[UNIEL] Akatsuki

[Grimsley-San]

So i've been having problems with any of the 6C follow-ups aside from 214ABC and 2B/C. I'm looking at the 6C juggle loops, and I can't ever get any of the moves out fast enough. Even with the official UNIEL video where 6C is canceled into 236C on block, I cannot do. Am I missing something here?

 

 

Are they being launched high enough for  236C to hit?

Iirc, when doing a specific combo/starter, 6C won't launch as high.

[Archalieus]

Are they being launched high enough for  236C to hit?

Iirc, when doing a specific combo/starter, 6C won't launch as high.

 

Yes, it should be. I've observed how high the opponent goes when 6C lands (float vs standing), but I can't seem to throw out anything fast enough. Currently, I cannot cancel 6C with anything aside from Chain Shift. While that may be the property of the move, I can't get any of the follow ups to work.

An example would be the 6C fireball chain, 6C > 6C > 236A > 6C, etc. I cannot get the fireball to come out fast enough. Another example would be the 6C > 22B ender string. I cannot get 22B out fast enough connect in a combo, and it barely hits with raw 6C.

 

Video i'm using as practice reference:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVFaVzwjHkY

1:18 shows the 6C fireball combo.

[LuminAbyss]

Yes, it should be. I've observed how high the opponent goes when 6C lands (float vs standing), but I can't seem to throw out anything fast enough. Currently, I cannot cancel 6C with anything aside from Chain Shift. While that may be the property of the move, I can't get any of the follow ups to work.

An example would be the 6C fireball chain, 6C > 6C > 236A > 6C, etc. I cannot get the fireball to come out fast enough. Another example would be the 6C > 22B ender string. I cannot get 22B out fast enough connect in a combo, and it barely hits with raw 6C.

 

Video i'm using as practice reference:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVFaVzwjHkY

1:18 shows the 6C fireball combo.

 

6C loops are different depending on the starter AND character you're doing it on. Different characters require different timings (you can't even do it on Eltnum off anything but j.2C and 6C), and different starters are gonna affect how quickly the untech time decays in your combo. The good news is it is possible off any starter that isn't an Assault.

 

6C also has an extremely strict cancel window for specials, and you're gonna need to grind that out. You cannot delay specials at all off of it. Instead, in order to get the correct height to juggle, you have to time your 6C to catch them as they're falling. Off Raw 6C, it's also spacing dependent. Depending on how close/far you are from the opponent, you have to hit them differently with 6C in order of the fireball to connect. Simply put, it's a really difficult combo that's gonna require a lot of practice before you start hitting it consistently. I've been playing this character practically since release and only within the last two months or so have I been able to get the 6C loops consistently.

 

Probably the easiest version of the 6C loop is doing it off a raw j.2C, so j.2C > cl.C > delay gatling 6C > 236A > 6C > 236A > 6C > 22B. This will help you at least get the basic feel for it.

[Archalieus]

6C loops are different depending on the starter AND character you're doing it on. Different characters require different timings (you can't even do it on Eltnum off anything but j.2C and 6C), and different starters are gonna affect how quickly the untech time decays in your combo. The good news is it is possible off any starter that isn't an Assault.

 

6C also has an extremely strict cancel window for specials, and you're gonna need to grind that out. You cannot delay specials at all off of it. Instead, in order to get the correct height to juggle, you have to time your 6C to catch them as they're falling. Off Raw 6C, it's also spacing dependent. Depending on how close/far you are from the opponent, you have to hit them differently with 6C in order of the fireball to connect. Simply put, it's a really difficult combo that's gonna require a lot of practice before you start hitting it consistently. I've been playing this character practically since release and only within the last two months or so have I been able to get the 6C loops consistently.

 

Probably the easiest version of the 6C loop is doing it off a raw j.2C, so j.2C > cl.C > delay gatling 6C > 236A > 6C > 236A > 6C > 22B. This will help you at least get the basic feel for it.

 

Thanks for the reply. Turns out canceling 6C into anything was different that what I thought. Originally, I had been inputting moves/specials after the majority of the 6C animation has finished, when in reality, I should input the move almost before 6C comes out visually, but after it's been inputted.

[LuminAbyss]

Thanks for the reply. Turns out canceling 6C into anything was different that what I thought. Originally, I had been inputting moves/specials after the majority of the 6C animation has finished, when in reality, I should input the move almost before 6C comes out visually, but after it's been inputted.

 

Yeah, it's really tight, that pretty much is the timing, I just didn't know how to describe it since it's basically second nature to me now.

 

On a different subject

 

discuss

[Icekin]

I don't see how Nanase qualifies for a good matchup. When I play her Akatsuki is nothing to be afraid of. When I play Akatsuki, she gives me trouble.

