zissou Report post Posted March 20, 2014 Hey guys- I’m fairly new to both Guilty Gear and Dustloop. Since Xrd has released in the arcade, I’ve been trying to pick it up, but as you can imagine, it’s rough learning the game against strong players who are 10+ year veterans of the series. I have access to a lot of English information on Faust up through +R, but there are almost no resources for getting info for Xrd Faust in English or Japanese. Luckily, players like Nemo are tweeting Faust tech on a fairly regular basis. My Japanese is decent, but since my knowledge of GG and Faust are both lacking, it’s hard for me to understand everything that people are talking about on twitter. I’m hoping that if we work together, we can build up a repository of info as it comes out. As I am new to these boards, I hope that 1) it’s ok for someone as new as me to make a new thread like this and 2) this thread is actually in the right place. I’ve read the posting guidelines and stuff, but I apologize in advance if I did anything wrong! Anyway, let’s get going. Here was a tweet from Nemo that caught my eye a bit ago- ねも @GOOD_NEMO · 3月10日 医者はキャラ対策で遠Sor下HS>236PSHSでの物投げで遠S空振り時に黄色になる。PSHSにする理由はKを含むとレレレコマンド成立時にレレレになるから俺はPSHSにしてる。これやると遠Sに前P合わせてきたときに黄色になって相手の前P確認して差し込める。 From this tweet- when Faust goes for a poke with F.S or 2H, you can input 236PSH (P, S, and H all simultaneously) as on OS, which will make the F.S or 2H cancel into item toss on hit or block, but if the move whiffs completely, you’ll get a YRC to avoid you being whiff punished (I've tested it- it works as described). The reason he uses those specific three buttons is because he doesn’t want to use kick in order to avoid possible overlap with the input for Rerere. The last sentence is a little hard to understand for me- it sounds like he’s saying if someone tries to counter your poke with their 6P, you’ll YRC and be able to whiff punish their 6P or something? Any thoughts on what this could mean? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
InWithTheAshes Report post Posted March 20, 2014 The reason he uses those specific three buttons is because he doesn’t want to use kick in order to avoid possible overlap with the input for Rerere. Wait: If he's still using S, wouldn't that have even more potential for overlap (with the pogo set), seeing as it uses the same directional input whereas Rerere only uses it during the end? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zissou Report post Posted March 20, 2014 Wait: If he's still using S, wouldn't that have even more potential for overlap (with the pogo set), seeing as it uses the same directional input whereas Rerere only uses it during the end? Not sure why he's specifically worried about Rerere overlap and not about 236S- I know looking through his tweets he's mentioned stuff about input priority so it may have something to do with that. I have tested it though, and I never got accidental pogo, so something we don't understand yet must be going on. I should get to it over the next couple days as I start to sift through Nemo's stuff. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
InWithTheAshes Report post Posted March 20, 2014 Ah, alright. That's strange: It could be something involving button priority, but if so then while P would take more priority than S if input at the same time, it would also be overridden by K in the same situation, meaning that the button's priority order wouldn't simply be "lowest to highest" or the other way round (I think it was the latter in AC, although it may have been the former). This does warrant more investigation. ...Now I want the game to test for myself . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zissou Report post Posted March 21, 2014 Alright- let’s keep going! @GOOD_NEMO: 誰か絶命拳>赤の後のコンボ調べた人いる？絶命拳>赤>前HSがやっぱり最大なんかな？絶命拳>赤>何が>前HSのがいいんかな？ The above is a fairly straight-forward tweet. He’s asking if anybody has found any better follow-ups to a successful 236236H than RC 6H. He wonders if landing the overdrive, RC, (item toss I think?), then 6H is the optimal follow-up. @GOOD_NEMO: 投げさんのプレイ見てるとこの状況こうした方がいいな。ってのもわかりやすい。客観的に医者の動きを見るのはめっちゃ大事だな。んで何気に月間勝利数500とかなりやってたな。明日はアルカプ出来たらいいな。 Next tweet is kind of random (not much of substance really- don’t know if people necessarily care about these kind of tweets). Anyway, he said- looking at Nage play, it’s become clear that movement with Faust is objectively very important. Also, w/o realizing it, he got accumulated over 500 wins this month. Tomorrow, he’s hoping to play marvel. @GOOD_NEMO: 今日ダメだったことガードゲージ溜めてる時に投げカウンター>前Pカウンター>前Pカウンター>前ドア。全然繋がる気配なかったな…前ドアどうやってコンボに入れよ？ I need help with this one. He’s saying this is something that he couldn’t get to work. When the guard guage is built up, trying to do 投げカウンタ (throw counter? item throw that hits counter hit? no idea) into 6P (counter hit?) into door from the front. He hadn’t thought it would work (and apparently it didn’t?), but he’s still trying to figure out how the hell you’re supposed to work forward door into combos. God damn, Nemo tweet a lot O_O! Will keep chugging through the tweets until I'm caught up and have looked through everything from Xrd release through the present. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OneSanitarium Report post Posted March 21, 2014 I think he wanted PSH, since if you somehow did 41236PKS, Rerere would come out since that's specifically a HCF motion. 236PS, assuming you hit the buttons on the same frame, will always result in item throw, due to input priority. In past games, at least, but I doubt it would be changed honestly. You can still input 236PKS, as long as you know you didn't hit any other directions that would cause the game to read a 41236, so yeah, 236PSH is deffinitely(probably) just a precaution over that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zissou Report post Posted March 23, 2014 Still working through Nemo’s tweet backlog (these ones are from 3/16). Next is a sequence of tweets that I am having a lot of difficulty deciphering. @GOOD_NEMO: ダスト>ブリッツとダスト>FDが可能だね。でもリバサブリッツはボタン押しっぱなしで安定するっぽい @GOOD_NEMO: ブリッツはリバサ表記でてるから必殺技扱いと予想してる @GOOD_NEMO: ダスト>ブリッツとかはバーストないときね。 First tweet: “Dust > Blitz or Dust > FD are possibilities. It seems if you keep holding the buttons down you’ll be safe from getting reversal blitz Second tweet: “When you blitz you get the reversal text on screen, so my guess is it’s treated like a special move Third tweet: Doing stuff like Dust > Blitz is for when you don’t have burst available. My current thinking is he’s talking about using dust > blitz (or dust > FD…? maybe as an OS) as a defensive technique. If Faust’s 5D is like it is the older games, it has some invincibility (frames 1-11 in +R) and then either he’s saying you can cancel it into blitz to counter an attack that comes later than the active frames (or something like that) or he’s saying you should just to blitz shield or FD afterward if they try to punish the 5D (whiffed or whatever). What do you guys think? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SoWL Report post Posted June 12, 2014 I think this thread (and the subforum, for that matter) is worth reviving now that the game has been out for a while. How much Faust tech turned out to be legit by now? How different is he from his #R/AC+R versions? I'm especially interested in this since I'm going to visit Japan in about two months, and you can bet I'm going to spend some good time in the arcades with the merry doctor.I didn't watch that many videos yet, but from what I could see, neither his neutral game nor his combo routes are that different (outside of the fact that you can now spam f.S all day long without worrying about missing crouchers). HS YRC seems to have potential, as well as the door YRCs, though that one doesn't sound too different from the old FRCs, and I'm not sure those were that useful. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
