[FB] Full Armor/Enhanced ZZ Gundam General Discussion: Anime Ja Nai!

[MikelAL93]

Discuss information, questions, etc. about the ZZ Gundam here!

JP Wiki: http://www4.atwiki.jp/arcgundamexvsfuvo/pages/32.html

Movelist (Full Armor ZZ Gundam)

[A] Double Beam Rifle

Standard double beam rifle shot.

Max ammo of 7. Can be charged.

[CSa] Missile Full Burst

[AB] Double Cannon

Max ammo of 4.

[AC] Abdomen Hi-Mega Cannon

Max ammo of 2.

[bC] Grab

Can be followed up with the following:

• A back throw
  
• A throw with Double Cannon as a finisher
  
• Point Blank Hi-Mega Cannon
  
  [NB] Beam Saber
  Basic Beam Saber attack.
  Deals two hits. Can be charged.
  
  [CSb] Hyper Mega Cannon + Back Missile Launcher
  Changes to Enhanced ZZ Gundam after use. You cannot use Full-Armor ZZ unless you respawn.
  
  

Movelist (Enhanced ZZ Gundam)

[A] Double Beam Rifle
Standard double beam rifle shot.
Max ammo of 5. Can be charged.

[CSa] Back Missile Launcher

[AB] Double Cannon
Max ammo of 4.

[AC] Hi-Mega Cannon
Max ammo of 1.

[bC] Grab
Can be followed up with the following:

• A back throw
  
• A throw with Double Cannon as a finisher
  
• Point Blank Hi-Mega Cannon
  

[NB] Beam Saber

Basic Beam Saber attack.

Deals three hits. Can be charged.

Core Strategy/Advice

~WIP~

-general gameplan

Cancel Routes

~WIP~

Combos

Note: -> means normal cancel, >> means boost dash cancel, > means rainbowstep cancel

Video Section

~WIP~

Team Composition Advice

~WIP~

Other information

Concerns regarding fighting specific suits, picking assault or blast burst, and miscellaneous details go here.

[MikelAL93]

*reserved*

[akai_GO]

The current info on the Enhanced (armor-purge) ZZ is incorrect - that's the EXVS info. FB EZZ has Hi-Mega Cannon for CSa, and Zaku-Head Zeta assist for BC. Also, the current wiki link goes to the Zeta page, not ZZ XD

 

Cancel Routes

FAZZ

A→Sub, BC

BB→Sub, AC

BDb→Sub

BC→A, B, AC

 

EZZ

A→Sub, AC, BC

BB→A, BC

BDb→Sub

AC→Sub, BDb

 

You should read Burgerkong's translation of the JP wiki that he is busting his ass over and presents all the combos I had originally posted here and more in a much cleaner layout than I had:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1YHs6a5qpoac5aKLw8ZYnS1KsQywkdtnADoiyGi73xmE/edit
 

[akai_GO]

My comments on gameplay and combos that I had posted though:

Having used a stopwatch starting from the moment FAZZ drops out of the firing animation for Hi-Mega Cannon (AC), it takes 10s to go from 1→2 ammo (confirmed in JP wiki), but I kept getting ~9s to go from 0→1 ammo. On paper that seems like a lot of time I know, but between BR, Sub, and layering CSa/mCSa, you'll find that you almost always have at least one BC when you want one. And then you get a permanent HMC as CSa in EZZ mode that charges in 2.5s. So the availability now of HMC in FB from EXVS is truly staggering. FAZZ HMC damage tops out at 252, EZZ HMC tops out at 195. FAZZ has super armor during HMC startup, EZZ does not.

 

Sub cancelling from BR is handy, but you should really try to be conservative and smart with your Sub ammo for its guaranteed knockdown. It's in valuable for keeping an opponent locked down and creating double lock opportunities.

But only 4 ammo in each mode, 7s/shot reload in FAZZ, 9s/shot reload in EZZ. You want this ability to be available when you need it.

 

EZZ as you might guess has a noticable increase in mobility and boost efficiency over FAZZ, as well as more melee combo routes. On that note:

 

FAZZ Melee

356/352   BC→B>EX

353          BC→AC>>BC→B>Sub

???          BC→AC>>BC→AC

 

This is basically going to be the melee combo you do in FAZZ mode. The only other one even worth mentioning is 2B>BC→AC just for its mobility benefit. You can get a cancelled sub, or one hit of a 4B following BB, but basically all of FAZZ's melee attacks hit with such force that you can't string them together for anything. To do the above combo successfully, you need to start your BD basically immediately when the beam hits. If you let the HMC beam put basically any launch on the target, you won't be able to reach them for the follow-up.

 

Also worth noting here is a reminder that just like HMC, FAZZ has super armor in the start up of BC; EZZ does not.

