[Xrd] Bedman Gameplay Discussion

[NecroTheReaper]

Yes, they both make you land faster if doing a downward air dash.  FDing is used more for baiting DP's while wiff j.H is used for mix-ups between 883j.P/K and 883j.H wiff>2K/grab.  FDing is also a good way to extend your air grab range cuz you can air dash FD and air grab, which can beat some A2As

[Lynxfort]

beddy just had one change.. a nerf in his throw range -_-

Quote

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[Bedman]

 

- Throw

Throw range reduced making it equal to Sol (and other characters)

 

http://pastebin.com/hYWSgCjv

[Mebaro]

patch notes for rev 2 location test got released, heres what i understood:

- front dash: travel faster and smaller hurtbox, theres also something about stiffness? 

backdash and crouch guard: smaller hurtbox?

- 2k -> 5hs is gone (ouch)

- 2hs and 3hs: changed into normal hit?

- j.p: bigger hurtbox

- air throw can combo after rc

- 6hs: changed into a new move

- DEJA-VU IN THE AIR!!!!!

 

[Mebaro]

I just tried rev 2 bedman, heres my impressions:

- 2hs and 3hs: this nerf is brutal, wont luanch opponent. Basically any combo involves 2/3hs is gone.

- air deja vu: this needs more research, but so far is underwhelming.

- new 6hs: its 2 hits(can be extended to 4 hits) with forward momentum, special cancel-able. Replacing the old 6hs with this feels like a nerf.

No 2k into 5hs: this is also a huge nerf. 

Things not looking too good for bedman, atleast hes not dea‥

 

[Kikirin]

How's the startup and comboability of the new 6H? Are there any new gatlings into it? With the forward momentum from it, it sounds possible that we could confirm a combo from longer ranges, like off max range f.S.

Does 2H combo into any specials on normal grounded hit, e.g. 236A or 236S?

Does 2/3H launch on counterhit?

[Mebaro]

i think its the same gatlings as the old 6hs which is from 2/5p and 2k, i tried corner throw into new 6hs but its too slow. but feels a bit faster than the old 6hs.

i tried 2hs -> deja vu task c in the corner but didnt combo, 2hs -> tack b also didnt combo.

2/3hs still launch on counterhit, but its not a knockdown anymore well at least not the mortal counterhit.

[Mebaro]

New 6hs is special cancelable only in 1st and 2nd hit. Can only gatling from 2/5p, 

2/3hs: airborne hit will launch, i managed to do 6hs (4hits) RC 2hs. 

[Blade]

So 6H crossup move is gone.  Too scary for most players?  Are we now limited to Task A' for Crossups now?

[Mebaro]

J.s cant combo with air deja vu b.

It seems bedman mixups got weaker, and i feel the new tools helps him only in zoning and  pressure,

 

[Blade]

Hopefully it's only for Loketest reactions, otherwise that's awful.  I hope more Bedman players voice their thoughts on this to ARCSys.  He needs those mixups, otherwise he's like a gimped Axl Low or something.

[Blade]

What are Bedman's gatling routes like?  Can he do anything off 2K?

[Mebaro]

ggxrd rev2 2nd loketest report:

im not sure what exactly changed. i didnt find any patch notes, but i feel like nothing changed from the 1st loketest.

-  2/3hs air hit acts like the current version, so you still can do j.236hs -> 2hs -> 236HS

- 2k to 5hs is still gone

- didnt find any use for the new 6hs

- air deja vu has long recovery, if you do it after normal jump you will land. feels really risky without YRC.

- if you TK the air deja vu, you will lose your air momentum.

if anyone wants me to try something, please tell me. the loketest will last for a week, plenty time to experiment. 

 

[Blade]

How does Counterhit 6H, 2H, 1H, and 3H work?

Also are 1H/2H/3H still Jump-cancellable on hit/block?

6H might still be a good zoning tool for stuff like Hemi Jack sheep setups. (Is 6H special-cancellable or jump cancellable?)

Also please test TK Task A Prime on okizeme, see if it still has crossup after knockdown.

In addition what would be some good jump 3K combos now that 2K isn't in the 5H route.

Also test effectiveness of 2P in to combos.

[Mebaro]

counter hit 2/3hs is same as current version.

1/2/3hs is Jump-cancellable on hit and block.

new 6hs: can cancel from 2/5/6p 5k but wont combo, its only  special-cancellable on 2 first hits, not jump cancellable. nothing special on CH.

TK Task A Prime on okizeme will crossup.

good jump 3K combos? will 2k -> 5hs is not the problem, its 2hs losing its launch properties. i guess we have to stick with B&B and finish with task b or 2d

as for 2p, did it changed?, it felt same to me.

 tried 2/3hs -> deja vu b but didnt combo.

i did in the corner 1hs -> RC -> 6hs -> 5s -> 5hs -> task c.

[Blade]

Okay, here's something to try:

High Jump in to Task C, then back off.

High Jump again in to Deja Vu Task C, YRC it then do Task C again!

(The trick is getting both beds falling down on top of the opponent at the same time).

Just tell me your impression of how that feels.

[Jocelot]

Interesting stuff from a twitter thread started by GCYoshi...

 

https://twitter.com/ottori_Gengar/status/847463250346127361

 

It's nice to see the new 6HS in action and what kind of things you can get off it in the corner. GCYoshi also says that air Deja Vu does open interesting new opportunities, especially with Task A Prime. Guess we'll have to wait and see. I believe the Bed will live on!

 

[Blade]

That looks very character-specific though.

I'm hoping there's some kind of shenanigans you can do with 6H cancels (depending on which hit you cancel with).

I might even consider using 6H for RC juggles if it pays off.

[Blade]

My thoughts on 6H:

Special Cancel on either first or second hit might be nice at range, but up close make sure you only use it mid-combo.  5K > 6H seems viable.

Other thoughts:

2K > 2S > 2D / 2K > cl.5S > 2D works as routes for 2K (2K is good after a blocked Task A Prime), alternatively 2S as a combo-starter seems to do lots of damage.

"Jump Hover" in to air Deja Vu is a nice alternative 'mind game' instead of the usual j.3K or j.3S.

2H/3H still work to keep characters in the air, useful as a followup to Helios OD.

Task C feels unsafe now that Blitz and Baiken's parry are common things, I'm wondering when it might be good to use it?

[NecroTheReaper]

Task C is a combo tool, you should never really use it outside of that.  If youre sure theyll respect, you can use ball returns to try and get a C seal out, but its risky regardless.

 

6H is also not bad at all on block.  Its incredibly hard to punish (6H is -3 from my testing and 6HH is -1) even on IB as long as you use it outside of point blank range.  Even then, theres only a few characters with the tools to get a proper punish. (Stun dipper doesnt even punish correctly, either too far away and recover in time or too close and the 2nd hit cant connect)