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LegendaryRath

[P4AU] Mitsuru Kirijo Gameplay Discussion

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2 launching grounded opponents means new combo routes will open. Though I am not sure how useful that will be, I can imagine a few cases where it might be, though.

For example for a midscreen confirm off of a ''Ice'' A or SB Coup. 

Ice A/SB Coup> 5> 2> [2]8D> 5> 2AB> [4]6B, for example. 
It's situational, but that is one of the uses the new special property could have. Extra damage in certain situations never hurts, right? If they do ever come along, being able to get more damage and meter meterless is always great. And there's no downside to this (I am going to imagine), so why the frick not? 

Tentarafoo being comboable now sounds great, but with the nerf to confusion, it's not nearly as great. Also, the situations where I imagine it possible are these:
Bufudyne> Tentarafoo
5> Tentarafoo
AoA~D> Tentarafoo (?) Highly doubt this, though.
D Bufula/C Bufula> Tentarafoo (Maybe not D, depends on when they break out.)

Anywho, in a lot of these cases you can combo with beter stuff, or just simply go for a safe (sometimes even fully charged) Marin Karin. Which I highly prefer over the confusion. Probably even the old confusion.
It might be a nice way to give confusion AND marin Karin if you could do AoA~D> Tentarafoo> Bufudyne, though. This would still allow you to do the fully charged Marin Karin as well, though I highly doubt this will be possible. It would be awesome, though. 

The faster starup on Tentarafoo should be really helpful as well. I can't help but imagine this was done to actually do make it chainable, though. And when you think about it like that... How fast would it have become? I'm curious. I just hope it's come to the speed where you could at least beat a Zio from Yu when using it as a call out. Because right now you can't even do that in most cases. I doubt it'll be better than Zio, but decently somewhere in the same league would be a godblessing. 

 

The changes to AoA, requiring you to just hold the buttons should make her optimal combos a lot damned easier. I'm not sure how happy I am with that, but it is how it's going to be. Everyone can do her strong combos (At least the proper ender) with ease now. No need to worry about missing anymore, which is really nice. But I fear a flood-in of casual Mitsuru's. Not that this per say is a bad thing, I'm just saying... The changes to Mitsuru, her becoming harder, her requiring stricter-timed AoA~D mashing requiring all hits for a proper combo finish/ender and her no longer being able to do meterless confirms generally (Still the same, I am going to assume. Only the startup changed, after all. Maybe the recovery got nerfed, though.) is what scared most people away. She's not as easy, nor easy to win with, as before. This might have people bring themselves back to her. Though if they wanted easier characters to win with, I really don't think Mitsuru is the ideal character for that anymore, so it might not be nearly as bad as I am imaging it. Let's hope it's just my paranoia.

Faster startup on B Coup should be helpful and nice and all, but shouldn't make any major difference. It might be slightly more doable on reaction for an unplanned sweep hit, though.

SB Bufula becoming faster just means that it's going to much more useful in neutral. A lot, actually. This means it will be her fastest neutral  by far. Including all other neutrals, even jumping ones, this will be her fastest. So, if you need to mash out? SB Coup! Maybe this means we'll have a somewhat legit reversal other than throw and DP, guard cancel, cancel roll, etc. The usual. Even though it costs meter, it would be nice indeed. 

 

The change to auto combo meter gain is not good for Mitsuru, though. This means we'll always have to do the A Coup for extra meter, which can be mashed out (trading hits) by characters with a 5f 5A. Which are actually quite some characters. (Damned Yosuke, Aigis, Yu, etc.) So, we might not be able always gain a good amount of meter anymore. It should be fine on a longer range/max range/mid range, though. Then again, Yosuke might actually still be able to mash out of mid range with a shortdash 5A. Because, is is just me, or do his shortdashes not take any frames? It's probably just me.

Also, the univeral change to C moves having invulnerability on ''unappeared'' startup means that people won't be able to mash Mitsuru's 5C> backstep> 5C broken anymore. Which means, it'll actually be much more a legit blockstring. Though it's still susceptible to jumping from certain characters (damned Yosuke) and supers with a really large till fullscreen range. 

