[UNIEL] Waldstein

[SergeantDiaz]

I have been finding myself getting locked down a lot in the corner. The only time I am able to get some room is when i have enough gauge to do 360C. Blocking isn't too bad but eventually get hit and it leads to around 3k just about every time. Is there anything that can break out of pressure with no gauge. Can you shield -> 360A/B in during holes in a block string?

[Raph_Stryker]

There was the one video where he punished with 360C, and went into the inf after a chainshift.  Seeing as how much screen that super travels too, thats just another way to set it up.

[GodPress]

I have been finding myself getting locked down a lot in the corner. The only time I am able to get some room is when i have enough gauge to do 360C. Blocking isn't too bad but eventually get hit and it leads to around 3k just about every time. Is there anything that can break out of pressure with no gauge. Can you shield -> 360A/B in during holes in a block string?

SonicboomBrad went over this a little in page 1.Unfortunately, there isn't a whole lot of options Wald players have on corner defense without mechanic advantage of meter, grd blocks or vorpal. I've found in situations where I'm forced to block because I have no easy way out I aim to use shield a bit more aggressively looking for the opponent to recognize this and go for a grab, at which point if you successfully tech you are at advantage allowing you to attempt to work your way out of the corner. 

 

I'm also currently trying to compile (mainly for myself to keep track of things) the current listed combos into a document, if anyone wants it give me a shout and I'll link it through. Bare in mind, its messy as anything at the moment.

[UltraDavid]

Well we all have some work to do on using the system engine better but even on top of that I don't think Waldstein's wakeup is so bad. You build meter pretty quickly in this game and I feel like I have plenty of time to charge D so I seem to have meter for super more often than not. I haven't seen many of my opponents go for safe jump setups yet, but if that ever becomes more popular, having a dragon punch on wakeup won't be quite as important.

Really it'd be kinda busted if Wald had great wakeup though. He already has most of the tools he needs to pressure, get in, and keep out. Having more tools to get people off of him would be going a little too far imo.

[badgerfan20945]

I'm having trouble with my pressure midscreen with wald. I can get people blocking but beyond that I really can't open them up. What are my options midscreen after a blocked 214B? 

[zankoku]

I guess there's... 66B, Assault, 214A, 214B, 2B, 5B, 5C? 2B/5B/5C can frametrap them if they try to run in on your +3, if they're respecting you can close distance with 66B/Assault. I don't think doing another 214 actually accomplishes anything useful but it might get them panicky when they block multiple claps in a row.

[AchedSphinx]

I'm having trouble with my pressure midscreen with wald. I can get people blocking but beyond that I really can't open them up. What are my options midscreen after a blocked 214B? 

 

You can do anything you want basically. Your primary goal for midscreen should be to get them closer to the corner and scare them with command throws. Just keep the pressure up and eventually they'll open up. Consider going for set-ups like this. Assault j.C > land > j.[C]. If hit, it makes for an easy combo follow up. Also, depending on match-up, consider spamming Assault j.6C or j.B, and on landing do a command throw, 360B preferably since you'll probably be out of range for 360A. It gets really awesome when you have enough meter for 360C. Always be on the look out for command throws. You can even buffer 360B during Dash B, it should be in range.

 

Also, Assault, is so good. Oh and Dash B. I'm falling in love with Dash B.

[GaoGaoGao]

So...how the eff do you fight Gord?

[theWHITEdevil]

Question about the infinite: if the enemy wallbounces off one of the 6C's what did i do wrong? not close enough to the wall or wrong timing?

 

also thanks Mike Z for posting that

[zankoku]

Alright, so until I find more techniques for testing, this is probably as complete as I'll get with Waldstein's frame data.

 

http://piratepad.net/ep/pad/view/ro.Yq9oos7K1-k/latest

[zankoku]

6C xN

Yes, that's it.  One button.  It scales down to zero damage, but if you have the life lead you can easily force a Time Out.

It does not require any timing except that you do the next 6C as fast as possible.  You can mash and you will get it every time, but you will also get tired way before Time's Up.

This game has a large input buffer, or at least 6C does, so the timing is pretty lenient.  Mash it a few times to see what the timing should be, then just tap it appropriately.

Takes 5 minutes or less to learn consistently.

After continuous testing, it seems there's about a 5-6 frame window (something like 66-70 frames) between each 6C. There's no input buffer, but rather the 6C is just that absurdly active to have such a large timing window.