 

EZZ Melee

359/352   BDb>>BDb>>BDb>EX   

351/321   2B>BC→B>EX

312          BC→AC>>BC→B>Sub   Same note as above that you need to BD for the second BC

 

Basic points to remember about EZZ melee: both 4B and 5B cancel into both A and AC. Use 4/6B as a combo opener over 5B though. BDb cancels into sub. Chase or shoot BC→B throws.

 

2B and BDb

FAZZ/EZZ are not by any means melee-friendly suits, but you should learn how to use it effectively should you be forced into a position that you have to defend yourself. BDb is going to be your best tool for closing ground. The most important - and truly vital - technique to learn is using 2B for movement. Using 2B on FAZZ/EZZ is like using the 2BC bunny hop on Exia - it provides quick vertical movement, making you harder to follow and hit, and can mess with the opponents camera if used above and out of angle. 2B will also be your best self-defense ability for encroaching melee.

 

At least for EZZ, both of these abilities get a huge boost in speed during EX Burst, and you can get 4 hits (up from 3 regularly) before downing an opponent. Do not neglect these during Burst.

 

EX Attack

The Giant Beam Saber has huge range at hits like a damn truck. Unfortunately, I've learned it can also be sidestepped very easily. For this reason it's really important that you try to only use it at the end of a combo string to not waste its insane damage. BC→B or BDb are the best options.

 

 

Summary

One of the slower and less agile suits in the game, but this guy is all about big damage and has some combos strong enough to kill a 1k suit in a single string. Melee and mobility get better in EZZ mode, but still rather limited compared to most other 2500 cost suits. Learn how to move to conserve your health and just blow people away.

[akai_GO]

I did some reading and video watching today looking to see if there's any kind of rule or trend to when should you use CSb to armor purge to EZZ, and it seems to vary based on playstyle and necessity. I tend to hold onto it until I'm nearing probably 200 health, but I saw some players that would use it from the beginning, I assume for the increased mobility of EZZ when facing quicker opponents.

 

I'll have to try re-reading through the wiki to see if it has any word on this...

[akai_GO]

Update: added concise cancel list, greatly cleaned up my original posts, and added link to Burger's JP wiki translation document.

[KiraYamatoSF]

I did some reading and video watching today looking to see if there's any kind of rule or trend to when should you use CSa to armor purge to EZZ, and it seems to vary based on playstyle and necessity. I tend to hold onto it until I'm nearing probably 200 health, but I saw some players that would use it from the beginning, I assume for the increased mobility of EZZ when facing quicker opponents.

 

I'll have to try re-reading through the wiki to see if it has any word on this...

 

You can use it under two situation.

The first is to use it to attack the opponent. Its fast and deals a lot of damage. 

Second method is to use it just to get away from situations such as cost over.

[akai_GO]

I was doing some combo practice on E-ZZ today and doing some wiki reading, and wanted to post a couple things learned.

 

First, E-ZZ ammo awareness:

• BR: The BR has a static reload time of 1 ammo/3s in both FA-ZZ and E-ZZ forms, but your ammo drops from 7 to 5 in E-ZZ. It also does 10 less damage, but honestly that's considerably less important than having 2 fewer shots.
• Sub: Ammo count (4) and damage (120) remains the same in both forms, but the reload time in E-ZZ increases from 1 ammo/7s (rough) to 1 ammo/9s (painful). Add this to the fact that the whole reason you are probably in E-ZZ mode in a match is for its mobility so that you can survive because you're getting near or straight-up are low on health. So it should be plainly clear that you have got to - got to - be selfish and efficient with this ammo in E-ZZ, using it when a closing enemy is low on boost or dreadfully close, because its guaranteed knock-down is what is going to let you keep running and keep living.
• AC: (Zaku Head Zeta assist): 40 damage/hit (up to 120), 12s reload. Can cancel into BDb and Sub, cannot Amekyan from it.

So that's 10 rounds of ammo. Ten. We can look at it in a 12s window (AC reload time) and you get 4 more BR and 1 Sub reloaded in that time for a total of 15, but the point I make here is: you will realize you can spend this base ammo pool very quickly, and if you do that all you're left with is a 2.5s charge shot that can be side-stepped quite easily and leaves you completely vulnerable. More simply put: you're in a really bad position when you run out of this ammo pool.

 

Now, maybe you are in E-ZZ mode because your partner overcosted - maybe near you or maybe on the other side of the map right next to an enemy - and you need the mobility and ammo to try and close out a game. The need to be aware of the changes to your ammo pool from FA-ZZ is not any less important. It also leads me to the main point of this...

