[Xrd] Axl Gameplay Discussion

[Horokei]

Doublepost but whatever. There is several things I thought about:

1. Can Axl cancels Rashousen on hit? If yes then at which point (when he catches opponent and slides to him or after explosion) and how much damage he can do afterward. It would be funny if Axl has guaranteed combo for 100% tension (any blockstring into rensen rc rashou rc combo)

2. What will happens if Axl cancels his Raieisai somewhere at midrange of his flight? Will he retain a inertia of his flight? If yes then there is some good crossup possibilities like c.S 28(superjump-install for autoturning in the air) 5H raiei yrc j.K or something

3. High/Low/Throw mixups (j.K/land 2K/ad j.P/throw) after YRC of JI Raieisai or JI 6H. Personaly I think that this kind of mixups sucks and can be shutted down easily with 6P+H OS or backdash YRC (cuz opponent is neutral and YRC has 20f freeze. Too easy to read and react to incoming mixup), but if slowdown is good enough then this kind of stuff should be safe at least and allows Axl to retain pressure for 25%.

4. Is rensen rc blockstun is big enough to do something like rensen rc dashjump j.K/land 2K/ad j.P/throw

5. How good Axl's tension gain in Xrd compared to whole cast? Pre Xrd it wasn't good IMHO. But seeing Xrd Slayer gaining 50% just for 3-4 second of walking forward is ridiculous so maybe Axl has something like that.

That's all for now

EDIT. Just saw meaty Rashousen. WTF

EDIT2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiJWrtUn0jw

More Axl at 1h30m.

Mortal Counter 5P has huge slowdown and hitstun. Axl can do dash in 5K afterward for combo.

Saw rensen~8 rc combo. Looks good.

21214S staggers vs grounded opponent

Just saw RASHOU RC BOMBER LOOP.

Axl can YRC Haitaka cancel.

Combo route ...2S j.H j.D Bomber rc land 6K is possible

6K Raiei RRC j.D.. What?

Watches, do a video thread please.

Edited February 23, 2014 by Horokei

[Digital Watches]

Is it just me, or does 6P seem way better now? I'm seeing it beat a lot of things I think it wouldn't have before.

[Horokei]

I tried to summarize how all new changes and mechanics affect Axl's gameplay. inb4, Sorry for all mystakes.

Generally, new Axl is his AC+R version with #R aircombos/loops and several new tools:

He lost 4 specials: j.63214S (Kokuu, green airchain), 623P (Hachisubaku, counter/autoguard move), 623H (H Bentengari, no more easy knockdowns) and 63214H (H Raieisai, Axl goes to his planet but fails and falls down).

Rensengeki ([4]~6S) and it's followups, S Raieisageki (63214S) and Tenhouseki (214P/K) look unchanged. Axl Bomber (j.623H) is his old #R version.

Rensengeki builds ~25% of RISC Level if blocked. Cool.

Axl's DP, Bentengari, was reworked. Now it's fast DP with full invul and great hitbox. On hit it do blowback, on CH it has knockdown. Recovery seems fast, so his DP is really good now. It also has hitbox behind Axl.

New stance, Haitaka no Kamae (63214H), is slow to come out but has fast fullscreen followups. Followups can be cancelled in each other up to 6 times even on whiffs. On hit it would be a 20-30% combo. Also it can be cancelled, cancel's animation is also slow but can be YRC'ed. Haitaka's followups are usual hits, not a projectiles. They have a hurtbox so they can be hit with other moves, BS'ed and, more important, shutted down completely by projectiles. IMHO this move will end up as a combo filler/chip dmg after certain setups. It will be useful in neutral in specific matchups (Potemkin, Slayer). Chipp, Millia, Bedman, Venom, Ky and Axl can deal with this stance easily.

His new overdrive, Kairagi Yakou (214214S), looks like Rensen and pull opponent back like 2H. It's superfast (almost instant). Staggers on hit, but seems it does not have any invul.

Now his normals:

5P and 2P are 1-hit moves. 2P can be cancelled into f.S and 6H. 5P - into 2S and 6K.

3P is 1-hit move and looks like #R version. On CH it has a very small float and knockdown.

j.6P also looks like 1-hit move (is it a curse of all P-chains? lol)

2S, 6K, 2H and j.S are 2-hit moves, pretty similar to AC and AC+R. No info about 2H 2D string but probably it's lost.

6H's hop looks higher. It will be useful for YRC mixups. Also it has a bounce on CH.

No more info. I wait for more 60fps vids of Axl in good quality, so I can compare Xrd framedata with #R and AC+R.

Now about his gameplay. First of all. New RC system work great with him. Why?

1. Axl can YRC/PRC whiffed moves (+ Rashousen) to be safe.

2. Axl can RRC any move on hit and to do a combo from it, no matter what a move or where it hits. Rensen~8? Rashousen? Full screen 5P? Sure, just spend 50%.

3. New mixup possibilities + unblockable setups.

So generally, his poking/zoning/mixups capacities MUCH scarier when he has 50%. It makes him more meter dependant though and there is no good option to extend pressure for 25%. He can mixup with 6H/Raiei YRC, but opponent can deal with it since he will be at neutral already. That's mean meter managment will be even more important part of his gameplay.

His defence is better too. New DP is amazing and BS works really good with Axl since he can do a combo from succesful BS at any range. Also backdash YRC is possible. IDK about Benten YRC (probably impossible), but Byakuerenshou (2363214H) YRC should work. Also BS not so effective against Axl's pokes since it hard to do a combo from it due to range.

Also Axl would really love Danger Time. This mechanic makes any move a Mortal Counter, which works as a regular CH with RC slowdown. Characters who'll benefit from DT the most are those with good single hit pokes. And Axl has tons of them (5P, 2P, f.S, 3P, 5H, 6H Benten?, j.6P, Haitaka's followups etc). Axl can do fullscreen 5P MC, then dash 5K into combo. Neat.

