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[Xrd] King Ky - Gameplay Discussion

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According to Shoryuken, 6HS recovers 1F faster.

 

I tried 6HS > 3HS link and it looks much easier now. Or is it just me?

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The link is the same.

 

The recovery frame was turned into another active frame on the 2nd hit. Move is the same duration it's just now the active frames are like 8,2 with 2 frames of recovery instead of 8,1 with 3f of recovery. meaning it's still +15 on block, +17 on hit (forces crouching on hit so it's always +17)

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You're right.

 

I've never been successful with this link before, but now i can do it with ease. Don't know why.

 

But what i can't do at all is the dash VT for ground combos. I'm always late, it's very hard. I'm trying with the motion 66236HS but even though either the dash won't come out, or I'm late with the VT. The buffer for dashing after GS is very short.

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yrc air stun edge has no landing recovery. cheers

 

that makes this yrc really useful for pressure/neutral. i wonder if this is a system-wide change or if it's just that move. if j.D YRC removes landing recovery, that could be useful for oki

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that makes this yrc really useful for pressure/neutral. i wonder if this is a system-wide change or if it's just that move. if j.D YRC removes landing recovery, that could be useful for oki

About that... It does and it's extremely good for mix up in pressure. Not sure I really like it for Oki that much honestly. But you can do shit like after 2P>5K>then forward j.D>YRC>j.S for overhead. Once people are aware of the quick overhead option you can do the YRC nothing 5K or whatever. Also works for throwing and whatever else. It's nice because when your blocked the pressure string doesn't end. I've been messing with it since the new version dropped. In the corner you get the no pushback glitch too.

 

In terms of what you can get off of it. j.S>j.D>6H>3H>214K>623H>Etc in corner combos. But it's like +25-ish hitstun after the j.D anything you want except 5D combos.  Works really well after 5P, 5K, 2D. 6H/2H/5S have too much pushback/blockstun.

 

 

Also I think j.D itself has less landing recovery. It feels like a lot less than 8f now.

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i was experimenting with it last night. j.D YRC, 2D > (j.D hits) > 214K works haha. probably the most damaging option off j.D mixup, but there's a big gap for people to mash out of before 2D.

 

j.D YRC itself can get interrupted by mash 5P pretty easily, so i wouldn't recommend this unless you can condition the opponent/opponent lacks this knowledge. maybe on knockdown?

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Yea poor man's FB Star is pretty much true. I miss FB Star.

 

As for the 5P mash. If they read it 100% yea 5P mash will win. Nice thing about YRC is you get a flash with it where you have a small freeze to see what they are doing. If you can see the 5P mash coming you can just FD for a counterhit j.D which is fine. I don't think most people are going to be looking for it and reacting to your 5P/5K and be expecting you to jump right there. 2D tho I can see. It's not like you have many other options you can do. I guess you can delay chain to stun edge YRC for a frame trap there. But yea. Options are limited.

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Hey, I found something earlier today that makes no sense regarding jD's landing recovery and I need help.

 

So current frame data states that his jD has 8f of additional landing recovery. According to 1.05 change notes, that was not touched. Ky's jHS is a lvl 2 attack and has 14f of hitstun on hit. This was also not changed. Finally, his 5k has 5f startup and cl.S has 7f of startup, and that is still the same.

 

Earlier I was testing some jD things and I seemed to notice that if I did an air normal without a double jump before landing from a jD, I seemed to cancel the landing recovery. I then started testing this in the corner by doing:

 

jD (far away that it whiffs) > airdash > jS jHS > land > 5k.

 

This would mean that for this to connect, i had to space it perfectly so that jHS hit and then lands immediately the frame after. This seemed to work, but it could have been me successfully getting the 1f link.

 

So to debunk it, I tested it with land > clS instead, since with its longer start up, that should never, ever connect. As I was testing I could see and feel the landing recovery at times, but there were instances where I still comboed into the clS, which mathematically should have been impossible. 8f from landing recovery and 7f start up means there should be a 15f gap before they get hit on frame 16. Upon hitting jHS, you have 14f of hitstun to combo with before they block on frame 15.

