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BKDennis

[FB] ZGMF-X19A Infinite Justice Lacus - Haha time for understanding

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Unit: ZGMF-X19A Infinite Justice

Pilot: Lacus Clyne

Cost: 1000

From: MSG Seed Destiny

Movelist

[A] Beam Rifle

[b.] Beam Saber

[AB] Fatum-01 Launch

[AC] Beam Boomerang

[bC] S-Freedom Assist

[ABC] S-Freedom Full Burst

Lacus IJ cannot transform.

New to the game and I don't know if other infos about her were released so any help is appreciated

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New to the game and I don't know if other infos about her were released so any help is appreciated

Her IJ can't transform unlike Athrun's one and her Burst Attack is Strike Freedom going Full Burst all over the place (without Super Dragoons deployed :/).

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Also naturally, her specs and boosting are at the 1K Cost.

Hey man, that isn't confirmed Kappa

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Some general info on the suit:

Her main has six ammo, and can be charged just like Athruns' Infinite Justice.

Her "Jetpack" sub works about the same as well. (Not an expert on Gundam, so I can't tell if this move is good or not. I myself tend to score knockdowns with it.)

Her boomerang sub has very little range, but it keeps them stunned for a while. I found out that if this move catches enemies on it's return, you can follow it up with a 2B and continue for a combo. I'll look into this more.

New from Athrun IJ, she also has an assist. She summons a small unit that fires three simple BR's. I haven't found a good use for this yet. I'll look into this more as well.

Her super is eh... Well, she summons a unit who fires his lazor. Possible to combo into?

Combo's will follow later.

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To sum up combo's, I've found out her 2B works somewhat as an opener and a pretty good combo filler.

So stuff like: 2B > 5BB 2B > 5BBB works as a simple combo from a 2B.

Another combo I've found is 2B > 5BB > rainbow step > 5BB > rainbow step > 5B.

Here's a few more combo's I've found: *I'll just use RS for rainbow step.

(Most of these combo's are listed starting with 2B, but this does NOT mean that 2B is the greatest combo starter. Try to stick to using this if you KNOW it's going to hit, or be prepared to rainbow step it.)

(Another quirky thing is that if you boost-cancel 2B when it first makes contact, it'll leave the opponent in a paralyzed state, with room for followups. Boomerang works, CSa works too. Jetpack doesn't really work. They get out of stun before it connects. It will slightly(??) connect before the stun ends, but you have to be REALLY close for it, and just doesn't seem worth it IMO.)

(One more of these. You can use her assist after you pull them in fully with a 2B, then sidestep. Not sure if the opponent can get out of this, but if not, it's another thing she can do. You can still do a 2B on the second or third hit of the assist and pull them in for a combo. A simple 5B 8B works neatly here.)

2B > 5BB 2B > 5B > 8B

2B > 5BB 6B > 2B. *Just poke 'em in the nuts when they're down. You can also replace the 2B at the end with a CSa.

2B > 5BBB > 2B. *Another OTG hit, and once again, you can replace the 2B at the end with CSa.

These are my current findings. I hope this helps.

* Hope I am doing this right? I am not a good Gundam player, but I hope I can help out with stuff like this...

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You're really are not I'm afraid. 2b is a situational tool, much like melee in general, and the excessive canceling in your combos is actually less than helpful due to damage proration. Ideally you want to achieve the highest damage you can with the least cancels, your second combo has a whopping 3 cancels for no reason, that's massively boost inefficient AND damage inefficient.

Your string of

2B > 5BB 2B > 5BBB does 205 damage, with additional boost consumption, but unlike every other combo here it has the use of being able to be used without any boost left, so I'll admit this is actually useful

Your string of

2B > 5BB > rainbow step > 5BB > rainbow step > 5B, consumes even more boost and only does 209 damage. For about a 20% increase in boost you only gain 4 points of damage!? That's pretty abysmal and unlike your first combo, it requires massive amounts of boost at all points in the combo.

You're also wrong on the ammo count, it's 5 not 6. As for the BC assist it's used once you've hit your opponent once to hit confirm, and conserve ammo since you don't have much to play with. You also shouldn't really be using the lifter because the Infinite Justice relies on it's thrusters for a lot of it's movement, so once you throw it out you're much more vulnerable.