 

Throw super cancel status means that midscreen we'll be able to chain from a midscreen throw with 50 meter now, into a A Myraid or maybe (depends on the juggling) SB Myriad Arrows. In the corner we should be able to chain into maybe B (Again, most likely juggling issues with this one. SB maybe, this one probably) Myriad Arrows, C Bufudyne for sure, and maybe (not sure startup wise, but I doubt it) D Bufudyne. This allows for somewhat tiny unburstable blockstrings for quickly finishing off an opponent with a small amount of health left.

Now, before I get much more exicted, let's brace ourselves for her nerf list. 

 

Not to even begin about S.Mitsuru. The large amount of unclear changes about Shadow characters won't allow me to even speculate about what might happen to her. I assume, if Frenzy mode mostly stays the same, she'll be a lot more dangerous an enemy, especially because she can just use meter like she pleases, which her BnB combos require. This put me to thinking; Does this mean Shadow characters will now be able to use meter, even supers, and THEN go into Frenzy mode? Because if so, I imagine Mitsuru (If nothing else majors changes) will be able to do even more damage.

Imagine this:
 

Regular BnB> AoA~D> SB Bufula> Mabufudyne> Frenzy> [b~] Myriad Arrows> {C}> [~B]> {C}> [sB~] Myriad Arrows> {C}> {D}> [~SB]> D Bufudyne.

That is pretty much old I have to say about the known changes so far. I hope this somehow helped any at all, or simply helped to entertain you.

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Welps, since confusion just became useless, there goes all my hype for Tentarafoo. It would have been neat to get confuse and charm on an opponent. Faster start-up B droit might mean she can pick up in the corner with 2A and SB droit no longer needed. Would be nice.

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Let's hope so. The changes to confusion is making it rather useless. 

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Faster start-up B droit might mean she can pick up in the corner with 2A and SB droit no longer needed. Would be nice.

 

faster startup of b droit won't help with this at all...

 

as for tentarafoo, i just use it as a anti-zoning tool, never cared for the status ailment

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Been reading a bunch of tweets about Mitsuru, my japanese is pretty bad but this is what I've understood so far:

 

- 5C apparently has a bit less reach (ok?)

- 5DD 2DD 4 2 D bufu - this part doesn't work anymore. I think they said C bufu works fine tho

- Something about combos starting 5DD are a bit harder to do

- SB bufu appears right in front of Mitsuru now (sounds good)

- Something about AoA -D FC into B droit then full 5C comboing

- Something about AoA -D then mahabufu + arrows combo doing less damage. 

- Apparenly the last kick of Setsuna/Myriad arrows does 1600 dmg at max charge now and the SB does 1800 

- Charged j.B forces crouching on hit

 

Please feel free to correct me.

Edited by Diveman

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faster startup of b droit won't help with this at all...

 

as for tentarafoo, i just use it as a anti-zoning tool, never cared for the status ailment

Not entirely true. You'll hit them earlier, thus higher. Thus, it'll take them longer to touch the ground. And you know the rest.

Why do you think CH sweep> B Coup> 2A does work?

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Obligatory post:

-it's just a loke test

-we don't know what will stay in the patch

-we don't know how changes A/B/C will affect X/Y/Z until we see footage or can play it ourselves

-don't get ahead of yourselves

 

Personally, I'm liking the changes I'm seeing so far. Again, the only thing I'm really, really hoping for is slightly more hitstun on A droit.

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Obligatory post:

-it's just a loke test

-we don't know what will stay in the patch

-we don't know how changes A/B/C will affect X/Y/Z until we see footage or can play it ourselves

-don't get ahead of yourselves

 

Personally, I'm liking the changes I'm seeing so far. Again, the only thing I'm really, really hoping for is slightly more hitstun on A droit.

Just trying to have some fun through speculation. No one's really getting ahead of themselves.

Creating hype shouldn't be a bad thing, really.

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Just trying to have some fun through speculation. No one's really getting ahead of themselves.

Creating hype shouldn't be a bad thing, really.

that's fine. I'm just posting that in the event that someone gets carried away about Buff A or Nerf X.