 

You can even put them in the corner, double jump over > jd > falling jHS >clS. This means that unless you yrc you will (or should) have landing recovery and ultimately be impossible to connect. But it can. While this isn't so important combo wise, being able to stop the landing recovery without expending resources or after you've used them all is. Can anyone else help me test this, or does anyone know more about the landing recovery in general? Because on paper this sounds pretty scary.

 

And if this is old news, can we update the dustloop wiki :psyduck: ?

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im guessing you dont know this but hitting an air normal 1f  before landing cancels landing recovery its a trick that's been around pretty much forever

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As for the 5P mash. If they read it 100% yea 5P mash will win. Nice thing about YRC is you get a flash with it where you have a small freeze to see what they are doing. If you can see the 5P mash coming you can just FD for a counterhit j.D which is fine. I don't think most people are going to be looking for it and reacting to your 5P/5K and be expecting you to jump right there. 2D tho I can see. It's not like you have many other options you can do. I guess you can delay chain to stun edge YRC for a frame trap there. But yea. Options are limited.

 

i was able to hit ky out of j.D YRC before the flash, so it's even riskier than you describe. I don't recall if I IBed or not though...

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i was experimenting with it last night. j.D YRC, 2D > (j.D hits) > 214K works haha. probably the most damaging option off j.D mixup, but there's a big gap for people to mash out of before 2D.

j.D YRC itself can get interrupted by mash 5P pretty easily, so i wouldn't recommend this unless you can condition the opponent/opponent lacks this knowledge. maybe on knockdown?

In a vacuum, yes, you "can mash 5P" there. But Ky has other mixups and pressure he can use, that if you transition into this, I don't think the first thing your opponent thinks of is mash. It's a dangerous proposition to be mashing when Ky can mask his sequences in LAYERS.

And this doesn't even factor in conditioning that you can put your opponent through, or the high levels of pressure your opponent would be in a TOURNAMENT setting.

I'd say this mixup is better than what we give it credit for. This sequence was around in the old GGXX games when Ky had no landing recovery on his j.D and it was effective back then. IMO it's more effective now with the built in YRC freeze.

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unless you space it like max range, i'd air throw anyone who would even dare try this

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unless you space it like max range, i'd air throw anyone who would even dare try this

I'm not too shabby with air throws myself, but if you manage to air throw a Ky player out of a 5K, 9D YRC, fall S/land 5K sequence (magic air throw considering), you'll get nothing but ultimate props from me!

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it's actually quite easy since 5k doesn't have much blockstun on it and you'd be hanging in the air for a good while before you can yrc with guaranteed projectile timing

 

i think it's possible to use it as oki on a non max range slide and get safe jump timing on the j.s while you're at it, normally i do sliding cse yrc off slide but this has higher damage potential, though not as strong in terms of actual mixup

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it's actually quite easy since 5k doesn't have much blockstun on it and you'd be hanging in the air for a good while before you can yrc with guaranteed projectile timing

i think it's possible to use it as oki on a non max range slide and get safe jump timing on the j.s while you're at it, normally i do sliding cse yrc off slide but this has higher damage potential, though not as strong in terms of actual mixup

See, that's the problem I have with this. You're obviously not going to start this with 5K off bat to make it predictable enough to IB the 5K. You can be in the middle of a 6HS or CSE pressure and transition into this to mask your intentions within a fast paced speed of a match. The YRC freeze certainly helps, AND don't forget the fact that you still need one more frame to stand up and try to air throw (from a crouched position). It's not as easy as you make it sound but it is possible. If you're doing this in layers though and MORESO during a pressure filled tournament context, my money is on you not air throwing this at all.

And if you do, mad props. You air threw me and you knocked me down - not any different from many other ways of getting knocked down.