At the end of the day you're a 1k gen purpose suit with sub-average mobility, health and relatively slow combo speeds. You have no business intentionally seeking out melee scenarios with your 2b when you could much more easily shoot your target in the time it would take to connect or hang back and use your CSa. I'm not an expert on the IJ Lacus edition but you've given really bad advice and I'd prefer it if you've at least tested your stuff and double checked the things you posted.

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Thanks for the oh so friendly point-outs. I'm not giving advice, I said I was noting some things down that I've found for people to try and see if it's worth anything. If some of the things I typed out are wrong, then it can be fixed.

I'm just trying to find things here since I just got the game today. If you want to encourage people to play a certain suit, maybe a better choice of words is adviced if you want them to feel welcome in the community.

In any case, I'm going back to the drawing board and see what else there is.

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Sorry I came on strong but it's really not helpful to post incorrect information without trying to verify it, nor am I encouraging anyone new to the community to pick up a 1k. They are not easy to use and no beginner guide will recommend you pick up any of them because of their high learning curve. The friendliest thing I can say is that this suit is simply hard, and you should really put in a few hours to playing the suit in arcade, seeing how it moves in a real match before posting here and if you like it, maybe you should try Athrun's Infinite Justice because of it's overall superior handling and tool-set.

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Yeah I understand that they tried to sell her that way, but that's not really true in practice just because of the limitations of the 1k cost. It requires a good grasp of the fundamentals and how to handle yourself in another unit very well before you can really approach 1ks with any real finesse.

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I've spend a good 6+ hours on doing nothing but practicing Lacus IJ yesterday, and found some interesting things.

She might have a few problems, but they can be worked around if you play her right in given situations. I feel she does well against suits who focus on zoning, but tends to struggle against suits with really good melee. I've reloaded on practice over and over, to get a more ranged variety of suits to practice against.

I found that suits Rozen Zulu and Gold Frame tend to give me problems whenever I try to space them out. Also Virsago, I think? (I am not familiar with most of these names.) I always found myself on the receiving end of a quick dodge into a combo.

But then against a suit like V2(AB), I was able to space it out and play somewhat of a lame game, which consisted of me doing a simple BR > Boomerang > Lifter. (Also, I found some 3K's are easier to deal with than others, though I am not familiar with any sort of Gundam matchup charts.)

And then there's moving around. Lots and lots of moving around.

I feel Lacus has a good way to move around certain projectiles with a bit more ease. Dunno, I play Delta+ and Zaku Gunner also, and I feel it's a bit more difficult to get around certain things. Don't take this from me, though.

Just a few things I've found during my six hours of practice.

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A: Beam Rifle

A simple, straightforward shot.

Holds 5 ammo. Does 70 damage.

Recharge is about 3-3.5 seconds.

CSa:

A straightforward shot, does 106 damage.

Goes quite far, too. Unsure of how well it tracks, but my guess is that this can track quite well.

B Moves:

5B is a simple slash.

5BB does two simple slashes.

5BBB does said two slashes, and ends with an upwards kick that leaves the opponent OTG'able for either a simple BR, 2B, Boomerang or Lifter.

2B shoots a grappling hook that stuns the opponent and pulls them towards you.

8B has Lacus hanging onto her lifter and smash into the opponent.

6B makes Lacus do a low kick to the Shinn- er, shin.

6BB has Lacus do two kicks that spin the opponent right round.

6BBB has Lacus do three kicks that send the opponent flying a good distance away from her.

AB:Lifter

Lacus fires her lifter towards the opponent, knocking them down. This move travels quite far, even if you're not in red lock. Does 90 damage.

* I wouldn't really recommend doing that, though. Just saying.

AC:Boomerang

Lacus fires a boomerang towards the opponent. The range on this is significantly smaller than on her lifter, but unlike her lifter, this move leaves the opponent stunned on contact.

This move WILL hit the opponent on it's forward trip, as well as when it comes back.

Does 12 damage per hit.

BC:Some guy comes in and shoots his gun like pewpewpew.

Lacus summons an assist *I am bad at names. Sue me.* that comes in and fires a total of three shots for 116 damage. Comes out kind of slow. Does NOT knock down on it's own, but a simple BR after the three shots will. You can also use the Lifter, or even a CSa after three succesful shots.

*Only use I've found for this personally is to punish a landing or if you dodge an attack that leaves the opponent on a lot of recovery.

Combo's:

-Still working on those-

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I've spend a good 6+ hours on doing nothing but practicing Lacus IJ yesterday, and found some interesting things.