9:02 PM Report post Posted June 18, 2014 It looks like he's playing the same game for the most part, though with the very strong addition of f. S, which seems miles better than any normal he had in AC. His mix-up looks pretty much the same, drill cancel j. K/mettakiri. The biggest change in his gameplay seems to be the new items. In AC basically all of his items were either a moving hit box, or a health item. The spring board, oil drum, and black hole represent some new stuff. The attraction on the black hole negates some pushback, so extended tick throw stuff with mettakiri or really long blockstrings/mixup attempts are probably possible in addition to the elongated combos people have been doing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TopTierTaite Report post Posted June 19, 2014 Hey guys, I have a pretty nice Google doc of streamlined information regarding Faust for anybody looking to learn him. Big shoutout to the user Will-o-Fortune for making this doc for me to share with you guys. I don't know if it'll all apply to Xrd, but the general idea of it should. ~Enjoy!!! edit: had to remove it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zissou Report post Posted June 20, 2014 It seems that Nemo hasn't been playing much Xrd lately since he was finding it difficult to keep his play up to par in three games simultaneously (he's focusing on marvel and ultra atm). Since he hasn't tweeted much about Faust, I've started going through Nage's tweets to try and find more stuff. His twitter account has Faust tech marked with the hash tag ＃いしゃめも. There's also a few things on the Japanese Xrd wiki as well that could be worth looking into. I will start looking through this stuff and see if there is anything of interest. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ivanchu77 Report post Posted September 8, 2014 More than 1 hour of faust matches! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6eelqc3jqM Gazou(Faust) VSMugen(Sol), Hasegawa(I-No), Rion(Ky), Karinchu(Ramlethal), Ain(Ky), Nage(Faust), LOX(Bedman) (where´s the video section? ) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
D.R.F. Report post Posted September 8, 2014 Gazou is a genius. Combining the items with door special. It just looks so infuriating Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coffeeling Report post Posted September 10, 2014 Haha! Bomb => 5K 5K 5K 5K :D Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zissou Report post Posted September 23, 2014 Been a long time coming but here are some translated Nage tweets if anybody cares: ナゲ@マヒャド @nano_ochiai Feb 21 ・2HSRCダッシュ→ガードされてたら投げ間合い外からメッタ、ドリル、2Kしてみる(2HSヒットしてたら暗転時に確認してコンボ) ・相手バネヒット後に上ドアしてみる。 ・低空ドリルガードさせRC→JK、2P、メッタしてみる ・ダスト黄キャンスカしメッタを攻めでも使う -2HS xx RC dash fwd. -> if they guard, outside of normal throw range, try doing mettakiri, drill, or 2K (if 2HS hits, during the RC flash, confirm into a combo) -after the opponent gets hit by the spring trap, try doing the door from above -after forcing the opponent to guard a low altitude drill, RC into JK, 2P, (or?) go for mettakiri -after a YRC’d dust, you can attack using mettakiri ナゲ@マヒャド @nano_ochiai Feb 23 アイテムをDで打てる。アイテム出すのを溜めると手前に落ちるから打ちやすくなる。落下速度がアイテムによって違うっぽいのに加えて、ホームランとカス当ての２種類ある。ホームランするとすごい勢いで画面外にかっとんでく。カス当ては画面端まで飛ぶ。謎のやり込み要素ww #いしゃめも -You can hit items with D. When you throw an item, holding the button will throw the item directly in front of you, making it easier to hit. The falling speed differs from item to item and there are two kinds of hit, home runs and regular ones. A home run will hit the item outside of the viewable screen, but a regular hit will launch the item to edge of the currently visible screen. It still a mystery worth investigating more, haha. ナゲ@マヒャド @nano_ochiai Feb 23 ハンマーかなり早め、バネちょい早め、チョコちょい早め、爆弾早め、毒早め、ヘリウムちょい遅め、オイル遅め、黒ホール遅め、１００ﾄﾝ遅め、隕石多分撃てない。 