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oh you definitely wont beat it everytime but just the fact that ky jumped is a quite a big factor to take into consideration and it is possible to react to him jumping to beat this in multiple ways without ibing especially with the air s stun edge attack level nerf making jumping even less appealing of an option during pressure in my opinion

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You know, I'm actually glad that during my ACR+ days, I branched off and discovered how much I like Ky. Normally, I don't typically go for the "jack of all trades, master of none" type characters, but Ky is really fun to use. Sure, he's a bit simply on the surface, but digging deeper with him is part of the fun. The balance of his character is appreciated.

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So... I think they nerfed Ky 5HS for 1.1.  Sure, they added a stagger to it (yay buff?) but I have reasons to believe that they made the hitbox for this a tad smaller.

How I found out is in training mode, practicing combos as usual.  My trusty reliable "uppercut punish" of 5S, 6K xx Split Seal, 5HS xx Stun Dipper hardly works now due to the fact that 5HS would randomly whiff.  So I thought "Huh, that's strange, I've done this combo a million times in training mode - on Sol of all people, and now it's suddenly whiffing?"

Then I went to the corner and tried to do a typical high damaging Ky combo: 5S, 6K xx Split Seal, 5HS xx DC Sacred Edge.  Again, 5HS would whiff, and again, this is a combo I must've done over a million times and wanted to commit to memory so that I can confirm max damage combo every time I connected a hit and I had 50% meter.  So then I thought, "maybe it's usually easier on crouching".

Tried to do 6HS, (microdash) 5S, 6K xx Split Seal, 5HS xx DC Sacred Edge in the corner.  Again, 5HS would whiff and THIS is definitely a combo I practiced many times to the point that I can confirm into this without thinking about it.

Did further testing, and I found out that 5HS will ONLY connect in these combos if you have sufficient running momentum (about 2-3 seconds worth of dashing forward).  But I've never had to worry about having running momentum in advance to even land these combos.

I can only conclude for now that they made the hitbox on 5HS a tad smaller.  Pretty important to know if you depend on 5HS for proper spacing/poking, and of course, combo confirms.

If anyone else wants to test this for themselves, feel free.  I wanna make sure I'm not losing it!

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Couldn't that also be caused by a slight change to the way split ciel pushes back opponents? I haven't played 1.1 nearly enough, but it doesn't *seem* to have a smaller hitox.

 

But we all know they did make changes to split ciel.

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Couldn't that also be caused by a slight change to the way split ciel pushes back opponents? I haven't played 1.1 nearly enough, but it doesn't *seem* to have a smaller hitox.

 

But we all know they did make changes to split ciel.

IIRC Split Seal pushes off LESS, that's why you can end 2D xx Split Seal and be able to oki now without pushing your opponent too far off.  But this doesn't explain why the 5HS whiffs, if the pushback is less, THIS should mean it should be easier to land 5HS as well, lol

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IIRC Split Seal pushes off LESS, that's why you can end 2D xx Split Seal and be able to oki now without pushing your opponent too far off. But this doesn't explain why the 5HS whiffs, if the pushback is less, THIS should mean it should be easier to land 5HS as well, lol

I haven't had problems with it randomly whiffing at all. I do know it will whiff on Millia if you don't have momentum because of her hitbox being smaller after split Ciel then other characters. Also you do need to be point blank for the combo to work on pretty much everyone. It doesn't have anything to do with 5Hs being nerfed.

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for what its worth some characters hit boxs the first hit of stagger they pull back a bit more than after its going on for awhile. I know when ive practiced combos and even in my combo video for some links ive had to time them worse or else HS will wiff. So it could be perhaps because its easier to its actually making it harder if you get what im saying.

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Would we say Ky vs Sol in 1.1 is even now or still in Sol's favor?

 

Along with Ky vs Sin is it still in Sin's favor slightly now in this version?

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Man after playing xrd ky because of no baiken i went back  to ac+ and tryed him out. why did they need to remove crossup j.s and crossup greedsavor when you got characters in the game like milia being completely retarded...

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