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MikelAL93

[CP/EX] Kagura Mutsuki - Player Critique and Self Improvement thread

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Need tips and advice on how to improve your playstyle as Kagura? Post videos of yourself playing so we can help you right away.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHxEdAzNuTo

Very basic Day 1 stuff, still getting used to his drive followups and situational combo recognizing and such.

I like that you don't spam his drives all over the place. :) Although they're largely unsafe and mashable, it'd be good to learn some safe ways to use his drives, especially 2DA, 2DB, and 6DB, in pressure. The simplest way is to do a frame-trap like 3C 5DA (dash forward after) or 3C 5DA 2DC (two frame traps). This is already a mixup because you're at a small disadvantage after 5DA 66, but if they mash after 5DA they'll get counter-hit by 2DC. Anyway, if they respect these frame traps, you can start doing things like 3C 2DA and you still have 5DA 66 to make it safe on block. (By the way, 3C 2DB 5DA is also two frame-traps.)

I also like the use of 46A to reset your pressure.

My biggest piece of advice is to stop ending combos in flashkick! Instead, do one of the following:

- Outside corner, use 3C 2DC 46B for orb oki. You can run up and do high-low mixups with 6A/5B/2B, use drive mixups, etc.

- Near corner, use 3C 6DC 2DB 46B for orb oki in corner.

- There are other BnBs that do about the same damage as your current BnB, but they end in j.C (knockdown) or 6DC (push them towards corner).

Lastly, stop doing random supers! Just flashkick if you think they're going to attack you. You can use the 50 meter to make it safe on ground block (it's already safe on air block), and on counter-hit, you can combo into a super for about 3k if you want. (Although personally, I think it's better to save the meter for drive mixups / making drives safe / comboing from 2DB.)

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You can use 46A after a throw to make the 6C connect easier.

It doesn't even decrease damage that much. (3,7-3,6K with my combo.)

EDIT: Actually, scratch that. Use 46B after the throw, it'll actually improve the amount of damage you deal. (3,7-4,0K with my combo.)

For refence's sake, the combo I'm using is Throw-6C-6DA-2DA-5DC-28C.

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I like that you don't spam his drives all over the place. :) Although they're largely unsafe and mashable, it'd be good to learn some safe ways to use his drives, especially 2DA, 2DB, and 6DB, in pressure. The simplest way is to do a frame-trap like 3C 5DA (dash forward after) or 3C 5DA 2DC (two frame traps). This is already a mixup because you're at a small disadvantage after 5DA 66, but if they mash after 5DA they'll get counter-hit by 2DC. Anyway, if they respect these frame traps, you can start doing things like 3C 2DA and you still have 5DA 66 to make it safe on block. (By the way, 3C 2DB 5DA is also two frame-traps.)

I also like the use of 46A to reset your pressure.

My biggest piece of advice is to stop ending combos in flashkick! Instead, do one of the following:

- Outside corner, use 3C 2DC 46B for orb oki. You can run up and do high-low mixups with 6A/5B/2B, use drive mixups, etc.

- Near corner, use 3C 6DC 2DB 46B for orb oki in corner.

- There are other BnBs that do about the same damage as your current BnB, but they end in j.C (knockdown) or 6DC (push them towards corner).

Lastly, stop doing random supers! Just flashkick if you think they're going to attack you. You can use the 50 meter to make it safe on ground block (it's already safe on air block), and on counter-hit, you can combo into a super for about 3k if you want. (Although personally, I think it's better to save the meter for drive mixups / making drives safe / comboing from 2DB.)

To add on to that, you shouldn't flashkick while the opponent is blocking or outside the attack's range, as it will also lead to them punishing you greatly.

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I need to correct myself: there is NO universal frame trap from 3C into a drive! 3C 5DA loses to lows, e.g. Taokaka 2A or 2B. It beats Jin 2A, though. 3C 2DA loses to not-lows.