Vatista's not that bad to me. The rest is accurate (Yuzu higher maybe?)

[LuminAbyss]

I don't see how Nanase qualifies for a good matchup. When I play her Akatsuki is nothing to be afraid of. When I play Akatsuki, she gives me trouble.

Vatista's not that bad to me. The rest is accurate (Yuzu higher maybe?)

 

In my experience, there's nothing of her's we have to be afraid of. If she uses her force function in pressure, it's usually a free out of some sort for us. A lot of times we can just 6C (head invuln so it beats her air normals) to hit her, or air grab her if she likes to go straight up. If she uses it to go back, we're out of pressure. Her follow-ups are all punishable save for  236x~C, which is safe as far as I know. But her overhead follow-ups can either be parried on reaction, or blocked and punished with 5A into a full combo.

 

Probably the only thing we have to worry about it chasing her down. Her mobility is really good, and I guess that could give us a problem. But that's the same deal with Seth and he's ez. I will admit, Nanase is a match-up I need to play more, she and Vatista both, but my experience with Vatista has been incredibly painful. Lasers and orbs keep you out, and even once you get in, you can't go nuts with your pressure because of that flashkick (unlike a lot of other characters, where it's easy to go ham once you're in).

 

On the subject of Yuzu, I think it's even because she can space us well, but once we get in it's easy for us to keep her blocking and open her up. The only issue against her is her 4B stops fireball pressure really easily, and that's a really strong tool for Akatsuki that allows him to go all in while on pressure, and that's what keeps me from saying it's in our favor like with Hilda (who also spaces/zones us well). That and the fact that she lacks things that are easy to parry, like Hilda.

[Ryuuaka]

Idk if this combo is on here but I believe it is more then theoretically possible with someone who has fast finger. It could be a good corner carry with large damage cash out.

6C>6C>236A>6C>236A>6646C>???

You could do a 214A to j.BAC

or if they are at the corner do your average corner Vertical J.c after the 214.

This is all theoretical, maybe someone can test it? I will continue to do it.

The only one I could do was a dash C to 236A. But if you do a dash cancel with 4 you wont get the dash kick but a normal 6C out of a full dash..

[LuminAbyss]

MY BROTHERS WE CAN COMBO INTO AIR GRAB NOW

[kp1202]

Hello, new member here, decided to stop lurking and try to learn more on how to get better with Akatsuki. In reply to the match-ups thread, I would have to ask what makes the Hilda match-up good in our favor? Imo, it feels very rough to me, same with the yuzu match-up, they are some of the hardest I think. Other than that this feels fairly accurate, theres probably certain things i'm just missing pertaining to the match-ups.

 

Disclamer: I'm not too good at parrying, I think I need to get better internet.

[Neophos]

When you parry a move, it can't be cancelled into anything else. So several of Hilda's best pokes like 2B or 2C can be maneuvered around by parrying. In addition, ic5C (charged 5C) is a free punish for Akatsuki if he parries it, just dash up and 5B (or dash 6C if you've practiced that).

Only go for 6B when she starts to low shield brazenly, you'll just kill your pressure if it gets blocked. Switch between frame traps, pressure resets, 214A and throws to keep her on her toes. If 214A hits meaty it's plus on block, but I haven't researched what setups work against Hilda.

On a hard read on a lynchpin in a block string, do 236A IW for huge damage. Remember that your IW has good range, and raw IW is a solid threat if she starts getting predictable with her block strings.

[kp1202]

When you parry a move, it can't be cancelled into anything else. So several of Hilda's best pokes like 2B or 2C can be maneuvered around by parrying. In addition, ic5C (charged 5C) is a free punish for Akatsuki if he parries it, just dash up and 5B (or dash 6C if you've practiced that).

Only go for 6B when she starts to low shield brazenly, you'll just kill your pressure if it gets blocked. Switch between frame traps, pressure resets, 214A and throws to keep her on her toes. If 214A hits meaty it's plus on block, but I haven't researched what setups work against Hilda.

On a hard read on a lynchpin in a block string, do 236A IW for huge damage. Remember that your IW has good range, and raw IW is a solid threat if she starts getting predictable with her block strings.

 

Thanks for all the advice. 214A does seem to be the best way to continue blockstrings to me, due to the slight frame advantage it makes easy to put on pressure. Also I guess I really will have to learn to parry, especially for this match-up. Getting in is the main problem I have, staying in isn't as hard for me.

[kp1202]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uyy1kku_PhA

 

I'm feeling better about the Yuzu match-up after watching this.

[Icekin]

That video is just a good player vs a bad player. I don't think it really says anything about the matchup.

