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LegendaryRath

[P4AU] Teddie Gameplay Discussion

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Yeah, I'm deciding whether to main him as well.   I tend to like oddballs & grapplers in fighting games, but can't do long combos very well (though I've managed to in Skullgirls w/Big Band a bit).

 

I'm brand new to the game, and haven't played P4A in ages.  I'd like to try the whole cast & keep him in mind.  Nihil Hand is so odd- it's like a cinematic QTE that really tweaks the flow of a match. XD

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My Teddie ain't as good as last games Teddie (mainly because all my hidden tech from last game is gone because of the changes to most of Teddie's moves), but i'm always willing to help out fellow Teddie players. I'm the Teddie who focuses on damage more then item setups so if you need combos I'm someone to talk to.

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A couple things I picked up from toying around in the lab:

 

-5D/2D have different starting item orders, but 2D also throws the item further, like in P4A.

-If you hold D long enough for Kintoki-Douji to throw two items, you can press D again to throw a third item before he disappears.

-Mystery Teddie SP actually has differences between the two versions. The A version throws the items with increasing distance, while the B version throws with decreasing distance. So if both orders are on Robot Deacon, with the A version, the Deacon will be closest, the Oil Drum in the middle, and the Motorcycle Key the furthest away, with the inverse for the B version (the order the items are thrown are still the same).

-Despite what the frame data says, you can actually OMC Nihil Hand (the initial hit), but only on block.

 

I'll probably stick it in the combo thread at some point, but here's a gimmicky Mystery Teddie SP item reset:

 

5AA 236A 236236A (Vanish Ball, Vagna, Muscle Drink) 5AA AoA AoA mash etc.

 

The idea is to use AoA in conjunction with the robot for a high-low at the same time. This also ends up pushing the opponent into the Muscle Drink, so you can delay the AoA mash for just a tiny bit to get a reset. Since Teddie's obscured by the Vanish Ball, it's also harder to see the mix-up and you could even just not do AoA if you suspect the opponent is going to mash DP.

 

You can do 5AAA 236B (autocombo) leading up to the 236236A as well; the resulting 5AA is harder to combo, but it's not a big deal since it'll just mean a 5AA blockstring into the high-low mixup. It'll also push the opponent into the corner from midscreen, so you can use the D fatal ender for some big damage.

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Found some Nihil Hand Tech: On FC if you do a combo where you Nihil hand in the middle of the stage you can combo into another Nihil hand if you have the timing right. It only works with Nihil hand A version since it covers the distance it takes to connect the punch. The timing is the same as doing Teddie's challenge 25 where you have to hit 3 Nihil hands. I even connected 3 Nihil hands so this is another way to do challenge 25. 

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Can we get a Skype group going?? My friend is in a really good Adachi one, and he's learning a lot. I wanna learn too!

 

I actually don't know what a character based skype group is for or how it works.  What would it provide that the forums don't have here?  Could someone fill me in?  Also, we need to start filling in character forums.  I asked Rath if he or someone else could set these up for us.

 

Edit:  I'm going to start making some of the character MU threads once the old ones get archived.

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There are a few ways an opponent will try beat your iad crossup j.B.  One is by rolling and the other is by air grab.  There's a simple way to beat both of them and keep the threat of that mixup real.

 

To beat roll, hit 9 (or 7) to fake the iad, then air backdash j.A.  You'll hit them in recover frames of their roll.

 

To beat air grab, hit 9 (or 7) and then j.2C to fatal counter their grab attempt.

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If you do 6A+B during 5AAA, you will automatically cross the opponent up with AoA. It's still pretty baitable, so don't get predictable with it. It will beat some DP mashers, like Marie's and Rise's.

 

Also, you can do 5AA 2B t.k.236A 236236C/214214B instead of the 5AAA series for more damage at the expense of corner carry. 5AA 2B 236A 214214B will also do more damage than the standard autocombo. Just keep in mind that 2B won't connect at the tip of 5A's range.