She might have a few problems, but they can be worked around if you play her right in given situations. I feel she does well against suits who focus on zoning, but tends to struggle against suits with really good melee. I've reloaded on practice over and over, to get a more ranged variety of suits to practice against.

I found that suits Rozen Zulu and Gold Frame tend to give me problems whenever I try to space them out. Also Virsago, I think? (I am not familiar with most of these names.) I always found myself on the receiving end of a quick dodge into a combo.

But then against a suit like V2(AB), I was able to space it out and play somewhat of a lame game, which consisted of me doing a simple BR > Boomerang > Lifter. (Also, I found some 3K's are easier to deal with than others, though I am not familiar with any sort of Gundam matchup charts.)

And then there's moving around. Lots and lots of moving around.

I feel Lacus has a good way to move around certain projectiles with a bit more ease. Dunno, I play Delta+ and Zaku Gunner also, and I feel it's a bit more difficult to get around certain things. Don't take this from me, though.

Just a few things I've found during my six hours of practice.

Maybe this is because you're new to handling funnels and incoms? Those are suits that are relatively decent at zoning because of these tools so it's difficult to understand where your problem lies here if that's the case. Could you please explain the problems they present to you so we can better understand why these suits can zone you but not other zoning suits? Also I'll mention this again, as a 1k you should never take on another unit in melee if you can help it, even with Lacus' good strings because of how little boost you have to waste and how few tools you have to force a melee win anyway. You don't have the health pool to make any really big mistakes, and even a ranged unit can deal the IJ's 300 HP pool in two combos so the less risk you take the better

Out of curiousity are you practicing this 1v1 vs the AI or is this during a real match?

This is more of an issue with how you move right now probably. The Gunner Zaku does have mobility problems but it has no business being up close to stuff, allowing it to content itself far back in redlock and take it's time while dodging. If something approaches it, it needs to blast it and run away. Meanwhile the Delta + has a lot of freedom of movement as it doesn't need to cancel it's BR to fire twice and can thus maintain any boosting pattern it so pleases as long as it remembers to face the target. If you feel an attack's guidance is really strong, try side stepping or fuwa stepping (sidestep then jump).

A:This is a standard beam rifle but you might note that because of it's low ammo pool it's not really recommended to zunda with it much. This is where Lacus' other tools come in

CSa: It's tracking is a little bad for the type of attack it is but this is what you should primarily use for footsies due to your low ammo pool overall. Nail someone with it and it'll do a pretty fair amount of damage

B:Well...Lacus has good melee for a 1k but it's just not recommended to use it unless you're sure you won't be shot or countered. Unlike the Efreet or the Zaku 3 her melee is both kind of slow and she has no reliable way of making her melee easy or safe to connect and unlike the Gouf her combos are fairly easy to cut.

AB: This should be your anti-melee option if your beam rifle or 2b fails. It's got a wide hitbox, instantly knocks down and if you're aiming down at a target it returns pretty quickly. Like the CSa it can be used to conserve your ammo during footsies.

AC boomerang: It...won't always hit on the return trip, because it's a boomerang. The return vector is dependent on your position and spacing which makes it a double edged sword. If you toss it and it misses it can very well hit the target on the return pass if they come at you and cut combos aimed at you, or if you catch them at the apex of the boomerang throw, it will grind against them and act like a BR shot in terms of function without the damage.

BC: It's the Strike Freedom for her assist And as I've mentioned before you can hit confirm it using any attack Lacus has, thus making it a lot safer than just throwing it out. A>BC will knock down cleanly so it's honestly better to use it in that capacity with how slow it is unless you're extremely sure of your timing.

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Well, they were some of the things I actually tested and checked, thus fitting the verification part.

Also, I don't play Lacus as a melee suit, but I do like how she comes with decent to semi-good melee out of the box to counter SOME of those pesky rush-attemps or punish a whiffed projectile from your opponent. I tend to use boomerang a lot as it's really good, despite it's lack in range. It's definetly not comparable to Gunner Zakus' tomahawk, at all. But you can get decent damage off of a confirm into lifter, and get a knockdown to boot.

And about her ammo count.... I don't often Zunda with her. I just use it if I KNOW I can either do enough damage for an almost kill, the kill, or to get some easy damage and have the ammo to spare. Like, before the opponent gets up, you should've recovered at least one more ammo for her gun, so you have a reserve if you get in another confirm.

