[UNIEL] Chaos

[Rikir]

Machida Weekday Tournament

Vs Orie:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBE_Nhq_cTA&feature=player_detailpage#t=310

Vs Carmine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3QA1db-4aI

 

Vs Seth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=qZXFwWEtBz8#t=614


I dont know who this guy is. ;o

EDIT:

His name is Mocchii

[LordSpectreX]

Shuvora is part of my offline scene and im shocked he even got hit by that lol. I can never open this guy up.

In other news, heres some silly stuff:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUUOZUGLtV0

Chaos can force people out of the corner and then cross them up with this silly trick.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XpMfR2kDV8

And on some characters (Wald, Gord) you can hit them with assault j.A (rising) while theyre crouching.

 

I really like this crossup. What's pretty cool about is that if people try to do a regular anti air DP, it will whiff (e.g like Eltnum). They have to wait until you pass over to hit you. But if they knew that then they could just jump up and hit you anyway. I feel this strong if you include it with some standard jump in mixup, i.e, do something like tk236A>j.623A>j.236B>j.2C>delay>j.A for a double overhead. Or whatever you want. A lot of this stuff loses to just being patient, but the crossup opens them up from that, so that's cool.

 

Not something you wanna use all the time, but good to have in your pocket. I'd say it's a good option if your opponent is a fan of just playing defensively and shielding (as they probably should be)

[Rikir]

I really like this crossup. What's pretty cool about is that if people try to do a regular anti air DP, it will whiff (e.g like Eltnum). They have to wait until you pass over to hit you. But if they knew that then they could just jump up and hit you anyway. I feel this strong if you include it with some standard jump in mixup, i.e, do something like tk236A>j.623A>j.236B>j.2C>delay>j.A for a double overhead. Or whatever you want. A lot of this stuff loses to just being patient, but the crossup opens them up from that, so that's cool.

 

Not something you wanna use all the time, but good to have in your pocket. I'd say it's a good option if your opponent is a fan of just playing defensively and shielding (as they probably should be)

A quick note to mention is that you can only get behind them if theyre stand blocking (so then Azhi's collision box can pop them out), but in that case you can just easily confirm into double overhead once you realize theyre just crouching.

Also @Motakshi

I cant believe I got hit by the 236A > Roll crossup despite knowing about it LOL.

[Rikir]

Touzaisen:

Vs Vatista:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=iEla6Jui_c0#t=229

[khmxspider]

when ill get the english version.
i'll be back into this game.
i wanna kick ass with chaos again.

[LordSpectreX]

So after a particularly busy winter period and playing a bunch of other characters (I can play over half the cast to a competent level now lol) I decided to go back to Chaos in order to get ready for an EU major.

 

Unfortunately, I've been pretty lazy with him. The characters clicks amazingly with me, but that's also a bit of a curse. I still haven't developed much of my gameplay, in pure technicals, he's worse than my Carmine, Yuzu etc. Hell, I didn't even know 2C>22B>BC was actually a crossup until 2 days ago. That's how behind I am. I'd like to catch up and bit, and if any of you could help me with that, that'd be great.

 

I think I'm pretty aware of his midscreen oki now. 2C>BC, 66C>BC, j.2C>214. All the oki you get from that. I feel like I'm pretty good at his pressure as well, so that's not too much of an issue.

 

Two main problems as of right now are corner oki and burst confirms.

 

First, regarding corner oki, I'm aware of some combos (such as the 6C>22A>66C>66C) route giving knockdown, but I'm curious as to if it's worth doing, since doing a standard combo into air tech ender like 623B seems to give you plenty of advantage anyway, including being able to do dash under crossups and sneaky mixups. Wondering if there was any reason to go for knockdown in the corner?

 

The other thing is that I'm not sure what a really good way to spend 200 meter (with or without CS). Generally, I do;

Midscreen: ...>j.2C>2C>6C>236A>IW

and

Corner: (2A>2B)>2C>236A>236B>623B>236C>5A whiff walk back>VO>2C>IW.

 

But that's kinda it. Any suggestions for any significantly better combos into high damage if I need it?

[Rikir]

I typically prefer to keep them in the corner if im doing oki. I've seen some Chaos players just go for 623B air ender but I'm not a huge fan of that in the corner. A j.2C > 214[A] meaty sets up a simple high/low afterwards with assault which follows into good pressure even if blocked.

In terms of combos, my incomplete Chaos combo doc has some good VO combos:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Z-5iXxZ3cValVTsvYHVcD-ub8oi_BeBybn1Hc8ftKhk/edit

Theres a lot of Chaos oki setups if you flip back to the previous pages.

[LordSpectreX]

So it seems like the best universal way to get as much damage as possible + j.2C ender is

 

blahblah launcher > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 66C > 22A > 5B > 5C > j.2C > 214[A]?

 

I'm guessing there's been no way to set up any oki vs delay/no techs?