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One thing I really like to do with this character is throw out a j.C, let them air tech, run under them and 2B.  That isn't particularly insightful, but one mixup you can add to this is to actually run under them to the other side.  They'll get confused when they land and you can throw them towards the corner.  If you know the player is the kind that mashes DP all day you can just bait the DP.

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One thing I really like to do with this character is throw out a j.C, let them air tech, run under them and 2B.  That isn't particularly insightful, but one mixup you can add to this is to actually run under them to the other side.  They'll get confused when they land and you can throw them towards the corner.  If you know the player is the kind that mashes DP all day you can just bait the DP.

I do something similar to this idea but more likely to happen (because it's easier to land). If you happen to counter the opponent with J.A in the air, do the regular J.A, J.B, J.A combo but instead of doing like bearscrew or J.2C, let the opponent tech and then hit them with a reset 2B. If they hit buttons as they tech and you get another counter, wait a sec to let them fall a bit then do the combo again, but go for damage and possible corner carry. If it's not a counter then just do like J.A, J.A, bearscrew into missile or whatever you normally do. This isn't safe if the opponent learns when to tech down though.

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I do something similar to this idea but more likely to happen (because it's easier to land). If you happen to counter the opponent with J.A in the air, do the regular J.A, J.B, J.A combo but instead of doing like bearscrew or J.2C, let the opponent tech and then hit them with a reset 2B. If they hit buttons as they tech and you get another counter, wait a sec to let them fall a bit then do the combo again, but go for damage and possible corner carry. If it's not a counter then just do like J.A, J.A, bearscrew into missile or whatever you normally do. This isn't safe if the opponent learns when to tech down though.

 

This is a nice setup.  The 2B is definitely the bread and butter of the tech tricks.  I actually came up with another one because I wasn't confident I could do the new FC 2C combos during tournament this last week.  Do FC 2C, j.A, j.C, land then 2B into whatever.  They'll expect a big combo, but instead get tech trapped.

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It took a while, but Teddie's wiki page is pretty much done; all that it needs are images of the new items and moves, and info for j.2C so it can get added to his move list. If people have feedback, feel free.

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It took a while, but Teddie's wiki page is pretty much done; all that it needs are images of the new items and moves, and info for j.2C so it can get added to his move list. If people have feedback, feel free.

 

Reading the Wiki so far i noticed that it says that sweep can't convert unless it's OMC or OMB, this is actually not true as I found 2 ways of comboing sweep and keeping the combo going. The first way is getting fatal 2C. If you sweep at highest point possible and as close as possible to the opponent as you can, you can combo into 2A and go into auto combo. It's not the best method but if your into flashy combos and want to show off then go for it. The second (and this happened to me today) was i used sweep as an anti air against an air dashing opponent. I somehow comboed into 5A off of it. It's probably like my first trick where the opponent has to be high up but maybe i just got lucky and hit on the last few active frames. If anyone wants to try it out you can. I can't record it so you'll have to try it for yourselves. As for J.2C, i feel like it's faster then 2C (i feel like i saw it say 10 frames of startup somewhere). Mainly used as an anti air or to stop opponents momentum from air dashing, you can throw items off screen if you jump high enough and keep the opponent from seeing the next item until it falls down. It can also hit standing opponents, but you have to be very close to the ground, like even hop won't hit unless you start falling down. Also one thing to note about 2C that i found, if you backdash on block and do 2C again, kintoki-douji stays where the first 2C was if your fast enough. It might not be useful but it's always nice to have more tech.

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Going through the arcrevo footage, there's a really neat mixup Souji does here after the missile explosion.  He fakes going into the corner and then air backdashes out.  Madd isn't fooled, but I would have been.

