I'm working on picking up Valk. I've found I really like his mobility and his combos are super swag, and I like to rush people down with buttons so :v:

That said, what would be the best place to start for learning what to do with this character in neutral? Outside of just reading the strategy guide, I mean. I'm not yet sure when it's wise to switch back and forth between human and wolf in neutral, or how I should be approaching my game plan.

The strategy guide contains a part for beginners if you didn't read it yet.

As for his mobility, just go in training and try to fly around. Wolf shenanigans are a pretty good way to get used to it. Here are some stuff you can do though I would strongly suggest you to learn them all:

Wolf leap: in wolf mode, jump>airdash>jD. Important move that makes you leap fullscreen.

Wolf canon: jump>wj236A>XD. You can press 3D to cross-up the opponent or 1D to fake cross-up. You can also do wj236A>2D>wj214A. Allow you to punish people who think that you can easily anti-air Valk.

GTFO brake: in wolf mode: jump>7D>4C. You should be too high for the opponent to catch you so at this point you can either decide to rush the opponent or simply run away.

Cross-up blockstring: w5A>w5B>IAD>XD>wjA. 2D will cross-up, 1D will fake cross-up. You can also decide to land and press w5C for a low or w236C for the command grab.

If you have no troubles doing all of that, you should rather try some new combos.

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I actually go into a match I realize that I am not quite prepared yetOh, and does this kombo reset the damage kounter after 5C?:

-2A > 2C > 6B > 2B > 5C > 236B~236B

They don't seem to be blocking when set to auto-block but the 236B~236B is kounted as a separate two hit kombo.

Oh boy, my apologies. I foolishly typed 2A.

The proper combo is 2B > 2C > 6B > 2B > 5C > 236B~236B. Now everything will combo properly, sorry about that.

That said, what would be the best place to start for learning what to do with this character in neutral? Outside of just reading the strategy guide, I mean. I'm not yet sure when it's wise to switch back and forth between human and wolf in neutral, or how I should be approaching my game plan.

This sort of thing is explained relatively well in strategy guide. But if you'd like visual references I'd highly suggest watching Hima, Zekuso, and Masashi play which is neatly organized in the video thread's first post.

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The strategy guide contains a part for beginners if you didn't read it yet.

As for his mobility, just go in training and try to fly around. Wolf shenanigans are a pretty good way to get used to it. Here are some stuff you can do though I would strongly suggest you to learn them all:

Wolf leap: in wolf mode, jump>airdash>jD. Important move that makes you leap fullscreen.

Wolf canon: jump>wj236A>XD. You can press 3D to cross-up the opponent or 1D to fake cross-up. You can also do wj236A>2D>wj214A. Allow you to punish people who think that you can easily anti-air Valk.

GTFO brake: in wolf mode: jump>7D>4C. You should be too high for the opponent to catch you so at this point you can either decide to rush the opponent or simply run away.

Cross-up blockstring: w5A>w5B>IAD>XD>wjA. 2D will cross-up, 1D will fake cross-up. You can also decide to land and press w5C for a low or w236C for the command grab.

If you have no troubles doing all of that, you should rather try some new combos.

Some of this stuff I'm aware of and able to do, but some of these are new to me. I'll give them a try, thanks! I've also got a few combos down (mostly Human starters), but am currently struggling with the ... 5C > 6D > j.A > 5D > h[5B... route in his new combos.

This sort of thing is explained relatively well in strategy guide. But if you'd like visual references I'd highly suggest watching Hima, Zekuso, and Masashi play which is neatly organized in the video thread's first post.

Thanks, I'll give that a look! I'll confess that reading stuff like this doesn't really click well for me until I can see it in action.

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I have a small question regarding Valk's damage output. It seems that just about all combos in his arsenal hover somewhere around 3k to 3.5k damage. Anything truly damaging requires the sweep loop. Has Valk really been given that hard of a damage nerf? I remember in Extend I could score 3.5 mid screen and open someone up in the corner for 5 to 6k. Is he less about the damage and more about mixup/resets now?

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I have a small question regarding Valk's damage output. It seems that just about all combos in his arsenal hover somewhere around 3k to 3.5k damage. Anything truly damaging requires the sweep loop. Has Valk really been given that hard of a damage nerf? I remember in Extend I could score 3.5 mid screen and open someone up in the corner for 5 to 6k. Is he less about the damage and more about mixup/resets now?

Damage got nerfed globally outside of OD.

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His average damage output in CP ranges somewhere between 1.7-3.5K.

There were universal meter/damage nerfs (for the most part). And yes, Valkenhayn especially received a very hard damage nerf. But I wouldn't worry too much about that, because while he doesn't deal a monstrous amount of damage anymore he still deals solid damage. Plus, others received damage nerfs as well. Another great thing about damage nerfs is the fact that they don't really change how the character is generally played as you're essentially just swapping big numbers for smaller ones.

