[UNIEL] Chaos

[Avatar_of_Chaos]

Changing numbers doesn't balance a game. This isn't like Tekken where the vast majority of the cast play nearly identical to eachother and you simply change numbers based on the strengths of their attacks.

 

Anime games tend to have characters that have very extreme playstyles and strengths. Despite being low tier, Seth has one of, if not THE best mixup in the game. Even Chaos has some pretty huge strengths over other characters in the cast. 

 

The game is pretty balanced. Orie, Hyde and Yuzuriha, 3 pretty lowish characters do consistently well in tournaments. Seth is a very unstable character and so while he can sometimes win lots of games vs top tiers with ease, it's very easy for him to just lose, making him a fairly bad tournament character. Byakuya is extremely technical and thus not a lot of people put time into him. 

 

Chaos is unviable, but only in the sense that once you reach high level play, you're not going to beat a Gordeau, Eltnum or Merk on the same level as you. Though while I don't mean to be rude, you're not exactly going to reach that level any time soon no matter what character you pick. Weak characters are generally better for learning the game anyway since you have to learn the game more instead of abusing certain strengths your character might have.

 

Thanks for the reply!

 

I should clarify that I don't mean simply by changing life stats you could make it completely balanced, but it would still have an effect on the gap between top and bottom tier. If Chaos suddenly had 13,000 health and Gordeau had 7,000 health, wouldn't that call their current tier placing into question? That's all I was thinking. (Although nothing that extreme, lol) Not sure what you're referring to when you say most Tekken characters play the same...

 

Yeah, I'll probably never play enough to reach high level anyway, but still kind of sad to hear that you think Chaos is unviable. I'll still pick him up and see how I get on with him. If I get my ass handed to me I'll just smash my controller into pieces and then switch to Gordeau, spamming grim reaper for all eternity. :P

[Rikir]

Thanks for the reply!

 

I should clarify that I don't mean simply by changing life stats you could make it completely balanced, but it would still have an effect on the gap between top and bottom tier. If Chaos suddenly had 13,000 health and Gordeau had 7,000 health, wouldn't that call their current tier placing into question? That's all I was thinking. (Although nothing that extreme, lol) Not sure what you're referring to when you say most Tekken characters play the same...

 

Yeah, I'll probably never play enough to reach high level anyway, but still kind of sad to hear that you think Chaos is unviable. I'll still pick him up and see how I get on with him. If I get my ass handed to me I'll just smash my controller into pieces and then switch to Gordeau, spamming grim reaper for all eternity. :P

I will say that playing Chaos is fairly straight forward execution wise, so if you want a character that doesnt require 50 inputs/combo (AKA not Seth) then hes good to start with.

[LordSpectreX]

Thanks for the reply!

 

I should clarify that I don't mean simply by changing life stats you could make it completely balanced, but it would still have an effect on the gap between top and bottom tier. If Chaos suddenly had 13,000 health and Gordeau had 7,000 health, wouldn't that call their current tier placing into question? That's all I was thinking. (Although nothing that extreme, lol) Not sure what you're referring to when you say most Tekken characters play the same...

 

Yeah, I'll probably never play enough to reach high level anyway, but still kind of sad to hear that you think Chaos is unviable. I'll still pick him up and see how I get on with him. If I get my ass handed to me I'll just smash my controller into pieces and then switch to Gordeau, spamming grim reaper for all eternity. :P

 

Because #1, Health isn't something that be looked at as a raw stat. Gordeau's playstyle isn't actually very safe. It's about being a bully and incredibly brutish. You're meant to actually take a bit of a beating playing Gordeau cause he has no real oki and all his mixups are heavy guessing games where he WILL lose if he makes a bad choice. If he had low HP, not only would the character drop but the character design wise would become nonfunctional and thereby becoming unfun to play. 

 

#2 Tier placements isn't what matters. Not really. It's matchups. If you base things around health, then certain characters get certain advantages. If Gordeau had 7000HP, Carmine-Gordeau would literally become a 7-3 if not worse matchup. Cause there's no real reason for Carmine to not just instantly win when he lands one hit cause Gordeau will never be able to live long enough to generate meter or vorpal. But then, Gordeau will still wreck in good matchups like vs Byakuya. So you actually end up making the game MORE unbalanced by making Gordeau weaker. 