I will also say that her lifter hitbox is huge, and definetly stops melee if they just rush in and not to a sidestep. But I often found myself missing lifter after a BR for some reason. Maybe I was out of range or I was too close? Not sure what causes that...

Also. I have played Lacus online against friends, and I've found that I do semi-well with her. Depends on who my opponents are using, but I've not yet gotten enough experience as to say what she struggles against or problems that might occur if you use, say, X in situation Y or why you shouldn't do this against that. I've just gotten the game after playing vanilla EXVS for a while, and going to a smaller version of IJ just takes a bit of time getting used to.

But I don't think she's as bad as people say. If you keep being mobile and can succesfully read into situations and get confirms with the tools she's given, she can easily be a nuisance. But she's definetly not easy to play. She takes careful handling being a 1k to boot. She's practically dead after a succesful full combo from the opponent, or heck, even a clever timed CSa or anything else that packs a punch. 300HP is not much to work with...

Also, I forgot to mention another thing. Cancelling her Boomerang into S.Freedom assist on the forward throw won't work. I've found it only works on it's return trip. So that's a thing to keep in mind if you DO want to confirm off of boomerang and you don't have lifter/CSa available to you. It just barely keeps them in stun long enough, but it's something, I guess.

I'll take her on more spins on the wide world we call the internet, and see if I can get any more specifics while doing so.

Also, I'll hold off on combo's...I don't think I'm qualified enough to talk about them when I often forget to pay attention to my BOOST gauge when doing combo's or firing shots. I'll let someone else do that....If anyone else is willing to give Lacus a shot.

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AB's tracking seems to be significantly weaker (dare I say nonexistant) than the 2.5k IJ. I prefer using it after landing a BR or two.

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I haven't used Lacus in a while.... 

There's only one thought flying around in my head, nagging at me, saying: "Why isn't she a 2k? Why isn't she a 2k...? WHY isn't she a 2!! K!!??"

 

She just begged to have a boomerang with better range rather than having everything she does have dropped to 1k standards. 

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I dont think it matters. I treat her boomerang the same way I treat Gunner Zaku's, "I'm throwing it. Move."

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I haven't used Lacus in a while.... 

There's only one thought flying around in my head, nagging at me, saying: "Why isn't she a 2k? Why isn't she a 2k...? WHY isn't she a 2!! K!!??"

 

She just begged to have a boomerang with better range rather than having everything she does have dropped to 1k standards. 

Because there are already 2ks with boomerangs, (Blueframe, Strike) but there are no 1k boomerang users, so she brings something new to 1ks with that, while as a 2k she would be less valuable to the roster. Furthermore, 2.5k IJ already backs most of the time, so 1k version gives a more front-oriented version. I can definitely understand wanting a less-expensive back IJ though.

 

She does feel significantly weak to me(Why 300 hp instead of 330..??), but i dont really play boomerang mechs, so I don't feel like I can really judge that well.

 

"dropped to 1k standards" is also a bit strange to say considering 2ks and 1ks usually have the same movement speed and boost gauge length, and 1ks usually have some pretty amazing abilities such as gouf wirehop and MG, lagowe everything, zaku2 grenades, zudah csB/BC/AB, etc. 2ks do often have longer redlock and tend to be more well-rounded it seems to me, though.

 

Also, the JP wiki makes the point that Lacus's boomerang being shorter range also means it returns quicker, which has self-defense benefits.

I also dont understand why people bring up gunnerzaku's tomahawk when that doesn't have the same sort of hitbox or return IIRC. Straightforward stun pokes are not really like boomerangs.

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So I am just trying this again.

I may have found a combo with Lacus that's cut-safer and a bit easier on boost. I'm using RS for rainbow step, I forgot the notation.

6BB2B > RS > 6BB > backdash jump > A.

 

Consumes a BIT over half boost for 176 danage. 

 

I've been ignoring Lacus for too long, but I do feel like I want to give her a second chance.
Also, if I worded my opinion a bit out of place, oh well. It was just an idea that MAYBE IF she was a 2k, I wonder how she would be then. That's kind of what I was going for there. I do know there's 1k's with great assets, but what makes IJ work is the boomerang. Just feels like it wouldn't have hurt to extend the range a tad bit.

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Also, looking back on my previous notes... I am glad I learned how to edit and do research properly before flapping my gums.

 

I hope more people will give Lacus a chance. I think she has potential, but it just takes a while to break her open, it feels like.

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