3C is punishable on block. So if they block a 3C and they have a low that beats 5DA (everyone?), your options are basically rapid cancel, guess between 5DA/2DA, or hope that they don't know how to punish 3C on block. :P (Or you can cancel into flashkick, but it'll probably whiff if they do nothing. :/ )

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I've pretty much devoted all my time to Kagura after getting him on CP. So after all the games I've had with him I feel like I'm curious what you think works for good Midscreen play. Usually I tend to hit 2DA-6DA-5BB-5C 46B a lot and keep pushing on after that. Usually I follow that up with 6DC or J.C as pressure. I hope this makes sense. I feel like I'm being way too frugal when giving the opponent space between us. In the corner I tend to sit it out and punish the opponent with his drive if they don't pay attention. Most of my corner hit confirms net me at least 3K-6K with or without meter. Most of this has been solid, but again I feel I'm doing it wrong.

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Two super bad quality matches of me playing my brother's Azreal. I know there are a lot of flaws. My main problem is that with his dash he seems to get out of all my pressure attempts and I can't really force him to block anything. Any tips or advice would be great! ^__^

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=di20Ot_jqms

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQSbBg5MNDE

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I was hoping that you all could help me learn the right way to play this character. I'm struggling a lot with him and I was hoping that some of you would play with me and tell what I'm doing wrong and help me find a solution. I was wondering if Bill307 would help me out as I have seen mostly only vids of him and omnisscythe play and he seems very knowledgeable but anyone who wants to help I'm willing to learn from. I just need some help cause I have no idea what I'm doing.

Dragon Emperor

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My friend doesn't have a dustloop account - and since he's lazy I posted it for him. Would you guys be kind enough to critique this Video if possible?

He reads dustloop so he'll see the critique. Much appreciated if anyone can analyze this.

Please be sure to time stamp > make comments so that its easy to know what you're referring to.

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My friend doesn't have a dustloop account - and since he's lazy I posted it for him. Would you guys be kind enough to critique this Video if possible?

He reads dustloop so he'll see the critique. Much appreciated if anyone can analyze this.

Please be sure to time stamp > make comments so that its easy to know what you're referring to.

Alright, I'll start with a few general things first. Try and reduce the amount of air stances into 6DC you do, granted they worked a good few times, it's more about the air stance itself, and the time it takes to teleport to the ground where you'll be completely vulnerable (especially against steins) and it would've been better to just do it from the ground, plus Ixis started to adapt to them in the later matches. Nothing wrong with throwing it out a few times though, so yeah. I noticed you dropped 6DC(ch)>2DA>B orb a fair bit, because of hitting the 2DA a little late, something you can do to make this a ton easier is to do 6DC(ch)>5DA>2DA>B orb, the 5DA needs to be delayed a fair bit, but it'll guarantee the orb hitting after B orb. You can also do a better combo off this to get better corner carry and oki, with 6DC(ch)>5DA>2DA>B orb>6C>6DA>3C>2DC>B orb midscreen and 6DC(ch)>5DA>2DA>B orb>6C>6DB>2DC>5DC>3C>6DC>2DB>A orb if you're nearing the corner.

2:09: You should've taken the round here. Just a simple 6A>6B>3C>2DC>A orb>5B>3C>2DC>Super would've been enough.

3:33: Nice 6DB here, and you were unlucky to not get the 5DC afterwards. At around that part of the screen though, you could've done 6DB>2DC>5DC and put Mu into the corner for an easier combo, and probably take the round too. 6DB>2DC>5DC>5C>6DC>5DA>2DA>B orb>6C>6DA>3C>6DC>super would've been more than enough.

4:26: So this was the second [2]8C CH that you had got and it seemed like you were gonna go for the stance mixup again, but backed out of it. That itself is no real problem, but you still have landing recovery, and lose momentum. If stance mixup isn't working, you're best of charging an A orb while you're falling, and using it as soon as you hit the ground, just to get a tiny bit of oki if someone does neutral tech into it.

5:26: Nice combo to finish out the round, but you can actually do a ton more damage! Ending with the charge super isn't too great because of it's pretty bad damage, whereas stance super does 1.1k minimum damage. In the corner, you want to do something like 5BB>3C>6DC>2DC>B orb>2C>5C>6DC>2DA>(delay)5DA>dc>3C>6DC>super. Nevertheless, your combo worked in that situation.

8:45: I assume you were trying to get a charge super out but don't be afraid to counter assault to get Mu off you and give yourself room to breathe. Considering Mu's health, you didn't need the meter all that badly, as most BnB's probably would've killed.