 

#3 Aesthetics. You don't give Seth more HP than a big muscular guy. It's the same reason why Marshall Law doesn't have a full screen Devil Jin beam. 

 

Really, the only problem with Gordeau is that he's incredibly easy to play so he reaches his cap early. Once people got better, he became much less of a problem, both in Japan and the West.

Tekken characters generally do the same basic gameplan. It's much more about using your character's specific normals to outwit them. Tekken is more like a duel. Anime games in general don't tend to have that. It's much more about using a character's moves to control space while you try to find an opening to start your pressure game. Anime games tend to be less of a duel and more of a tug of war.

[Doobylover]

WHAT WHERE? I REALLY NEED TO EDIT THIS AT SOME POINT.

 

 

EDIT:

There is no existing Chaos skype group. Would you guys be interested in forming one?

EDIT EDIT:

I already went ahead and made one anyway. PM your Skype ID if you want an add.

 

Oh I want in. I need it for when I get back in the UNiEL spirit. Did I mention Chaos is one cocky little bastard? Gotta love him for it, though.

Skype: doobylovah

[Doobylover]

 

WHAT WHERE? I REALLY NEED TO EDIT THIS AT SOME POINT.

 

 

EDIT:

There is no existing Chaos skype group. Would you guys be interested in forming one?

EDIT EDIT:

I already went ahead and made one anyway. PM your Skype ID if you want an add.

 

Oh I want in. I need it for when I get back in the UNiEL spirit. Did I mention Chaos is one cocky little bastard? Gotta love him for it, though.

Skype: doobylovah

[Rikir]

 

 

 

Oh I want in. I need it for when I get back in the UNiEL spirit. Did I mention Chaos is one cocky little bastard? Gotta love him for it, though.

Skype: doobylovah

 

I sent you a skype invite.

[BRIAN_KYO]

i made another combo video

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWQbspZwLd0

[QSpec]

Two quick questions:

 

What determines the length before the lizard pops out of the shadow in 22B?  It seems like it varies.

 

Also, what determines whether I can attack after 236A?  Is it just normal canceleable or are there situations in which I can actually move after it?

[Crimefighter]

22b has a set time (pretty sure it's the same as 22a but I've never tested) but azhi will pop out early if someone is near his shadow.

236 a/b/c and 623 a/b/c can be chained out of as per normal rules. If you want to move afterwords you can reverse beat into an a normal to recover faster (2a is faster, but 5a is still pretty good). So long as you haven't used the normal yet in your current string it should come out. If you look at the [https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PCbvhv9PJhfpjTpMoKFV90GqRYVTs2Xkhpwl5CbJnko/edit?pli=1#gid=0url=https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PCbvhv9PJhfpjTpMoKFV90GqRYVTs2Xkhpwl5CbJnko/edit?pli=1#gid=0]frame data you can see what the frame advantage is on each special if you whiff 2a.

[QSpec]

Well that explains it then.

 

Now to work on converting 6C...

[Rikir]

Shimazaki (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAE2gZV418w)

Vs Hilda (0:00)
Vs Linne (16:00)

[Rikir]

Motakshi's replays:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBKEsogYZME

[Rikir]

Brkdav (ArcDivide):

Vs. 2GB Carmine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=GF9mgrpOT9w#t=3252

[BRIAN_KYO]

Vs vatista

https://youtu.be/8aoG5ROce1g?t=12m12s

[Anim8rDude]

My Chaos may be fundamentally different, but I think these are some stuff that everybody can appreciate~

Here's some of the stuff I use; don't worry, they're all meterless, consistent, easy to do & work on Linne. Since it's an overhead, you actually have a chance landing these. Works from a normal j.2C or counter hit Air assault (if that's what it's called, beats me!).

 

 

Highest Anywhere screen Combo:

j.2C > 66C > 236A > 5C > 2C > 5BB (first hit misses) > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 6C > 623A    3016 dmg  [3312 vorpal]

 

"Less useful & debatable" Slightly past midscreen Combo (where the CPU spawns in training for example):

j.2C > 66C > 236A > 2C > 5C > 5BB (first hit misses) > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 6C > 623B > 623A    3085 dmg  [3387 vorpal]         (The "2C > 5C > 5BB" part: You may need to "rhythm" yourself in a way)

 

Anti-Air / Mid Jump Combo:

66B > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 236A > 5C > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 6C > 623A    2714 dmg  [2980 vorpal]        (Only works from counter hit 66B; I usally just jump then start from j.B. Sometimes faster too.)