 

Also, the damage doesn't scale whatsoever, rather, it repeatedly deals no damage because 6C's damage is all in the wallbounce that never happens.

[GodPress]

Not sure the use of this yet but doing Jump back B will allow you to use assault before you hit the floor, if you get this at a close enough range you can j.assault C crossup. Doesn't work on the smaller characters (Linne&Vatista).

 

Oh and on corner combos using the route of 214A>5A>214B from A or B starters after the 214A you can Dash then A to put yourself closer to the corner. In situations where 5C>3C in the combo would drop dashing forward gives you just enough range for it to hit. 

[Shadow Ninja 64]

Not sure the use of this yet but doing Jump back B will allow you to use assault before you hit the floor, if you get this at a close enough range you can j.assault C crossup. Doesn't work on the smaller characters (Linne&Vatista).

 

Oh and on corner combos using the route of 214A>5A>214B from A or B starters after the 214A you can Dash then A to put yourself closer to the corner. In situations where 5C>3C in the combo would drop dashing forward gives you just enough range for it to hit. 

 

From what I understand, this game has some sort of crossup protection/prevention built into it, so I don't know if that setup does anything different than not crossing up at all.

 

Also good thought on the dash 5A in the corner there.  I've had a few times where I've done that corner combo and the 5A has just missed, and it didn't occur to me to dash into it.

[GodPress]

From what I understand, this game has some sort of crossup protection/prevention built into it, so I don't know if that setup does anything different than not crossing up at all.

 

Also good thought on the dash 5A in the corner there.  I've had a few times where I've done that corner combo and the 5A has just missed, and it didn't occur to me to dash into it.

Completely forgot about the crossup protection. That said, playing with it some more, there's a huge gap that they can just walk it.

 

The crappy little document I've been working on https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZJC7XzNXCjWW5uTUv9hF6k_SCcxXMXLLQWNilfQYM5I/edit?usp=sharing. Might be useful for some of you, its basically just a compilation of this thread; the layout sucks and it needs a lot of work but hopefully its some use to a few of you?

[TekkamanArk]

Can someone help me with something? I need to do a 20 hit combo with Waldstein for that trophy, but I don't know Waldstein that well. What's good to use?

[Grim-reaper]

Can someone help me with something? I need to do a 20 hit combo with Waldstein for that trophy, but I don't know Waldstein that well. What's good to use?

DPs !

[zankoku]

2B > 5B > 214B > j.A > j.B > j.6C > 4B > [4]6A > cs > 5C > 4B > 623B > 623C > 6C > 6C

 

should be 20 hits

 

or just do this one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZsyg2RaxTM

[badgerfan20945]

you could just use the infinite I guess. That's what I did to get it lol.

[Shadow Ninja 64]

Completely forgot about the crossup protection. That said, playing with it some more, there's a huge gap that they can just walk it.

 

The crappy little document I've been working on https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZJC7XzNXCjWW5uTUv9hF6k_SCcxXMXLLQWNilfQYM5I/edit?usp=sharing. Might be useful for some of you, its basically just a compilation of this thread; the layout sucks and it needs a lot of work but hopefully its some use to a few of you?

 

I noticed some of the chain shift combos are less damage than the ones I posted previously (the 360A CS and corner j.214A CS ones), but this is still a really great resource, thank you.

[TekkamanArk]

you could just use the infinite I guess. That's what I did to get it lol.

 

Still not really sure about that supposed "infinite". It's really annoying to set up, and it only lasts for 2-3 reps before they break free.

[zankoku]

It definitely lasts forever, and the only setup you need is either (if already in corner) 4B > 623B > 623C, or combo into 4B > [4]6A > CS > ( 5C > ) 4B > 623B > 623C and then you go to town.

[Loli-Zero]

If they break free your pressing it too late.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[TekkamanArk]

Got it now, thanks. I just took my stick and set it on Turbo since I seemed to be pressing too slowly.

[GodPress]

I noticed some of the chain shift combos are less damage than the ones I posted previously (the 360A CS and corner j.214A CS ones), but this is still a really great resource, thank you.

Whoopsy, I'll change 'em asap.

 

edit: Got em, I think. Let me know via PM if I've missed any and I'll whack em in.

[zankoku]

Before jiyuna drove himself to insanity on the path of successfully infiniting someone on ranked netplay, I noticed that he has a tendency to end his BnB early, at 4B, rather than going into 360/GodPress, due to the positioning and RPS opportunities the 4B provides (step forward 360, 2B, block a reversal). Worth doing?