10:40: This came up in a few other spots too, but I notice to j.C alot when someone is dreictly below you. This isn't too big a problem, but a lot of the time you would do it close to the ground, so the j.C wouldn't come out, but you'd still get the landing recovery from it. Just be wary of this, as j.B is a great move too and done that low to the ground would let you continue pressure without any real problems.

10:57: j.B has a ton of untech time on CH, so you could've gotten a basic combo there (and you had the right idea too!). Just something like j.B(CH)>5A>j.A>j.B>j.C.

11:42: Yay orbs in neutral! You're giving something for Mu to be aware of here, which is nice. You got hit out of B orbs a little, so throw in a few A orbs too.

14:35: Nice CH2C, but you could've gotten a huuuuuge combo to even it out here if you RC'd the first hit of 2DB afterwards. Something like 2C>2DB(1)>rc>5DA>2DA>B orb>6C>6DA>3C>6DC>2DB>A orb.

15:39: Make sure you're charging an orb during 2DB's animation, because if it hits, you can throw out an A orb for a small bit of oki.

15:55: I've talked a little about a better BnB in the corner, but try your best to not end combos in [2]8C, as you lose knockdown and oki, and let the opponent out for free. In this situation, you want to charge a B orb during 2C, and let it go just a little after 2C hits for oki. Try and only end in [2]8C if you don't have meter for super and you know it'll kill.

17:01: So this is something that came up quite a bit, but your pressure and mixup need work. You just go right into 5BB>3C>2DC, which if it hits, great! If it's blocked you're already back to neutral, and Mu has the advantage here. Make use of all your stances, simple things like 5B>2DA or 5B>5DB. 6B/5BB is jump cancelable, so mix that in there a little, and don't forget about the [4]6A blockstring (2A>5BB>A orb etc). Even just doing things like 5BB>5C>A orb can be good enough because you're putting orbs out there to annoy Mu.

17:46: Nice airthrow here, but you didn't convert off of it. The best thing to do is charge an orb during it's animation, and throw it as soon as you land from the airthrow then do Airthrow>A orb>6C>6DA>2DA>B orb>2C>2DB>A orb. If it's in or near to the corner, you can do Airthrow>5C>6DC>2DC>B orb>5C>6DC>5DA>2DA>(delay)B orb

17:51: Not sure why you went for 5DC>2DA here when you had Mu in the corner, just a simple combo to keep her in the corner would've sufficed here, as 5DC>2DA is tricky to hit midcombo (you need to be real close on the 5B>3C)

That about covers what I noticed anywho. Don't be afraid to throw out some 5C's in neutral occasionaly, if it's at the very least blocked, you can charge an orb during the meantime to keep something on screen so your job in neutral is a tiny bit easier. Keep up the good work man.

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Intruding this thread, but Kagura should not be always charging in with 6d~c despite that Mu looks open while settings steins because her D's are special cancelable (meaning her dp)

I haven't seen IxisNaugus special cancel steins though, but Mu can do that. So be aware of that

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6D~C is the sword lunge that has projectile invinc i assume?

If Mu does DP - is that a projectile?

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Mu's dp is not a projectile and if 6d~c hits Mu's dp at any point when it's active (even if you only hit it with the tip of 6d~c), then 6d~c will get stuffed because of the guardpoint properties of Mu's dp

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Mu's dp is not a projectile and if 6d~c hits Mu's dp at any point when it's active (even if you only hit it with the tip of 6d~c), then 6d~c will get stuffed because of the guardpoint properties of Mu's dp

Actually Mu DP has projectile property as Litchi DP. Exonestar is right about it. The only things that makes it beating 6DC are the amount of invincibilty and the guarpoint. I am so used to her at this point and she is my second character. BTW if you delay the 6DC vs Litchi DP, it will beat it free.

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Kagura vs Mu-12 is a nightmare but you can do it if you do less mistakes. First of all you should acknowlegge that she has better normals than yours and she is not forced to come to you. BTW this MU is not even that strong.

Forgive my poor english, it is not my first language but i hope you got my points. these are some advices after watching that video. Seo already did a good job.