 

Understanding E-ZZ melee:

• 5B: 3-stage attack that does 60/116/173 damage, 1.7/2.0/3.5 Down. Second hit is a small upper, last hit knocks the enemy so far away that you'll only get a fourth hit is by rainbow stepping to do BR/Sub/AC or the first hit of a melee, but the enemy may get up before you can even do that. You can cancel into BR/CSa/ after the first or second hit.
• 4/6B: Also a 3-stage attack that does 60/116/170 damage, 0.85/1.7/2.6 Down. Similarly, the last hit knocks the enemy pretty far away making it very limited in what you can follow it up with. You can cancel into BR/CSa/BC only after the second hit.
• So you see that both attacks do the same amount of damage in the first two hits, and you also should step cancel after the second hit to make longer combos. Both have a BR/CSa cancel route. The difference is that 4/6B does considerably less Down than 5B. Also, 4/6B swings completely around and so has vastly superior cut defense than 5B. It seems to have slightly faster start-up time than 5B, but they're really close...
• All this considered, I think you should always choose to start combos with 4/6B. Pretty much the only good thing I can see about 5BB is the small upper if you want to utilize that.
• BDb: Very quick, does 100 damage, 1.7 Down. Slightly lifts the opponent, so multiple BDb in a row actually lifts and drops the enemy a fair distance. The range/reach though isn't so great, even considering this is actually the optimal chase move for E-ZZ.
• 8B: This move is actually 3 micro-hits that do 35 dmg/hit, 0.7 Down/hit, but it apparently tops out at 99 dmg instead of 105. Although a lot of the wiki combos end in Sub, 8B does very comparable (sometimes more damage) and doesn't spend your precious Sub ammo. It's also really accurate and has a long reach, so I really recommend using this over Sub as a combo finisher.
• 2B: discussed above how this is really a valuable tool for moving and messing with your enemy's camera.
• BC: trying to open with this move now is very risky. It moves a little faster now, but you don't have the super armor startup that FA-ZZ has with it. You're much better off canceling into this from 5B or 4/6B if you're going to use it.

Now, it's pointed out above that all of your high damage combos are going to start with BC→AC or BC→B. The issue with this (as I've already briefly commented on) - and why I was doing some melee combo practice in the first place - is that both of these are really tricky to follow-up. Besides the fact that you have to BDC out of both of them to get a followup attack, BC→AC requires you to BDC at some point during the gerobi such that you can't really know how much Down you've just put on the enemy, and the BC→B throws the enemy such a distance that really the only attack you can semi-reliably followup with is BDb - and that isn't really that reliably because there is an inherent height difference between the two attacks leaves your BDb often missing unless you put a lot of practice into perfecting that timing.

 

So, BC→AC does 238~249 damage (which is very respectable) and BC→B does 120 damage. The BC→AC alone can be worth it for the damage, but if you do BC→B and fail at doing one of the couple of good followup combos, you've just left easily over 100 damage on the table that you could have done easily using a basic melee combo. On top of this, even when I have done a few of the super high damage combos I've not been able to consistently produce the damage values the wiki reports for them...

 

If you're a really dedicated FA-ZZ player for mastering the super high damage combos, awesome. If you're a casual FA-ZZ player and need to know a couple of simple, very reliable E-ZZ mode combos, here are some for you:

 

Combos

Note, these are written using 4/6B, but using 5B instead both before and after the first step cancel will produce the same damage.

 

233           6BB→BC→B>8A>A   (This is easier to hit with than >>BDb)

225           6BB>6BBB>8B      (the majority of this damage comes from 6BB>6BBB which does 211)

223           6BB>6BBB>Sub    (>8A is basically the same damage, still downs opponent, and doesn't use up your Sub ammo. Use it.)

223           6BB→BC→AC      (BC→B does 194, →A does 178. This is a downgrade in damage from BC→AC, but the approach is much safer)

219           6BB>6BBB>A

215           6BB>6BBB>AC

209           6BB>6BB→A

209~219   6BB>6BB→CSa    (6BB→CSa on its own is 206)

 

 

244           BDb>>BDb>6BB     (BDb>>BDb does 180)

240           BDb>>BDb>>BDb   (This finishes considerably faster than >6BB)

237           BDb>>BDb>8B

~222         BDb>>BDb>CSa

[akai_GO]

Man that came out a lot lengthier than I thought it would...

 

As a huge tl;dr for that: I think 6BB> is the better defensive melee option, and BDb>> is clearly the better offensive option. If you want to use BC, I recommend canceling into it from 5B or 4/6B. I also recommend ending combos with 8B instead of Sub. You won't get as much damage out of it as you will with other combos, but if you want to use CSa, it's also a lot safer canceling into it from 5B or 4/6B.

 

Yes, there are moves that start with BC→AC>> that can do over 300 damage, but I have found that they are not very consistent, and have pretty poor cut resistance. If you want reliability, there it is in the post above.

[dunn.willsworth.]

Anime ja nai! Love this suit, made a video of it just for fun

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-VViQzYtug