 

Highest Corner Combo (compared to 3038 I beleive):

j.2C > 66C > 236A > 2C > 5C > 5BB (first hit misses) > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 214A    3075 dmg  [3374 vorpal]

 

Higher Corner Combo (slight variation):

j.2C > 66C > 236A > 623A > 5BB > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 214A    3085 dmg [3389 vorpal]          (The "623A > 5BB" part: 5BB must hit before the wall-bounce of 623A)

 

 

As for my 200 meter corner combo, I use this one. It's nothing special, but the advantage of using it is that there's no "veil off hassle" and you get to keep your GRD advantage / chain shift opportunity.

Your average combo using these elements end around 4850 vorpal, so it's entirely up to you!

 

j.2C > 66C > 236A > 5B > 2C > 5CC > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 214C > 236C > j.2C > j.5C    4203  [4612 vorpal]

 

 

For bragging rights lol:

Veil off > j.2C > 66C > 236A > 5B > 2C > 5CC > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 213C > 236C >EXIW    6222 vorpal  (Beat BrianKyo's 6115 Ohohohoho... forgive me)

[Anim8rDude]

Disregard my last post, here's Chaos's true maximum damage. There's nothing left for me to discover, as I'm extremely satisfied with the damage these combos deal, & it's unlikely you'll find anything higher. These break the 3000 dmg barrier meterless, and deal 4000 with vorpal & 100 meter. As usual, they work counter-less, on Linne & are way more consistent (almost fail-free) than the previous combos I posted!

 

 

Highest Anywhere screen Combo:

 

66C > 236A > 5CC > 623A > 5B (delay) B > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 6C > 214          3098 dmg   [3400 vpl]

                                                                                                                                                  3043 dmg   [3340 vpl]   (Depending where you are, only one fireball may hit with 214)

                                                                                                                                                  3177 dmg   [3490 vpl]   (If you started this combo with j.2C / Counter-hit Air assault j.2C)

 

Highest Corner Combo:

 

66C > 236A > 2B > 5CC > 623A > 5B (delay) B > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 214          3206 dmg   [3518 vpl]   ("5B" must hit before the wall-bounce of "623A")

                                                                                                                                                             

                                                                                                                   .....  > 623B > 214 > 236C > j.2C > j.C          3910 dmg   [4290 vpl]   (100 meter)

 

                                                                                                                   .....  > 623B > 214 > 214C > 236C > j.2C > j.C          4313 dmg   [4792 vpl]   (200 meter, Chain Shift/Veil off/Infinite Worth-free)

 

Highest Corner Combo (Overhead Version):

 

j.2C > 66C > 236A > 623A > 5B > 5C > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 214          3108 dmg   [3414 vpl]   ("5B" must hit before the wall-bounce of "623A")

 

                                                                                                    .....  > 623B > 214 > 236C > j.2C > j.C          3829 dmg   [4204 vpl]   (100 meter)

 

 

*Takes Highest Corner Combo & reinforces bragging rights position what am I doing!?*

 

Veil Off > 66C > 236A > 2B > 5CC > 623A > 5B (delay) B > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 214 > 214C > 236C > EXIW          6365 dmg (Vorpal)

[Rikir]

Oooh looks good, I wanna try these out but I don't have my PS3 :<.

Also...

 

Highest Corner Combo (compared to 3038 I beleive):

j.2C > 66C > 236A > 2C > 5C > 5BB (first hit misses) > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 213A    3075 dmg  [3374 vorpal]

 

Higher Corner Combo (slight variation):

j.2C > 66C > 236A > 623A > 5BB > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 213A    3085 dmg [3389 vorpal]          (The "623A > 5BB" part: 5BB must hit before the wall-bounce of 623A)

 

 

As for my 200 meter corner combo, I use this one. It's nothing special, but the advantage of using it is that there's no "veil off hassle" and you get to keep your GRD advantage / chain shift opportunity.

Your average combo using these elements end around 4850 vorpal, so it's entirely up to you!