Super jumps, air dashes and knowledge of her movement are necessary. Importance here is not always to hit her but to touch her and disactivate stein attack.

You should also know Steins do not cheap even charged steins, so no need to barrier block them. By barrier blocking them, you reaction is longer. Always instant block them and then react.

Instant jump C is also a good option vs her but you should drive cancel it if it get blocked.

2C and 5C are also good options, only sometimes esp 2C but if she throws a 5C that will beat you most of the time, be aware. You should use these long-ranged moves in anticipation not on reaction since her DP can't punish you if well spaced, 5C will never clash with her 5C bc of level of the move and you should be charging the orb while doing this and react with 2DB if it hits.

Sometimes, only sometimes 2DB is a better option than 6DC, because it is faster, its whiff recovery is shorter and if she jumps you should have enough timz to throw a DP and it travel faster and mess air lasers. It will make you closer to her. For example, instant jump C into 1DB is very good but can be DP'ed; not a be=ig deal tho. 800 dmg from her DP, Kagura can take it.

You have to always go for resets, these are the key. Always end your combos to another crazy setup in order to keep it in your favor. You have to take some risks but not some crazy commitments that will get you countered.

Optimize your combos, every combo should be an opportunity to hurt her so bad; For example a CH 6DC should be lead to a 5K combo, since she only has 10K health; half of her life should be gone. That will be make your opponent think twice the next time.

If you get CH 6DC while she is doing 236D, 28C is your best option. If will negate the returning laser and will keep yourself safe.

Finally, when you have life lead, you should never commit yourself, stay where you are, even crouching. That will force her to come in as I told you before, there is no chep if you block steins, even the charged ones and no need to barrier block them.

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Actually Mu DP has projectile property as Litchi DP. Exonestar is right about it. The only things that makes it beating 6DC are the amount of invincibilty and the guarpoint. I am so used to her at this point and she is my second character. BTW if you delay the 6DC vs Litchi DP, it will beat it free.

Her dp only has the body (or head for the arial version) property, otherwise Tager's sledgehammer would have beaten Mu's dp any time. Another reason why it's not a projectile , is that Kagura's 6d~c would have "absorbed" Mu's dp , something that can be seen if Mu's dp would have hit Tager's 6a (which has super armour against anything except lows and throws)

The only reason why you can mistake Mu's dp for having projectile properties is that Mu's dp can "absorb" projectiles unlike most other dps (in those cases any projectile would have gone through the dp), but that's because Mu's dp doesn't have invulnerabilities but a full guardpoint that works against anything

Really late edit because i overlooked this part but can't look past it

. BTW this MU is not even that strong.

I don't think IxisNaugus is bad (likely better than i am), but rather very inexperienced when fighting Kagura

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These were some matches from a local we had last weekend

Kagura(me) vs Litchi

Loser's Finals Kagura(me) vs Litchi

Winner's Finals Kagura(me) vs Hakumen

Something pretty weird happened against Hakumen, @7:35 I got hit with Hakumen's Super counter but it only did ~800 damage and the full combo only did ~1800 damage. I'm wondering if it has something to do with the guard point on 5D~A or if it is some weird bug that is happening with kagura.

Outside of key mistakes and decisions i can see now that cost me the games and getting blown up in winners and losers, i'd like to believe i'm on the right track on playing those match ups correctly.

Hakumen feels super hard to fight against with kagura, especially in the mid range. His 3C is such a big problem. It all feels like just a great big turtle fest, except hakumen is building meter, so one mistake from me will cost me a lot of life. :psyduck:

*edits for grammer

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I'm afraid I don't have any reliable means of recording my battles.

 

if anyone is online soon, can we meet up in a designated theater room and I'll show you some of the my replays and you can critique me via either here or PM on the PS?

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I dont have recording equipment (yet), so is anyone willing to have some matches with me to help me improve my Kagura (Advice and all that?)

I feel like I need someone to tell me what im doing wrong with this guy lol.

 

I feel like im using j.C too much, and my DP always gets baited, but I have a hard time getting in otherwise.

Most of my wins come from me sitting on meter for counter assaults and wave super. -_-

Simply put, I feel like I can never go on offense (so I never get to do those 5k combos I practice.)

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