10分トレモ結果。「かなり」とか「ちょい」は僕の中のイメージなのでスパーリングで実際にお試し下さいw #いしゃめも -(talking about hitting items with dust, presumably) the hammer is quite slow, the spring is a bit quick, the chocolate is a bit quick, the bomb is slow, the poison is fast, the helium is a bit slow, the oil is slow, the black hole is slow, the 100 ton weight is slow, and you probably can’t hit the meteor. my results from 10 minutes in training mode. as far as saying stuff like ‘quite’ or ‘a little bit’ it’s just based on my perception/opinion, so try this stuff out for yourself, haha. ナゲ@マヒャド @nano_ochiai Feb 23 ちびとバネが比較的打ちやすい気がしました。いつアイテム溜めて打つべきかはわかりませんw #いしゃめも -I’ve noticed the chibi faust and the spring are relatively easy to hit. as for when to hit items or not, I have no idea, haha. (?) ナゲ@マヒャド @nano_ochiai Feb 23 あとハンマーでホームランしたときに相手に当たるとダウンするっぽい？ハンマーでホームランしたのは１回だけで、やけに低い軌道で飛んでって地上のソル(CPU)にヒットしたことは覚えてる。ホームランとカス当てによって相手の挙動変わるかも。 #いしゃめも -after throwing hammer and getting a home run hit on it (with dust) it looks like it causes a knockdown? I only got a home run hit with the hammer once, but I remember that it went at a super low trajectory and hit a grounded Sol (CPU). (?) Depending on whether you get the home run and how the opponent gets hit, the effects might be different. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sren Report post Posted September 24, 2014 homerun hammer should b instant stun Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SoWL Report post Posted November 4, 2014 I literally never seen anyone talking about it, but the wiki says Faust has a super version of the item toss super (yes, the super-super item toss, you heard me). It costs 100% of Tension, is performed by inputting 236236236P, and tosses 10 items (as compared to 8 with two regular item toss supers). It might not be THAT practical, but it still amuses me to no end. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
D.R.F. Report post Posted November 4, 2014 I literally never seen anyone talking about it, but the wiki says Faust has a super version of the item toss super (yes, the super-super item toss, you heard me). It costs 100% of Tension, is performed by inputting 236236236P, and tosses 10 items (as compared to 8 with two regular item toss supers). It might not be THAT practical, but it still amuses me to no end. So super "N-N-Nani Ga Deru Gana???" I have never seen it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krakhan Report post Posted November 5, 2014 I've seen it in a handful of match videos. I guess that's the other option you can do after getting a gold burst if you really want to blow all of your meter at once for havoc, with 2 bonus items as well. You'd probably be better off spending the meter on YRCs though, which is why it doesn't get used that much. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mumm-Ra Report post Posted November 8, 2014 Uhhhh where's the video thread for faust? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coffeeling Report post Posted November 9, 2014 Faust is too boring to have a video thread Kappa Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kintaro Report post Posted December 6, 2014 Here's a clip of Faust (mine) doing the (100% tension) Super Super Nani ga deru ka na? (at 1:07 on the video) http://youtu.be/TRATJwFzd2g?t=1m7s Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zissou Report post Posted December 15, 2014 @nano_ochiai: 医者こぷたー。上いれっぱすると滞空時間伸びる。面白い Nage saying you can vary air time on doctor copter depending on whether you hold up or not. Need to test when I get home. Has anybody found uses for this move yet? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ElvenShadow Report post Posted January 2, 2015 This is correct. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