I wouldn't say that he's more about mixups/resets, but now he does need to reset his opponents more in order to kill them.

Valkenhayn's pressure has never been particularly good in terms of length, but it never needed to be since his superb mix-up allows him to open people up quite quickly. His human pressure has been weakened due to the meter gain nerf, and his wolf pressure has been strengthened due to him gaining additional normals. And now his new wolf starters are actually some of his best starters so using wolf mode more now is encouraged.

His overall mix-up has been weakened as well, off of like every starter in Extend we'd gain at least 50 meter for his extremely scary j.C > Rapid Cancel > j.C IOH which had amazing corner carry potential and almost always lead into 4K meterless (Hima used to abuse this thing so damn hard aha, I don't really blame him, it's very very good). Not to mention the fact that we had a 6 frame standing low which gatling'd into itself 3 times. Couple all that with a w[j.A] IOH and his mix-up was borderline crazy.

I wouldn't fret though, his mix-up is still quite great. Valkenhayn overall is still a great character. He's also one of the few characters that has been consistently good. Also, w[j.C] da bess'.

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Anybody know another way to do Valk's 30th challenge? I can't do w[5C] loops to save my life.

Can anybody help me with this? I understand this doesn't really qualify as an "important" question in regards to playing the character, but I can't find resources elsewhere and I'm kind of desperate.

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We don't know if there is any other way. That's why we were all surprised when we saw how to do it. I doubt there is any other way for Valk to do that much damage.

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Can anybody help me with this? I understand this doesn't really qualify as an "important" question in regards to playing the character, but I can't find resources elsewhere and I'm kind of desperate.

It's not really about how important the question is, we're a pretty friendly bunch around here and are willing to answer any type of question for the most part.

My guess is that none of us posted yet because we were waiting on the others to chime in and provide a possible answer. But at this point we're all probably thinking the same thing: It's most likely not possible.

Take a look at the strongest combo in my combo thread: [75%] 6B(1) FC > CT > 5D > w[5C > 3D > 4C] x5 > 6D > j.A] > 5D > 5B > 2C > 6C > OD > 2C > 6D > w[j.B > 5C > 236B > j.236B > j.214A] > 5D > 632146D [7283 DMG]

It utilizes Valkenhayn's best starter, the corner, overdrive, an overdrive distortion, a CT, and the wolf sweep loop. Yet it only deals 7283 DMG. This isn't Extend anymore, Valkenhayn really can't pump out such high-numbers like he used to be able to.

Truth be told once I saw that challenge 30 required 8k of damage I honestly thought to myself "How the heck is anyone going to pull this off?"

However, someone did manage to do it. Here's what the combo used: 100 heat, the corner, an extremely impractical starter (the last hit of Sturm Wolf), the wolf sweep loop, and overdrive. And even with all that he barely managed to reach 8k.

Point being: Without an extremely executionally demanding combo coupled with a large amount of resources Valkenhayn is most likely not going to be able to produce that kind of damage in CP.

Edit: Dammit, Magaki beat me to it. Hah.

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I suppose, it just seems like a weird way to do it (I don't recall any of the other trials requiring you to set up a tech situation for a very specific counterhit scenario). I just wasn't sure if that was the actual method the game showed you or if it was just the way that particular player came up with.

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It MIGHT be possible that there is a combo route that the developpers are aware of but we don't know it yet. To be honest, it's really weird that they would make a challenge like that without even taking a look at the character they are giving it to. I wonder if there are other characters in the same situation.

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Throughout my gameplay sessions at my local FGC, I am constantly told (and scorned) that Valkenhayn is undisputed S tier in CP, second only to Litchi. While I feel that Valk is definitely one of the better characters in the game, I think that he is a bit toned down from his Extend iteration. He feels like a whole new character, one that is stronger in a few aspects from Extend, but weaker in many other areas.

Is he still absurd level god tier? None of the guys I play with ever took the time to learn him, so I figured you dudes would be the better group to ask.

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What is "absurd level god tier?" I don't think that Extend Valkenhayn was absurd level god tier, he was just S tier.

You're pretty much right about the fact that he is now stronger in a few aspects, but weaker in many others. As for being a whole new character, I disagree. And unlike most people I honestly believe that CP Valkenhayn is overall easier to use then Extend Valkenhayn.

As for tier ratings, who the heck knows. First Hakumen was the CP god that everyone feared who was said to be da bess', then it was Litchi, and now we're all riding the Kokonoe hate train. Things change. The interesting thing about CP is that there are just so many strong characters that are possible contenders for S tier spots (Taokaka, Kokonoe, Hazama, Jin, Relius, Hakumen, Litchi, Valkenhayn, Rachel?, etc).

If you'd like a definitive/conclusive answer, I can't give you one. But he's definitely a top contender, and is still a great character.

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