[Neophos]

Unless you're specifically looking for UNIST footage, I would recommend you to look at Grove or Senaru vs Maakun to get an idea of how to play the matchup at a high level. Maybe it won't give you hope about the matchup, because Maakun doesn't give away wins easily, but it might give you some ideas to work with.

[LuminAbyss]

Hello, new member here, decided to stop lurking and try to learn more on how to get better with Akatsuki. In reply to the match-ups thread, I would have to ask what makes the Hilda match-up good in our favor? Imo, it feels very rough to me, same with the yuzu match-up, they are some of the hardest I think. Other than that this feels fairly accurate, theres probably certain things i'm just missing pertaining to the match-ups.

 

Disclamer: I'm not too good at parrying, I think I need to get better internet.

 

Hilda and Yuzu are both match-ups that are a test of patience more than anything. You have to move in slowly and surely but once you get in, there is little they can do about you as they lack good fast close range points and decent reversals, and you outdamage them both consistently. 

 

Hilda specifically has no way to stop you once you've cornered her, all of her moves are too slow to beat out your jabs and pokes. She lacks a reversal and has to rely on Veil-Off which is EASILY baited. She controls a lot of space at neutral, but it's very specific space, and so you simply have to be patient and move correctly to maneuver and get closer to her. In the mean time, when she does make you block, you get to shield and build grind, and you can parry her 5[C] overhead for a free punish.

[kp1202]

Alright, patience has been a thing that has always seemed pretty apparent in both those matchups yes, and it is true that there are times where if I get a hilda trapped into the corner I can usually take the round. I guess what I'm still curious about is what is a proper answer to hilda teleporting out of the corner when they get trapped, it seems too fast to be able to punish on reaction, so the best I could think of is catch them with a punish combo on the other side, but that still gets them out of the corner. Is there a proper answer I'm missing or do we just kind of have to respect that option?

[Tari]

Hilda's teleport is pretty slow to start up. I'm not an Akatsuki player, but I'd imagine it's not very different for him and most other characters when pressuring Hilda in the corner. If she's teleporting out of the corner, it probably means you're giving her too much breathing room.

 

As a Yuzu player, I also use her teleport to escape from the corner versus certain characters, but only as a hard read on my opponent backing off and giving me room to hang myself with. If I don't think they're going to back off to try to bait something, I will pretty much never try teleporting out, because it's an almost guaranteed way to get counterhit into a massive corner combo.

 

Could you give an example of when a Hilda might be teleporting out?

[kp1202]

Just on wake-up I guess? It's been a while since I've had it happen personally, but I probably gave them too much breathing room, or did my oki option too early, which is typically a jump-in with 9b. Its probably just my lack of the matchup honestly haha, but I always thought she had invul on the teleport until she switched sides.

[Tari]

I believe she does become invuln for the scant few frames when she's actually in the process of disappearing and reappearing, but not for any other parts of the move. I could be wrong, though, and I wouldn't be surprised if she just had absolutely no invuln at all. She's definitely not invuln from start to end, in any case.

If you have Hilda in a corner, she pretty much has no easy answer to being pressured. It wouldn't be a long stretch for someone to argue that she has the worst defense in the game, especially once cornered. That's definitely the right time to start bullying her.

[madigawadesperate]

 

Hilda and Yuzu are both match-ups that are a test of patience more than anything. You have to move in slowly and surely but once you get in, there is little they can do about you as they lack good fast close range points and decent reversals, and you outdamage them both consistently. 

 

Hilda specifically has no way to stop you once you've cornered her, all of her moves are too slow to beat out your jabs and pokes. She lacks a reversal and has to rely on Veil-Off which is EASILY baited. She controls a lot of space at neutral, but it's very specific space, and so you simply have to be patient and move correctly to maneuver and get closer to her. In the mean time, when she does make you block, you get to shield and build grind, and you can parry her 5[C] overhead for a free punish.

I need to stop you for the misinformation, guard thrust is a very strong option for hilda for those who are carelessly mashing away at offense and tk j.2c is amazing for destroying bad low pokes and even if you do block tk  j.2c it's +1 and i can Gatling you to mid screen. Also any hilda who knows the matchup will not do 5[c] because akatsuki players love looking for that move.

 Its probably just my lack of the matchup honestly haha, but I always thought she had invul on the teleport until she switched sides.

Hilda's only defensive options are veil off, guard thrust and dive kick. Teleport has no invul and you can hit her when she's invisible which is why her teleport are more of an offensive tool.

[Tachyons]

Has it been mentioned that Akatsuki's IW does not reset to midscreen now?