[Rikir]

So it seems like the best universal way to get as much damage as possible + j.2C ender is

 

blahblah launcher > j.B > j.C > j.2C > 66C > 22A > 5B > 5C > j.2C > 214[A]?

 

I'm guessing there's been no way to set up any oki vs delay/no techs?

dont you mean j.B > j.C > j.2C > 214[A]? But yeah something along that line is about right. 66C ender is also an option in the corner. Youre just looking for a knockdown really.

 

I actually don't have much setups vs delay tech. I need to work on those. 22B setups are probably a lot better if they delay tech but I gotta look at it to confirm.

 

[LordSpectreX]

dont you mean j.B > j.C > j.2C > 214[A]? But yeah something along that line is about right. 66C ender is also an option in the corner. Youre just looking for a knockdown really.

 

I actually don't have much setups vs delay tech. I need to work on those. 22B setups are probably a lot better if they delay tech but I gotta look at it to confirm.

There's a few incorrect notations in the doc, this just happens to work anyway lol.

[Rikir]

There's a few incorrect notations in the doc, this just happens to work anyway lol.

WHAT WHERE? I REALLY NEED TO EDIT THIS AT SOME POINT.

 

 

EDIT:

There is no existing Chaos skype group. Would you guys be interested in forming one?

EDIT EDIT:

I already went ahead and made one anyway. PM your Skype ID if you want an add.

[LordSpectreX]

WHAT WHERE? I REALLY NEED TO EDIT THIS AT SOME POINT.

 

 

 

Bottom of Page 7.

 

tbh i'm probably gonna steal it and clean it up a bit if that's okay lol, adds some notes for what the combo does and where to find it etc.

 

Anyway regarding the lack of no tech oki. I believe the answer is easier than I thought, it looks like from what I can tell the best thing to do is j.2C>j.214. Once you see the fireballs whiff, jump over them and 623B. Messes up DP inputs, avoids a lot of DPs anyway. Super plus cause of the 623x. Seems to work in theory, will have to try it more though. 

 

By the same note, you can do j.214[b} whiff > backdash > 623B. Obv loses to some DPs like Eltnum's 421C or Gord's 623C. 

 

The main problem with Chaos' oki is that there's no way to use CS effectively to beat DPs. Only 6C and 214[X] are CS cancelable on whiff, but the cancel window is way too late, and you'll lose to the above stated DPs. 

 

I am starting to believe that Eltnum might be Chaos' hardest matchup. There honestly doesn't feel like an aspect of the matchup where you have a distinct advantage like you do vs Gordeau or Hilda.

[Rikir]

 

Bottom of Page 7.

 

tbh i'm probably gonna steal it and clean it up a bit if that's okay lol, adds some notes for what the combo does and where to find it etc.

 

Anyway regarding the lack of no tech oki. I believe the answer is easier than I thought, it looks like from what I can tell the best thing to do is j.2C>j.214. Once you see the fireballs whiff, jump over them and 623B. Messes up DP inputs, avoids a lot of DPs anyway. Super plus cause of the 623x. Seems to work in theory, will have to try it more though. 

 

By the same note, you can do j.214[b} whiff > backdash > 623B. Obv loses to some DPs like Eltnum's 421C or Gord's 623C. 

 

The main problem with Chaos' oki is that there's no way to use CS effectively to beat DPs. Only 6C and 214[X] are CS cancelable on whiff, but the cancel window is way too late, and you'll lose to the above stated DPs. 

 

I am starting to believe that Eltnum might be Chaos' hardest matchup. There honestly doesn't feel like an aspect of the matchup where you have a distinct advantage like you do vs Gordeau or Hilda.

If you have time to update the document, feel free to. Just post up the finished doc somewhere for us to see ;o.

 

On a side note, I feel we should probably compile an okizeme document.

[khmxspider]

Midscreen
66c > 22a (whiff) > 5b > 5cc > etc.
Doesnt work on everyone though

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LouXofGzeTs

[Rikir]

Midscreen

66c > 22a (whiff) > 5b > 5cc > etc.

Doesnt work on everyone though

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LouXofGzeTs

I mentioned in chat. But just doing 66C > 236A is a way better route since you get to use Azhi.

[Motakshi]

I'd enjoy an add to that group. Skype ID should be trill-tan/Trill if that doesn't come up.

A quick question/idea for oki on Carmine:

You can use 66B to stuff wakeup Wald EX Command Grab/EX Assimilation, right? I tried the same against Tsundere-chan's Carmine, but wakeup CS -> EX Grab consistently hit me anyways. I think because the startup is slow enough to jump out of on superflash, the tech jump ends and the grab connects. I know you can jump out after the superflash, but trying to press buttons on his wakeup gets me blown up and doing nothing lets him get out back to neutral or start his own pressure for free, which is less than ideal. Would 5B (delay) B both meaty his wakeup and stuff the delayed startup of EX Grab? It seems like it should work, and if it does it seems pretty massive. His only other pseudo reversal has no actual start up invulnerability if I recall, and the upwards hitbox on 5B B might stuff it too.