 

j.2C > 66C > 236A > 5B > 2C > 5CC > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 213C > 236C > j.2C > j.5C    4203  [4612 vorpal]

 

 

For bragging rights lol:

Veil off > j.2C > 66C > 236A > 5B > 2C > 5CC > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 623B > 213C > 236C >EXIW    6222 vorpal  (Beat BrianKyo's 6115 Ohohohoho... forgive me)

Fix your 213 inputs to 214 please lol. I got confused for a good 5 seconds.



------------------

I also had something else to post:
 

Aki Fisher (Highest Ranking Netplay Chaos) vs Gordeau (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=UHcpE9DpSqg#t=299)

HIGHER QUALITY REPLAY: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pj4pll0z99M
-------------------

Edit: More stuff to post:

 

Looks like Shimazaki won battle arena:

https://twitter.com/ba_shinjuku/status/586133429076393984

 

vs
KDT (Orie)
Kurosupi (Yuzu)

Jikan Gire (Linne)

(no replay though)

[Motakshi]

EDIT: Woops scratch all that, I didn't see you had updated your post on CH j2C damage, you managed to bump it up a little past the damage I was going to try and one-up you with.

 

My Chaos may be fundamentally different, but I think these are some stuff that everybody can appreciate~

Here's some of the stuff I use; don't worry, they're all meterless, consistent, easy to do & work on Linne. Since it's an overhead, you actually have a chance landing these. Works from a normal j.2C or counter hit Air assault (if that's what it's called, beats me!).

 

 

 

 

I'm curious though, what do you mean when you say your Chaos is fundamentally different? If you're saying you've had success playing him in other ways than I/others have been, I'm definitely willing to listen.

[Anim8rDude]

Fix your 213 inputs to 214 please lol. I got confused for a good 5 seconds.

 

Oh, sorry 'bout that. Fixed! What the heck is a 213 lol?

 

 

I'm curious though, what do you mean when you say your Chaos is fundamentally different? If you're saying you've had success playing him in other ways than I/others have been, I'm definitely willing to listen.

 

I-it's hard to say. Whenever I get a fighting game, I start my characters from scratch without consulting videos or anything. In the end, I usually end up with different combos/playstyle just to feel a sense of accomplishment when learning a character... I guess.

 

I just play Chaos as a rushdown character. I constantly stay close to my opponent & keep zoning to a minimum. I don't use 22A/B whatsoever. I use a lot of 623A/B; it catches people off-guard.

 

It's hard to say if I've had more success playing this way 'cause of my junk internet (most of the time), but when I've heard that some players have trouble playing Chaos & then I see them zoning, I'm like "N-no wonder you're having trouble!".

It is a matter of opinion after all, but when I stay close to my opponent, I certainly feel way more comfortable & it`s certainly a heck of a lot more entertaining.

 

 

Here`s a couple of stuff I use 24/7:

 

5BB > 623A > 5C >  j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 6C > 214

 

The combo itself / damage doesn't really matter, but I use this to stay close to my opponent. After 214, I usually do Chaos's roll foward to get himself into position; the combo (or really, just any combo that ends with ...2C > 236B > 6C > 214) puts the opponent at a height where if he air-techs fowards, he'll land directly in back of you. If he air-techs away from you, just dash towards him.

 

 

My Block string combo:

 

2AAA > 5BB > 2B > 5C > 236A > 2C > 236B > ...623A > 214A     (Completely safe, the 214A fireball will still hit them even if they destroy the lizard. If it's a counter hit, continue your pressure.)

                                                                         ...214C > Continue Pressure     (Completely safe, No openings!)

                                                                         ...6C > Chainshift immediately after > Continue pressure     (Mostly safe, DPs/EXIW will get you, but they might not know that!)

                                                                         ... Roll foward > Continue Pressure    (Yes, there's an opening here, but it's actually hard to see because at this point, you're actually focusing on the lizard's 236 attack that by the time you see him touch the ground, your roll is done.)

 

 

To be honest, I *always* expect my opponent to block. There's no openings in this combo, & it's also long enough (12 hits!) to make your opponent open up ahead of time.

If you have meter to spare, you can use 214C which continues your pressure, & there's also an illusion of an opening between the 2nd & 3rd hit of 214C, so they might open up on the last hit.

 

Once you use this block string enough times, your opponents will start respecting it; they will probably start using Guard thrusts. When they start doing that, you are going to have to drop some moves such as 2B to make your future moves hit. On the other hand, since they're anticipating future moves, I've had a lot of success going in for grabs right after 5BB.

 

...

