Jump to content
9TNine

[Xrd] I-No Gameplay Discussion

Recommended Posts

Hey, so I'm watching some footage and just noticed here that VCL YRC beat the startup of Slayer's Spread Your Wings Eternal Wings.  This super is 5+4 to go active, active for 18 frames, and invul 1-26 (pretty much only vulnerable during the 43f recovery).  He's getting hit out of the move's startup.

 

Thinking back to that example with Eddie, it was a drill that hit I-No out of Desperation.  I've seen instances of other meaty moves actually losing to our ground super.

 

Wild Throw beating Desperation makes sense as it's only Strike-Invul.  I think that this issue is specifically related to projectiles during super freeze.  Does anyone remember if the drill was YRC'd in the Zato clip?  It's strange since even with doubled startup we're looking at 18 frames, compared to the 26 assumed for invul in the example I linked.  Maybe it only happens with projectile YRC, but that alone can't be what causes it.

 

Can anyone think of any other examples off of the top of their heads so we can look for discrepancies?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's a possibility, but what reason would he have for doing that?  His super should have won that exchange anyway.  He could have ****ed up, but I'd rather dig a little.

 

 

Also, how exactly does the startup on YRC work?  Do you lose the invul up until the flash occurs?  That would be inconsistent with that Sol video about Dragon Install YRC, if I'm not mistaken about what was going on there.  Is it that there's a minimum amount of time you have to wait before the flash will occur?

 

Anyway, no flash occurs in this video if you frame by frame it, so it looks like Slayer is simply getting hit.  I can't figure anything out without more information.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's a possibility, but what reason would he have for doing that?  His super should have won that exchange anyway.

No. I-no could block and punish his super there. YRC has no recovery.

 

Pay attention, when VCL beaten Slayer's super, there is no CH. This happened because Slayer tried to YRC and lost all his invul. So VCL beaten startup of RC instead of super.

 

Slayer actually tried to do a very clever thing here. He saw that he gonna get punished so he tried to take all VCL's active frames into his invul frames and then YRC. But his timing was bad and he got hit, however U-zen tried to block incoming super so he did not expect this outcome.

 

YRC has 6 frames of startup with no invul + 19 fames of flash btw.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, that's the one I was referring too. I really like that costume not only because I-No is wearing a black costume but also for the white hair she has that makes her look like a old woman in the game, if anything I'll be really willing to pay for that costume to come back in Xrd.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All nice colors imo

Ino's thighs have gotten a good deal bigger... Out of curiosity, how long after accent core does xrd take place? Anyone know?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pink is literally the best. :<

I'm glade they went with ofww white color. Blond just dont sit well with pink imo.But brown and pink is all gravey. 

I call this pallet....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All nice colors imo

Ino's thighs have gotten a good deal bigger... Out of curiosity, how long after accent core does xrd take place? Anyone know?

 

Yeah, I-No got some significant buffs to her chest and butt.  Maybe she's been hitting the sweets on purpose to gain weight in the right places.  After 5 years of hunting for a non-shitty timeline, maybe she just wants a dude to notice her.

There's also a slit in the hem of her mini skirt.  :v:

 

 

Combo optimization is going to be weird with the addition of so many prorates and changes to base damage values.  I-No can still do some damage (I looked at U-Zen's player card yesterday and his max combo hit for over 300), but she's feeling a little more like Millia now.  One of the things I liked most about her was the difference in damage and efficiency between starting with '2K > 6P' vs 'j.S > 6P' vs 'JI'd 2S > HCL 6FRC6' vs 'CH STBT-S (in AC)' or 'CH 5H > STBT-H (for +R)'.  Millia might not hit as hard as I-No, but now we have prorates on most of our starters, and the majority of our high-damage moves (Sdive, HCL/VCL, 6H) got damage nerfs.  Our highest damage option is probably going to be corner raw Fortissimo > VCL loop.  Besides that, trying to incorporate j.D into our combos will probably go a long way for setting up or extending VCL loop since it also hits for 40 damage, but with 16 frame startup and the changes to CH STBT, I can't think of ways to do that meterlessly anymore, except for CH 6H.  I was thinking that using 6H in combos might work, but with the damage nerfed to 40 for the second hit, we might as well just do another VCL.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wonder what the damage after command throw (should probably find a way to universally shorten it, SM probably works) will be like. I know you can, instead of going straight for a P Dive out of it, you can wait a bit and do a low to the ground j.H>land into stuff. Maybe you can do the same thing and do a low airdash j.S>VCL into some loops in the corner. I assume 6P>5H>IADj.K>j.S>VCL can also go into some shorter VCL loops. I know I've seen U-zen go into them from that at least once.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have you ever seen anyone go for IAD j.K > VCL (omitting the j.S)?  j.S's damage is only 23, so going straight into VCL where possible increases overall damage for combos.  It's not always doable, but with the buffed recovery on VCL, it might be possible to get better follow ups that weren't possible before (in situations where VCL would connect but it wasn't worth it because follow up options sucked or cost meter or something).  Maybe we could VCLE or HCLE after that to recoup the lost corner push that we get from the j.S in the IAD string, but get better damage in the process.  Otherwise, maybe 5H would connect.