www.keeponrock.in Report post Posted January 13, 2015 I'm just gonna leave these tweets here so they don't get lost. Hopefully, somebody else can provide translations. These are Nage's tweets, using the hashtag: #nagememo ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai 10h10 hours ago q(^-^q)oO(よく考えたら整理できてないの他キャラも一緒でした…すんません…) #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai 10h10 hours ago q(^-^q)oO(…。) q(^-^q)oO(ザトー戦はあんまり整理できてないんだよなぁ…) ザトー側がどこまで対処できるかあまりわかっていないので、あくまで「今の僕が試していること」ということで見ていただければ幸いです…。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai 10h10 hours ago ■ファウスト使っててザトー戦で意識していること。 ・高空にいる状態で相手の常時が開始した場合、受け身を取らない選択肢も混ぜる。 ・分身と同時に攻められている際、崩れる前にバーストして切り返すという選択肢も意識。（エディゲージの回復が早いのでゲージの使い切りを待たない） #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai 10h10 hours ago ■ファウスト使っててザトー戦で意識していること。 影潜りで分身が迫ってきた際、本体の状況を見ながら出てきたときに2K等で壊せないか判断する。アイテムを避けるために分身単体で迫ってきたりする場合がある（気がする）。 ・影潜りの最中に前へ出る選択肢も意識できるとよさそう。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai 10h10 hours ago ■ファウスト使っててザトー戦で意識していること。 浮遊への地対空が難しく、失敗すると分身を使った攻めが始まったり、ダウンして起き攻めされたりしてリスクが高い。基本は距離を取って着地に対して何をするかを考えている。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai 10h10 hours ago ■ファウスト使っててザトー戦で意識していること。 ・遠S先端で相手のドリルや召喚の出始めを狙う。但し、2Sカウンター>HSドリルというリスクは常に意識する。 ・自分は地上戦でダウンすることを警戒するあまり飛びがちになるので、地上戦にいつ付き合うかを意識している。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 12 ■自分用メモ（対エルフェルト戦） ・ベリーパイン上投げに対して黄RCダッシュはあり？ ・2HSの対処方法を考える。(かぶせ直し前Jは強そうなので他のも考える) ・トラヴァイエ中に空中へ逃げた後は突きあげるを警戒する。 ・空中ブライダルの対処方法を考える。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 12 ■ファウスト使ってて意識してること。 ・対空が成功するか不安なときは相手の着地に牽制を合わせる、放置して遠目でアイテムを投げる、走り込んで単体で触りに行く…など。対空失敗のリスクは高いときあるので無理はしない。 ・遠S黄色RC仕込みは要所で使う。なるべくゲージ温存。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 12 ■ファウスト使ってて意識してること。 ・アイテム出そうとして下がりすぎない。 ・速いキャラは「アイテム出して何かする」よりも「追いかけつつ牽制→アイテムをするか、追いきれないと判断したときにアイテムを投げる」を基本にしてみる。相手から向かってくるなら事故らせる。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 11 「 #なげめも 」はあくまで「対戦中に僕が意識してることのまとめ」なので、自分の場合ならどう使えるのか・もっとこうすればいいんじゃね？的なご判断はお任せします…q(^-^q) ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 11 ■補足っぽいの テンションゲージや相手の体力を確認しながらRC仕込むかを判断するのは、普段から意識しないとできないと思ってます。あと、自分が黄RC仕込みをしない場合でも、相手が仕込んでいる可能性はあるので、相手のゲージを見ながらバーストするか判断できたらいいかなと。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 11 ■黄RC仕込みのバー対コンボで意識してること。 ・相手が気絶してるときも黄RCできる。自分がゲージ50%以上持ってるときに相手が気絶した際、黄RCを1回発動してゲージを調整し、黄色仕込みコンボをすることもできる。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 11 ■黄RC仕込みのバー対コンボで意識してること。 ・ゲージが25%無くても手癖を付けるためにとりあえず仕込む。(25%溜まった瞬間に成功することもたまにあり！) ・50%溜まりそうなら基本しない。ただ、倒しきれると判断したら赤RCになっても良いと思いながら入力する。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 9 「飛び道具をブリッツする」ってのは他のキャラ戦でもあるんですが、ソル・カイ戦が特に飛び道具>黄RCで攻められることが多い気がしたので、一例として挙げました。他の状況でも使える場面はあるかもです。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 9 ■ソル・カイ戦で意識していること（続き） ブリッツに対して無警戒でめり込み気味に走ってきたら、無敵時間で相手の技を避ける>投げる等が可能。ブリッツ>投げを警戒して密着してこない場合は、FDやジャンプ等で攻めを捌きやすくなる。ブリッツにリスクを背負わせる方法は未検討…ｗ #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 9 ■ソル・カイ戦で意識していること 「ガンフレイムやスタンエッジを黄RC>ダッシュして攻める」に対して「暗転中に飛び道具が来ていることを確認>ブリッツ」。暗転することで反応できない距離でも確認>ブリッツできるようになる。（続く） #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 8 対策考える一助になれば幸いです。ただ、僕が対戦で思いついて効果あったかな～ってものを書いただけなので、自分ならどう使うか・もっと良いのがあるんじゃないか…等の判断は見ていただいている方々にお任せするっす。すんません。q(^-^q) #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 8 ■ラムレザル戦で意識してること ファウストでは遠S黄RC仕込をよく使う。地上にいたら遠Ｓガードorヒット、飛ばれたら黄RC発動>暗転中状況確認>JHSでガードorヒットを狙う等。黄RC発動に対して黄RC返されても、トランシが一歩遠のくので今はそれでいいかなと思ってる。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 8 ■ラムレザル戦で意識してること ・高空で大剣発動してる最中は無理して地対空しない。 （対空に失敗すると大剣→本体の攻撃と続く場合あり） ・バーストヒットさせた後は空中復帰→即大剣発動を警戒。 ・牽制や近づく手段と黄RCを使い、大剣発動中のモーションを確認して攻撃する。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 8 ■ラムレザル戦で意識してること ・自キャラの後ろに使い魔がいても、近いならその場で大剣が発動する。 （画面外から攻撃されるときがある） ・本体に技をガードorヒットさせると大剣が発生しない。 ・本体が大剣を所持してる場合、手前がＳ大剣・奥側がＨＳ大剣。 #なげめも ナゲとかマヒャドとか @nano_ochiai Jan 8 ■ラムレザル戦で意識してること ・本体から大剣を射出する場合は大振りにできない。 ※僕が勝手に射出後の2S・2HSを「大振り」と呼んでます。 ・大剣は「相手の位置をサーチ→ワープ→攻撃」という手順がある。 ・射出された使い魔付近にいるとワープの手順を省いて攻撃される。 #なげめも Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
