[AC+R] Venom Combo and Setups Thread

[Raurik]

Here's a proper combo thread. Consider this post an ongoing WIP. I'm going to write down what I have and update with combos that people add to the thread. So, let's say if your corner combo does more damage or does same damage, but better ball setup afterwards, I'll move the previous "best corner combo" down with other variations and replace it with yours. That way multiple combo options are easily obtained, but the "best" combos are right on top. If you disagree with x combo being on top when y combo should be, sure. If you're right, you're right. Just explain why so it can be better illustrated in the top post.

Also, all combos will be followed directly below with a series of symbols that indicate where balls are positioned afterwards for easier visualization of oki.

i=Venom

o=ball

o(letter)=first ball summoned+version

_=opponent

invisible . for spacing if you need it.

Example: Traditional K ball pressure.

o

i . _

With all that said, please give me your combos to add to the list and make this resource stronger!

MIDSCREEN

May begin with optional 2K for low mixup

c.5S(3) xx 6K xx 214S > 66 > c5S(1) xx 6K xx 421HS xx 214K

o

i o o(S)_

CORNER

2K xx c.5S(3) xx 6K xx 214P > 66 > c.5S(1) xx 6K xx 421S > 2S xx 421S > 2S xx 623HS

o

i . _

THROW-MIDSCREEN

Throw > c.5S(1) [hits ball form] xx 214HS > 66 > c.5S(1) xx 6K xx 421S xx 214K

o

i o(H) o_

THROW-CORNER

Throw > 421S > 2S xx 421S > 2S xx 421S > 2S xx 623HS [DAMAGE]

i . . _

Throw > 421S > 2S xx 421S > 2S xx 421S xx 623K > j.K [PRESSURE]

i . _

[Follow Ups]

Any "(letter)" notates which ball summon it was. Usually specifies the first summon in the series. a.k.a. which ball Venom will teleport to.

o

V o o(s)_

2P to hit H ball then j.K the K ball > air-dash for pressure

OR 623K to S ball and do 2P xx 2K xx 2S xx 4,6S(hits H ball) j.K > air-dash pressure.

MIX UPS

Good mix up strings.

2K xx c.5S(2) xx 8 > 236S OR 236D

If you did 236D....

2K xx c.5S(2) xx 8 > 236D > air-dash >236S or 236D

If you did 236S...

2K xx c.5S(2) xx 8 > 236S > 2K xx 2D

If 2D was blocked... 4,6S xx FRC > 66 > 2P xx 2K xx 2D

If 2D hit... 214Ball

Ball Zoning Patterns

WIP. Life got in the way of me finishing this today...

NOTE: Damage will be added at a later date.

[Raurik]

Reserved for character specific combos

[DaiAndOh]

A few things.

Unless you're going to kill <b>NEVER</b> end with 623hs. Knockdown is super important for Venom who has to keep momentum in his favor as much as possible after winning in neutral.

Midscreen combo listed only works as far as I can tell when you're at the closest the distance. When you can't, you can go for damage by doing a 6k, carcass combo or keep the opponent closer with a simple combo into 421x or 2d. If you know you're going to be that close for whatever reason, the extra ball at no expense is great though!

Throw combo doesn't need a dash after 214hs....well maybe the dash makes it work when you're in the corner? I'll have to test that.

Mad struggles (j.236s/d), you can do 2369 to get the TK...far less confusing than straight jumping.

[Raurik]

A few things.

Unless you're going to kill <b>NEVER</b> end with 623hs. Knockdown is super important for Venom who has to keep momentum in his favor as much as possible after winning in neutral.

Midscreen combo listed only works as far as I can tell when you're at the closest the distance. When you can't, you can go for damage by doing a 6k, carcass combo or keep the opponent closer with a simple combo into 421x or 2d. If you know you're going to be that close for whatever reason, the extra ball at no expense is great though!

Throw combo doesn't need a dash after 214hs....well maybe the dash makes it work when you're in the corner? I'll have to test that.

Mad struggles (j.236s/d), you can do 2369 to get the TK...far less confusing than straight jumping.

As I understood, 623HS left time for K ball summon then pressure. The combo ended with K ball already in position so I was under the impression you could use that ball summon time to begin pressure and still be positive.

Midscreen combo link from the 6K to the c.5S is just tight. I've done it a bit, but I'll test max distance on c.5S on start and make sure I can get it to connect.

The dash in the midscreen throw combo is to cover all opponent sizes. robo ky falls fast and some other characters are just tiny. Wanted to make sure everyone could look at the chart and learn a combo without immediately having to start tracking character specifics.

For the mad struggle IOH I was trying to notate a tiger knee, but GG notation isn't my native language if you know what I mean. lol. I'll change it to 2369.

That's my train-of-thought behind why I notated some of that the way I did. Any combos or series you could share that I could add to the post?

[DaiAndOh]

623HS doesn't knockdown, they can tech away at the end of those combos. 623D knocks down but doesn't leave much time...

I haven't had problems with other characters regarding the throw combo. I actually use 2S instead of c.S for the first hit if that makes any difference....hmmm.

[DaiAndOh]

Because this aims to be more than a combo thread, here's something I'm sure beginners will appreciate: Basic one ball oki setups.

Setups off of 2D:

214K/214K~HS Ball:

The classic. After the ball set, do a running j.K. You can land on either side of them and do 2K, or airdash towards the opponent and do j.S (it hits when you're facing away), or land and do 2K. This setup easily links back into itself since the basic combos into sweep don't have much corner carry. You can also attempt a throw if your opponent is respecting too much. In the corner, you're mostly pressing them between airdash highs and empty lows.

214P/214P~D/214S Ball:

Summon, tap, basic mixup of your choice. Simple. Later on you can try summoning after you tap as their getting up if you got a plan in mind...

214HS~D Ball:

Use when your sweep is going to knock the opponent back a fair distance. Then do a running jump. The basic setup is j.HS->236S. This will actually leave the ball in place, it's the threat of the ball. If it works, you'll have your old ball plus whatever more. Variants of the setup include jumping in with j.S to use the ball, or empty jump low.

Setups off of Dubious Curve:

421K/421K~D Ball:

The classic, now with lightning balls.

421P/421P~D/421S Ball:

Again, simple mixup. However, the extra blockstun from the lightning ball gives you some extra time to summon something else.

421S~D->623K:

Something I've been working on, cancel dubious into teleport for this setup. You can tap the ball with j.P or use j.K both to setup situations where your ball will hit meaty. You can j.S to get the ball to appear like it will meaty, but it will whiff...this lets you throw opponents conditioned to the setup. Or, you can ignore the ball and airdash out of the teleport for multiple highs or empty lows.

[Elochai]

Just curious since it's not in the OP:

What's the go-to combo after 5D? I've seen some combos with tk HS mad struggle (I think?) at least.

[DaiAndOh]

I only really do 5D in the corner, not much reward from what I can tell midscreen.

5D, j.D, j.D, 236HS is the starter. I substitute the j.D for j.HS when they have burst to try to OS throw it.

After the 236HS, you're free to go in with a variety of options. Simple combo would be 6P, (421S, 2S)x2-3 depending on character.

One of the nice things about Venom's 5D, is that it'll hit balls underneath the attack box, letting you setup safe dust situations from multiple ball positions, safe dust referring to the ball hitting the opponent after Venom's dust. If the dust hits, the ball hits as well as you still get your combo.