Also for maximum cheese, 9TK 623B when timed right dodges Hyde's DP on wakeup. I think it'll beat Vatistas/Orie/Akatsuki's too, just based on the way it goes right above his head, but I'm not sure on its actual hitbox.

[Crimefighter]

It is theoretically possible to beat carmines ex grab with 66b (all ex grabs are jumpable on super flash), but the timing to do it consistantly without reacting to superflash is too hard to be viable. 5bb is the better option. Im pretty sure you can meaty 5b, then hit with 5bb (you may have to not perfectly meaty, until we get frame data on when the throw invun starts/ends I can't be sure), alternatively you can meaty with an air normal. That will beat all option except stand sheild, which you can throw/low him for trying

[Rikir]

Heres my current version of the Chaos General document:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Zm-ny087oiCBfTqNLQRdpXCMbRGKq3euXqZXUwKpJSA/edit

Take a look for me please!

[Crimefighter]

Extra weird thing to mention: if 22x trades (as in chaos is hit right when azhi bites) azhi finishes the bite and wont die unless chaos is still in hitstun. You can test it by makeing 22as trade in training mode. It looks really funny too.

[Avatar_of_Chaos]

Hi, I wasn't sure where would be the most appropriate place to post on this forum, since this is partly a self-introductory post, but since I'm interested in Chaos and this appears to be a somewhat active thread, this should suffice. If not, I apologise.

 

Firstly, I don't own UNIEL. I didn't even know it existed until about a week ago when it popped up on one of my amazon feeds. I'll be getting the game later this month when it releases in the EU. I'm going to be an absolute scrub since I've never really played any 2D fighters before. My main fighting game has been Tekken, which I've been playing since Tekken 1 on the PS1, so I'm used to a whole different style of fighter. But Tag 2 was a big disappointment to me and I hate the changes they've made in Tekken 7. I've been playing Tekken 6 but the community is on its last legs, and I think it's time that I move over to another fighting game.

 

I've been watching lots of UNIEL vids and quickly became interested in Chaos. (Partly because he has that cool lizard pet. Not gonna deny it!) But then I come across a tier list and see Chaos in C tier, so I'm curious to know how balanced the game is. I don't mind dealing with difficult match-ups provided the characters are still viable for tournament play. If anyone is able to compare it to Tekken 6's balance (a long shot, I know) that'd be great.

 

On that note, anyone know if they'll rebalance it post western release? Given that different characters have different life stats surely it'd be the easiest thing in the world. Provided the devs actually care, that is. Gordeau at 10,500 and Seth at 8,100...

 

I hope this wasn't out of place for this thread. I'll probably be more active here soon enough! Just 11 more days!

[Crimefighter]

I don't know what T6 is like, but UNiB has pretty good balance. There is probably some update in the works, since the composer is making new music but I wouldn't hold my breath. Also if you want to do a proper intro check the match finder for your closest local scene

[Avatar_of_Chaos]

I don't know what T6 is like, but UNiB has pretty good balance. There is probably some update in the works, since the composer is making new music but I wouldn't hold my breath. Also if you want to do a proper intro check the match finder for your closest local scene

 

Well I thought an update might be possible because it is literally as simple as changing some numbers in a line of code to alter health stats. Seeing Seth in low tier with the lowest amount of health is just baffling to me. (I don't suppose people have contacted the devs?) And Tekken 6 was balanced enough that you'd see low tier characters placing in the top 3 in tournaments.

[Crimefighter]

It costs like 30k to patch a game on psn, sony charges a fee.

[RurouniLoneWolf]

Patches stopped having a fee shortly after the SG IGG campaign got funded. Also, I'm pretty sure it was $10k, not $30k.

[LordSpectreX]

Changing numbers doesn't balance a game. This isn't like Tekken where the vast majority of the cast play nearly identical to eachother and you simply change numbers based on the strengths of their attacks.

 

Anime games tend to have characters that have very extreme playstyles and strengths. Despite being low tier, Seth has one of, if not THE best mixup in the game. Even Chaos has some pretty huge strengths over other characters in the cast. 

 

The game is pretty balanced. Orie, Hyde and Yuzuriha, 3 pretty lowish characters do consistently well in tournaments. Seth is a very unstable character and so while he can sometimes win lots of games vs top tiers with ease, it's very easy for him to just lose, making him a fairly bad tournament character. Byakuya is extremely technical and thus not a lot of people put time into him. 

 

Chaos is unviable, but only in the sense that once you reach high level play, you're not going to beat a Gordeau, Eltnum or Merk on the same level as you. Though while I don't mean to be rude, you're not exactly going to reach that level any time soon no matter what character you pick. Weak characters are generally better for learning the game anyway since you have to learn the game more instead of abusing certain strengths your character might have.