You guys aren't even remotely as bad as the news + discussion thread

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Personally, I'm liking the changes I'm seeing so far. Again, the only thing I'm really, really hoping for is slightly more hitstun on A droit.

 

This would be something I would be interesting in so that mashing 5A (after Mitsuru does auto combo or something ending with droit A) for the opponent isn't a legit strategy.

 

Another pipe dream of mine is CH j.A having enough untech on it that Mitsuru can easily follow up with 5A. That in itself, might be going overboard though. I just get annoyed when I get a CH j.A and they seem like they're close enough to the ground to follow up with 5A, but they're not, and you get caught.

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More changes:

 

- Freezing SB droit no longer crosses up after hit/block, also freezing time is shorter after it

- This combo now works (I assume in the corner) : Sweep > SB droit > 2B > D bufu

- B and SB droit definitely got faster, to the point that doing 2 after 5AA 6B sweep SB droit became really weird to do

- Something about 2 launching having a different effect in combos

- CH throw > omc or sc leaves the opp grounded (I'm gonna assume if you do it before they get launched)

 

I'm trying to understand one tweet that's giving me issues translating lol I'm gonna ask in the main thread.

 

EDIT: Ok Sourenga helped me out with the translation, I'll just copy paste the tweet:

 

"B Droit can be combo'd from Auto Combo, but I couldn't follow it with 2A, not even in corner - meaning the recovery is the same or maybe worse. Auto Combo (Aerial hit) > B Droit > 2A still works."

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I never did do SB droit into bufula, good to know though.

 

Any real reason to do Sweep > SB droit > 2B > D bufu when you can just use 2 instead? I guess the combo itself means 2B has more hit stun on it now or D bufu is faster start-up.

 

B droit getting faster has uses in those combos where B droit will whiff but A droit doesn't whiff. I wonder if it's that fast. I guess that combo became weird because SB droit picks up too high now, so 2 launches higher, and D bufu might actually whiff, giving the opponent time to tech.

 

I wonder what they mean about 2 different effects. Hard to speculate without any context.

 

What is "SC"?

 

Interesting changes. Also, I don't mind speculating so long as it has something to do with gameplay. It's fun listening to other people's theories and such.

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Not entirely true. You'll hit them earlier, thus higher. Thus, it'll take them longer to touch the ground. And you know the rest.

Why do you think CH sweep> B Coup> 2A does work?

yes, you're right, i was thinking under standard circumstances. as for CH sweep > stuff, i actually did not know this. thanks

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What is "SC"?

 

Interesting changes. Also, I don't mind speculating so long as it has something to do with gameplay. It's fun listening to other people's theories and such.

 

SC = special cancel 

 

Also I think the most significant change is that she gets knockdown from auto combo now.

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This means we won't have to worry about A coup being out mashed on hit anymore. These changes so far seem great. I'm really excited for them.

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Ok if charged j.B forcing crouch on hit makes it to the final game that's great lol. Could punish goons who mash at bad ranges on the grounds *cough* Sholo/Pershona players.

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Has anyone been able to aquire any new info regarding Mitsuru in the loketest? Or the loketest's status in general?
I haven't heard of it in quite a while, while you'd expect it to be lively with the changes coming and all.

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Hey so I can't figure out Mitsuru's Coup frames for blockstring purposes, and came to DL to check them out, and they're listed as variable with a ~ in between. Does the frame advantage change based on whether you hit with the edge of the sword in A Coup, or is that like on block vs. on hit, or...?

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For moves with lots of active frames like coup, hitting later on in the move grants more frame advantage, since you apply the same amount of blockstun as if you'd hit earlier in the move, but have less total recovery (since the total recovery is remaining active frames + recovery frames). X ~ Y as frame advantage numbers means that X, Y, and all values inbetween are the possible values for the frame advantage, depending on which of the active frames you hit on.

 

So basically, yeah, hitting towards the end of coup's travel will give you better frame advantage.

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I have made a Mitsuru Skype group chat, specifically for people that play Mitsuru. 
To be able to ask questions on a wim and to be able to have them answered quickly.

And other Mitsuru (P4U(2)) related discussions, of course.
If any are interested in joining, just message me your Skype info, and I'll add you. 

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