 

It's actually hard explaing all this. It would probably be easier if we just had some matches, but with my connection you can expect some dropped combos, delayed blocks & no grab cancels. But still, they could be fun & we could learn a lot of stuff (I-I actually d-don't know much about other Chaos players...)!

 

*Adds Motakshi 'cause you never know*

[Motakshi]

 

Oh, sorry 'bout that. Fixed! What the heck is a 213 lol?

 

 

 

I-it's hard to say. Whenever I get a fighting game, I start my characters from scratch without consulting videos or anything. In the end, I usually end up with different combos/playstyle just to feel a sense of accomplishment when learning a character... I guess.

 

I just play Chaos as a rushdown character. I constantly stay close to my opponent & keep zoning to a minimum. I don't use 22A/B whatsoever. I use a lot of 623A/B; it catches people off-guard.

 

It's hard to say if I've had more success playing this way 'cause of my junk internet (most of the time), but when I've heard that some players have trouble playing Chaos & then I see them zoning, I'm like "N-no wonder you're having trouble!".

It is a matter of opinion after all, but when I stay close to my opponent, I certainly feel way more comfortable & it`s certainly a heck of a lot more entertaining.

 

 

*Adds Motakshi 'cause you never know*

 

That sounds about par for the course, for me atleast. Azhi zoning for the most part is pretty fraudulent, I only really use it if I don't feel comfortable trying to go in or am trying to stall out for Vorpal/meter. If you ever wanna play, let me know, though I'm not sure how the connection will be from Canada to Central US

[Rikir]

5BB > 623A > 5C >  j.B > j.C > j.2C > 2C > 236B > 6C > 214

 

The combo itself / damage doesn't really matter, but I use this to stay close to my opponent. After 214, I usually do Chaos's roll foward to get himself into position; the combo (or really, just any combo that ends with ...2C > 236B > 6C > 214) puts the opponent at a height where if he air-techs fowards, he'll land directly in back of you. If he air-techs away from you, just dash towards him.

Does the fireballs cover them if they air back tech?

EDIT: Wait youre meant to combo into the fireballs right not use it as oki? I think I need a sample x-x

EDIT EDIT: Okay after playing you last night, I understand what this combo is now.

 

That sounds about par for the course, for me atleast. Azhi zoning for the most part is pretty fraudulent, I only really use it if I don't feel comfortable trying to go in or am trying to stall out for Vorpal/meter. If you ever wanna play, let me know, though I'm not sure how the connection will be from Canada to Central US

Alberta is kinda central Canada-ish (not really) so it might be better than our connection :O

[Rikir]

Shimazaki vs Linne:

4/12 UNIEL Leisureland Akihabara Touzaisen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYzSPpUFxc0

[Rikir]

More setups and stuff:

Safejump + Fuzzy Assault vs Gordeau
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx9AYuF86Hs

Vs Waldstein wakeup:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIf47ekt39s

Explanations in descriptions.

[Anim8rDude]

EDIT EDIT: Okay after playing you last night, I understand what this combo is now.

 

Alberta is kinda central Canada-ish (not really) so it might be better than our connection :O

 

Oh shoot! I played you without noticing lol. We had like 20 Chaos mirros & it was you this whole time, shame on me.

 

I actually liked our matches we had that night. Sure, we dropped more combos than a leaking faucet, but they were enjoyable t'ill the end (at least for me). You helped me patch a couple of problems for my Chaos matchup experience, so I'm glad.

I was testing a bunch of random stuff that night in general, so you also helped me figure out what worked and what didn't!

 

Here I was thinking "Maybe I can have some rematches with that Chaos player if he doesn't mind..."

[Rikir]

Oh shoot! I played you without noticing lol. We had like 20 Chaos mirros & it was you this whole time, shame on me.

 

I actually liked our matches we had that night. Sure, we dropped more combos than a leaking faucet, but they were enjoyable t'ill the end (at least for me). You helped me patch a couple of problems for my Chaos matchup experience, so I'm glad.

I was testing a bunch of random stuff that night in general, so you also helped me figure out what worked and what didn't!

 

Here I was thinking "Maybe I can have some rematches with that Chaos player if he doesn't mind..."

Yeah once school is done, I can go to my friend's place and steal his internet for netplay and its guaranteed to be not zero bars like last time. Also are you interested in joining the Chaos skype chat?