 

But yeah, you're also better off doing 'c.S > 5H > j.H' strings instead of 'c.S > j.S > j.H' where possible.  Sometimes this worked out in AC/+R when doing c.S (against high opponent) > VCL > c.S loop since they'd be low enough with the catch from the second c.S to combo to 5H.  However, with Sdive's damage nerfed and the potential for accidental cross under in the corner if you're not using Sdive at the right height, there's less reason to do this.

 

 

Anyway, while I'd normally prioritize corner push first (so the usual Pdive string after SM), if there's a way to get close to the ground early enough and they were already in the corner when I used SM, I might start with Hdive loops for meter gain and go into a Pdive loop with Pdive knockdown > 5-hit note oki for RISC+.  Unless they're in kill range anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nope, not that I remember. Everyone just does j.K>j.S>VCL and either j.P>j.S into knockdown, or just straight HCL~VCL if it's straight midscreen.

 

Maybe Xrd will be magic and let you do TK H Dive into VCL loops and still have really good damage on everyone! Also, I wonder if there will be places that you can use dashing VCL, or even HCL since it's really untechable again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just wondering if anyone else noticed this, but after talking to Matt Coma, apparently I-no's air options are reset if the air command throw lands.  Pretty big deal, but probably already known too and I'm just blind.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, that's why you can do IAD SM to catch techs and still get a full combo from it. Probably wasn't explicitly stated, but assumed at least.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, restored air options after command throw has been confirmed for a while.

 

Also, you might be able to get damage AND meter gain by doing VCL loop to Hdive loop, but you'd have to go in that order.  Hdive does crap damage again, so if you do that first you'll scale the VCL loop.  That one combo of 'Hdive > Hdive' on Ky that was shown in training mode several months back makes it look like the untech is better, even if the frame data is the same.  Maybe it'll be possible to end combos with that.

 

I thought about it and maybe STBT loop would work.  It generally doesn't work out because of character height and positioning, but maybe you could do VCL loop, then get 1-2 reps of '6P > STBT-S' for damage and meter, since it hits for 40 (better than dives since they do 30 now) and builds 2/7.2 for meter (again, better than single hit dives).  The prorate on 6P isn't forced any more and 32 damage is still better than dives, so the setup for it wouldn't scale horribly.  Even the follow up damage will scale better since STBT is lvl 4 (equivalent to 5 in AC/+R).  It's not quite as good as '6P > 5H > j.H > Sdive' in AC/+R, but it might be good enough replacement given that we can do stuff like 'HCL > 5K > HCL > 2S > HCL ~ D' for an ender after pushing ourselves out too far for anything better.  Might also be able to set up Hdive loop after it if we're lucky.

 

*Edit*

I remember seeing some VCLE stuff early when Xrd first came out, but I think it dropped off given other setups that are probably easier and more optimized.  I occasionally still see HCLE used in neutral because it's great on CH.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doesn't 6P>STBT not work on launched opponents?

 

The release of Xrd is just under a week away for early adopters of the JP version.  The Official translation for I-no's command grab is "Sterilization Method" according to the move list in the US demo, so SM should definitely be the short hand for it. I might go ahead and change the wiki for it, since it's just the name for it.

 

I'll be updating the video thread soon, just waiting for some of the stuff to pile up so I have a big update before the release. I know there's a few match of U-zen to be added, but IIRC it's only like 2 matches from some a-cho thing. Eh. I'll need to look everywhere again.

 

We'll need a combo thread soon, using Kurushii's layout. We also need a mod.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kinda curious ~ What's the E designation for VCL and HCL?

 

Also: i've noticed in other games that there are character-specific skype chats; is there one for I-no as well?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doesn't 6P>STBT not work on launched opponents?

 

 

STBT hits fairly low to the ground. It will work if you do something like 2k 6p STBT on a grounded opponent but AA 6p STBT doesn't work unless you get a 6p CH and even then it's not very consistent and probably character specific. Also doing 2k 6p STBT should work on most characters though some are quite heavy and it might not work on them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah that's why I said launched opponents. Implying the 6P hit an already airborne character, and not just from a standard c.S/2K>6P route on the ground.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a probably dumb question... I know you can do in Slash 6HS CH (second hit)>STBT>Ultimate Fortissimo>5K>HCL>6FRC6>j.HS>c.S>stuff in the corner for example, but there's at least a small chance to combo Ultimate Fortissimo with STBT if I do that in Xrd as well? Cause I'm not sure right now if then the opponent will have to smash buttons more in order to break the state or then it resets as doing STBT in neutral game, being then still unsafe to combo with if so.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×