 

[kp1202]

Well after putting a lot more time in, this is personally how I feel the match-ups go. Most of it really relies on the players though, especially with the Hilda match and Seth, need more experience against Chaos players, but having so little wake-up options really hurts him against our somewhat strong oki game. I may be overreacting a bit with Elt, but I feel played properly she can outpoke Akatsuki fairly easily, 2b catches a lot. The 5-5s I feel pretty confident on, Orie might be 5.5-4.5, same with Yuzu. Raw tatsu b seems to be a weirdly good tool against Wald from my experience, since its technically airborne it will dodge his throw game, only problem is the piddly amount of damage without vorpal. Linne just feels like fighting a better version of Akatsuki honestly. Carmine and Byakuya are both really tough, They have stronger normals, and if they gain their momentum, it becomes extremely hard to turn the tide. However if you are able to gain the advantage first, your chances are a lot better, due to their defensive options, at least without meter, you can keep the offensive and possibly take the round. Vatista honestly feels like an 8-2 almost, this is the one matchup I still really struggle with understanding what to do. She can out fireball us, the flash kick beats a lot of our approach options, plus her normals seem to beat ours at all points, correct me if I'm wrong but I feel like 5a/2a has as much if not a bigger hitbox than Akatsukis 5b. You have to pretty much make every read right, and go for optimized damage at all cost. Also had a vat f. kick in reaction to my overhead, so that puts that in perspective I hope. Gord and Merkava kind of go without saying, Gord just straight up has better everything in every way, you have to rely heavily on the fireball and punish game, and see if you can work them to the corner and keep them there, or you'll probably lose. Merkava essentially can do the same of out-footsieing us, but also the flying makes it near impossible to get in, and his qcb's legit end our fireball game, I've gotten punished with it on reaction everytime, you have to use them after they press a button, and even still they might be able to catch you. The gameplan of force to the corner stands the same here I would say, but you have to rely almost entirely on punishing, catching counter pokes with 5b/2b, and parries. Well that is my opinion on how these matchups go, always keep strongly in mind player skill can always take priority over character strength, I've lost to plenty of Hildas and Seths, and Defeated plenty of Merkavas and Byakuyas. If you have any personal thoughts, feel free to express your thoughts in contradiction to mine, lets just keep it professional. 

[squish]

I made a list of changes that are for-sure known for [st] Akatsuki. May as well post this here.

EDIT: @jasepi_iidx on Twitter translated Notes' UNIEL[st] Akatsuki Summary Video.

https://www.evernote.com/shard/s454/sh/4968fd8b-836b-4922-ab56-cb0260fb6192/96692996668cef9ff9d6af9479d26a22

 

 

Image attached is Akatsuki's cl.5B in [st]

Works as a solid AA just like in ABK. You can also gatling cl.5B into 5B as well

[VioletMurakumo]

On 12/6/2015 at 8:18 PM, squish said:

I made a list of changes that are for-sure known for [st] Akatsuki. May as well post this here.

If any information is incorrect or if I am missing anything, let me know. I'm also not very good at wording these changes either :<

 

2A: Now hits low (previously mid)
5B: Extended window on cancelling into other normals
New normal: Close 5B (same as the one from Blitzkampf, image attached below)
2C: No longer prorates as badly as it used to
Far 5C: No longer whiffs vs crouching characters
6B: Frame advantage changed so it is now safe on block (supposedly -2, so can be punished on shield)
6C: Can now be cancelled on block with CS (Can supposedly cancel on block with EX moves too; but unconfirmed)
66B: Can now hit OTG
66C: More active frames
J2C: Can now be air EX cancelled on hit
J9B and J9C: Hitboxes adjusted so these two moves will no longer whiff on crouching opponents when assaulting
214A: Opponent hit by this move will now be put in a butt-drop state making it easier to combo off of 214A
J214a: Less recovery
J214B: Opponent must now hit the ground before being able to tech
214X: Akatsuki floats a bit higher while performing 214X to prevent whiffs, also does a better job of highprofiling lows
214C: Now projectile invuln
236B, J236B: The projectile now travels faster across the screen, has better recovery, and opponents hit will be sent into the air making it easier for Akatsuki to approach (on CH, they'll also get KD'd similar to ABK Akatsuki 236C)
236C, J236C: Can now follow up after either 236C with normals (follow up after J236C is dependent on proration and height. Should work anywhere now as opposed to just in the corner and very few instances midscreen in UNIEL)
22A: Can now be EX cancelled on hit, block, and whiff. KDs opponent on CH
22C: More invlun on start up
IW: Damage changed from 3K, to 3.9K. No longer resets to midscreen
Air throw: Akatsuki can now combo into air-throw; but will always end his current combo so it is recommended to use it as an ender or to sideswap
FF: Akatsuki now gains GRD on successful parry
Vorpal trait: FF prorates better, also does more damage

Image attached is Akatsuki's cl.5B in [st]

Works as a solid AA just like in ABK. You can also gatling cl.5B into 5B as well

Thank you!