There is also other stuff like meaty Rashousen (lol) and new combo routes. That definetely not all what Axl can do now.

Edited February 24, 2014 by Horokei

[Epic]

New Benten is just borderline stupid. Due to it's speed and range people are spamming it like there's no tomorrow.

Why block when you can just DP and win the exchange 90% of the time?

[Digital Watches]

I'm curious about what the frames are on block. It seems pretty safe from what I've seen, but then again punishing DPs is something people get better at over a game's lifetime.

[Horokei]

Xrd animation really strange. It seems that hit animation appear 1f faster than actual hit-/blockstun animation. So I've counted some frames for Axl and this 1f of hit animation I've counted as part of startup (else a lot of Axl's moves would be 1f faster)

Frames:

5P - 7f startup, #R speed

c.S - 7f, #R

6K - 11f, #R

All other normals look unchanged

Benten - 9f, total animation 40f. I dunno about "-" on block, I've not seen blocked Benten in my 60fps footage but it cause 14-15f of hitstop, so it's probably lvl3 move. If I calculated it right, Benten ~ -15 on block.

Haitaka ~40f startup

214214S - +7 on standing block

[Greyvangelist]

http://youtu.be/KiJWrtUn0jw?t=1h33m40s

so at 1:33:40 he goes for a Bomber loop but drops the 5K relaunch after he lands. Is it possible to do a meterless Bomber loop or did this guy just drop it? Just wondering, since I've watched a decent amount of Axl matches and still haven't really seen anyone go for loops.

[Epic]

Must have been your bad luck, because I've seen several where they managed to do it in the corner although I think two reps is the max you can pull off.

[Horokei]

6K can be canceled into c.S.

[Izusa]

Haitaka having a 40f start-up... It's going to be a scrub killer. That, and Potemkins are going to have a rough time dealing with that ontop of Axl's already existing tools, but I still feel like in actual matches the best way to get into it is going to have to be an RC off of Rensengeki. At the very least that thing does way too much damage to count as a super, but I wish I could find out how much tension gain you get back from hitting that combo.  

YRC system benefits Axl a ton lmao.
 

[Digital Watches]

@izusa re: YRCs: Yup, I'm looking forward to baiting out people whose anti-Axl gameplan is roughly "I think these moves hit his limbs, let's spam them" even more!

[setsu113]

Yoo have any of you guys seen any more footage from shuuto ? He wasa very good axl in my opinion.. Does anyone know anythingin regards to why he only played the game so briefly ?

[Digital Watches]

He played through at least slash and most of AC, and I think he was around during #R. I'm sure he's around, just doesn't get recorded much or something

[Izusa]

Most Axl players don't come out of the wood work. >:  

[setsu113]

What do you mean wood work ? I'm not up to date on my American catch phrases :p

[Digital Watches]

Man, the Sol matchup looks even more about footsies than it was before (and it was always about footsies IMO). Niiyama pulls off the whole "keep calm and carry on" playstyle really well, and I think that speaks to what the changes are going to make Axl play like overall in Xrd: You're going to need to be patient, get your positioning right, and just play a fundamentals game, since the high-pressure style is way less meter-efficient now.

[Digital Watches]

@Horokei: Moved your post to the video thread.

[Horokei]

Someone already mentioned this but in Xrd untechable frames on rensen were greatly nerfed.

VS standing opponents ...5H rensen would still do a knockdown (probably) while ...2D rensen would not. Even ...2D rensen~2 in corner does not work now. I'm confused how Axl is supposed to get a knockdown? Rensen~8 RC haitaka? lol

 

Raieisaigeki gives enough time to do jump-in low/ad oki.

 

Also lack of rensen frc hits him harder than I thought.

[Digital Watches]

Haitaka isn't just a zoning tool for Axl, it's like the strongest zoning tool I've ever seen. And also does pressure. And adds damage to everything. And makes julienne fries. Jesus.

[SuperJ]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=a6NzHWzGDrs#t=3399

 

each subsequent stance chain does more and more chip. the last one is ridiculous. 1/4 of the damage in that round was probably chip :|

[Digital Watches]

Wow, seriously? That's nuts.

[Xtra_Zero]

Maybe someone here can help me.  I've been playing on and off with Sol since release and I still don't have a solid strategy for Haitaka at fullscreen.  I have to make a guess at some point because if I don't chip will kill me.  I can't jump out and block because he can cancel the whiffs and just force me to block more.  There are options, but all of them are extremely high-risk since any hit from Haitaka turns into 30% damage and a free ride back to the corner.  At the end of the day I can't think of anything that isn't just a high risk hard read.  Do you have any suggestions?

[4r5]

Haven't touched Xrd yet, but standard rules of engagement against Axl still applies, yes? Axl whiffs, you move in closer to a better position.

 

Assuming Axl hasn't put you in a checkmate. You block the low chain, you just immeadately start running forward. He can't do a low chain again, so he either whiffs a chain over your head, manually cancels the stance, or Roman Cancels. All cases progress you towards a more winable state, you either gain ground, or he loses meter, or both. If he whiffs a mid or high chain, then you're probably in his face by now.

[Dream Maker]

Axl can only chain Haitaka attacks up to 6 times, after that he is forced into his stance exit animation (which takes quite some time). So if you wait for that, you should have enough time to approach and at the very least reach a distance close enough so that it's not safe for him to use Haitaka anymore. Trying to escape or break-in at any other moment is pure suicide in my opinion, at least for most characters.

[ARESone]

Is it possible for him to cancel the stance earlier and 're-enter it before the opponent realises it? This would lead to some great mind games, I guess.