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Was fighting another Teddie and something happened that i don't think is suppose to happen. When i tried to Nihil Hand him as a reversal, he was about 3 or 4 frames into 5A. After the super flash, he canceled 5A into DP. This was before the active frames of 5A and normally your not supposed to be able to do that. Is it a glitch or is this some kind of trick? Cause i know Narukami could do it last game the same way as how it happened this time.

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It took a while, but Teddie's wiki page is pretty much done; all that it needs are images of the new items and moves, and info for j.2C so it can get added to his move list. If people have feedback, feel free.

 

I'd suggest changing the "no real mixup" in the cons section to something like AoA is his only overhead.  Also mention his extensive throw range in the caption for throw

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Ran into a weird glitch the other day during local casuals with a friend. I ended up getting to set up two different sets of TVs. I teleported through one set, but the other set disappeared before I could do anything. I wish I could have recorded it to try and recreate it, because I bet you could get some nasty set ups off of two.

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As in, two sets of TVs out at once, or you teleported and then summoned another set near immediately? The latter's not too uncommon if you're doing inputs quickly.

 

Even if you could get two sets out, I imagine the game would get confused as to which set was allowed for Teddie Warp, hence the other set disappearing.

 

After playing some matches today, I really need to try to find a safe way to implement 2B out in neutral. It gets really good returns off a CH, is dash/backdash/jump cancellable. Too bad it's got such terrible recovery on whiff and awkward range.

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Was fighting another Teddie and something happened that i don't think is suppose to happen. When i tried to Nihil Hand him as a reversal, he was about 3 or 4 frames into 5A. After the super flash, he canceled 5A into DP. This was before the active frames of 5A and normally your not supposed to be able to do that. Is it a glitch or is this some kind of trick? Cause i know Narukami could do it last game the same way as how it happened this time.

I believe everyone's 5A can be kara-cancelled, since that's how the cross-up OS works.

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As in, two sets of TVs out at once, or you teleported and then summoned another set near immediately? The latter's not too uncommon if you're doing inputs quickly.

Even if you could get two sets out, I imagine the game would get confused as to which set was allowed for Teddie Warp, hence the other set disappearing.

After playing some matches today, I really need to try to find a safe way to implement 2B out in neutral. It gets really good returns off a CH, is dash/backdash/jump cancellable. Too bad it's got such terrible recovery on whiff and awkward range.

I set two different sets of TVs out at the same time. I couldn't tell if that game got confused on which set, or if I just took too long and it disappeared. I was very confused at first, so I took a second to react and realize what was happening. I don't think I meter burned it either. Wish I had my capture card stuff going at the time.

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Okay, so how do we punish Teddie's DP? It seems to recover fast enough for him to just DP again before we can do anything about it.

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It's got a pretty notable recovery time (about 43f), which is average for a DP. Definitely more than Chie's, if you can punish that.

 

Best way to 'bait it' during pressure is with an attack that can either hit from a distance, or that allows you to block soon after (projectiles are good for both). The explosion is no longer unblockable, and Teddie has more recovery when reappearing, so you can easily beat him up when he reappears if the explosion whiffs or gets blocked.

 

Or you can just read the DP and not attack, then punish after it. Teddie has no way of making the move safe and the most the move does is reset the playing field (admittedly to his advantage, but it's a lot less than what other characters can do).

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Okay, so how do we punish Teddie's DP? It seems to recover fast enough for him to just DP again before we can do anything about it.

If you activate the explosion and don't get hit by it, Teddie will reappear behind the opponent. He has no invinsibility frames whatsoever and while he's in his taunting animation, it's all Fatal recovery. Either hit him with a projectile or if you backdash up to him you can get a free Fatal combo.

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It doesn't seem to have anywhere near that kind of recovery, but it was also 3 in the morning when I was playing him. Thanks!

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It doesn't seem to have anywhere near that kind of recovery, but it was also 3 in the morning when I was playing him. Thanks!

It has a shorter active window then you're probably thinking. Try going to training mode, program teddie to DP and then jump to show when recovery ends. This will help with your timing. It's very punishable

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