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Tigre

[UNIEL] Byakuya

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I have a couple of questions about oki and pressing, sorry if they are stupid.

On midscreen after rekka ender the only oki I can do is 623C->stuff? Do I have other options? Do I have midscreen combos with solid meterless oki?

And what is the best way for pressing? Is it safe to jump on people with 214a-a-a or -214a-b-b-j.B in blockstrings? Because I don't think so but I don't see ways for continue my pressure after several hits on block

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I'm probably not the first to have discovered this, but I found a neat little left right reset that can lead into itself and does a ton of damage.

 

 

5/2A > 2B > 2C > 5C

delayed j.B > j.A > j.C xx 214C - C - C

 

So basically, the beauty of this is the web is placed right behind where they would land if you just dropped the combo here after the usual delayed air series.

This means you can do a really unseeable left/right with the C followup to the web flip, which then pushes them into the web (regardless of the side you hit on) and allows for a followup combo into the same thing or a BnB for 3600 (completely unoptimised) damage.

 

Right now my followup is just:

 

214C - C - C > web hits

2C > 5C

delayed j.B > j.A > j.C (can just repeat it here)

2C xx 236A > 6A > 6A xx 236C

 

Haven't checked but I would assume that on block the web also gives you pressure in case they guess the right direction.

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@Tomo

 

If I'm not mistaken, an opponent cannot be crossed up while you are in the air.

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@Tomo

 

If I'm not mistaken, an opponent cannot be crossed up while you are in the air.

Wait what? You can block crossups either way? That's a system mechanic I wasn't aware of. Why? Just why?

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Wait what? You can block crossups either way? That's a system mechanic I wasn't aware of. Why? Just why?

 

Probably because of the abundance of huge normals that hit on both sides of the characters. You can still perform cross-unders, which is a common tactic for Linne to attempt since her dash speed is so high. Also, the opponent can air tech after the j.C, which means if they simply hold forward when they tech they'll bounce well away from the web. If they did tech into the web, you would definitely have advantage. Alternatively, you could perform the D followup to place a ground web between you and your opponent in order to control space.

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Probably because of the abundance of huge normals that hit on both sides of the characters. You can still perform cross-unders, which is a common tactic for Linne to attempt since her dash speed is so high. Also, the opponent can air tech after the j.C, which means if they simply hold forward when they tech they'll bounce well away from the web. If they did tech into the web, you would definitely have advantage. Alternatively, you could perform the D followup to place a ground web between you and your opponent in order to control space.

Ah, I did forget to check a forwards tech, so I guess even if you could crossup it wouldn't really be a proper mixup.

 

Surprised there are no crossups at all... I think it is the first time I've ever seen a game do that haha.

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Does he have a good anti-air? Since I find his 3c a bit too slow in some occasions

Not that I could find. The best you can probably do is 5B since it hits so high or simply shielding.

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So far we've kinda just been posting a combo or two here or there when we figure something out.  I went ahead and tried to compile midscreen combos together into a couple lists: one that allows combos to end in 623C and another that is purely screen carry in one direction.  I didn't exhaustively type out similar combos for different starters, and there's also a definite chance there's stuff for a starter I missed or just plain don't know about, so let me know of any new stuff and I'll modify it accordingly.

 

- Side Switch / Combo into 623C Options
 
Note: All combos listed with meterless damage, 236C ender damage, and 623C, Dash C(8 hits) XX 214B~B~D damage for web oki pressure.  Combos done without Vorpal bonus unless necessary for Chain Shift.
 
5A 5B 2C 5C jc j.B j.A j.C 2C XX 236A~4A~A~B (whiff j.A), 2B XX Rekkas [2808 / 3348 / 3165]
2A 5B... [2778 / 3318 / 3132]
 
[3C] XX 214(B or C)~B~B (whiff j.A), 2C 5C jc j.B j.A j.C, 2C XX Rekkas [1960 / 2500 / 2296]
 
DashB XX 236A~4A~A~B (whiff j.A), 2C 5C jc j.B j.A j.C, 2C XX Rekkas [2873 / 3414 / 3228]
 
DashC(8) XX 214(B or C)~B~B (whiff j.A), 2C 5C jc j.B j.A j.C, 2C XX Rekkas [2904 / 3444 / 3242]
 
j.[2C] 5C XX 214A~A~B (whiff j.A), 2C 5C jc j.B j.A j.C, 2C XX Rekkas [2984 / 3524 / 3332]
Assault j.[2C] 5C jc j.B j.A j.C, 2C XX 236A~4A~A~B (whiff j.A), 2B XX Rekkas [2510 / 3050 / 2848]
 
[Vorpal required] 
close B+C CS dash 2C 5C jc j.B j.A j.C, 2C XX 236A~4A~A~B (whiff j.A), 2B XX Rekkas [3179 / 3719 / 3533]
far [b+C] CS DashB XX 236A~4A~A~B (whiff j.A), 2C 5C jc j.B j.A j.C, 2C XX Rekkas [3139 / 3679 / 3477]
 
 
- Corner Carry Combos
 
Note: Most/all of these cannot combo into 623C at all, and also need to be modified if too close to the corner.
 
5A 5B 5C 2C XX 236A~(delay)4A~A~C, DashC(8 hits) XX 214B~B~A, 2B XX Rekkas [2915 / 3455]
2A 5B... [2885 /3425]
 
[3C] XX 214(B or C)~B~A, 2C 5C XX 214B~B~A, 2B XX Rekkas [1967 / 2507]
 
DashB XX 236A~4A~(delay)A~A, 2C 5C XX 214B~B~A, 2B XXRekkas [2951 / 3491]
 
DashC(8) XX 214B~B~A, 2C 5C XX 214B~B~A, 2B XX Rekkas [2951-2992 / 3491-3532]
 
j.[2C] 2C XX 214A~A~C, DashC(8) XX 214B~B~A, 2B XX Rekkas [3013 / 3553]
 
[Vorpal required] 
close B+C CS dash 2C XX 236A~(delay)4A~A~C, DashC(8) XX 214B~B~A, 2B XX Rekkas [3187 / 3727]
far [b+C] CS DashB XX 236A~4A~A~C, DashC(8) XX 214B~B~A, 2B XX Rekkas [3125 / 3665]

 

 

There are also a few combos that Jetm posted before that didn't fit in either category, either because of being screen position dependent or because they side switch but can't combo into 623C, so here those are:

 

DashB XX 236A~(delay)4A~A~A, 2C 5C XX 214A~A~B (whiff j.A), 2C XX Rekkas [3055 / 3595]
 
DashC(8) XX 214B~B~A, 2C 5C XX 214A~A~B (whiff j.A), 2C XX Rekkas [3062 / 3602]
 
(Screen position dependent) 5A 5B 2C 5C 214B~(delay)B~A, 2B XX 214A~A~C, j.[2C], Rekkas [2920 /3460]
 
 
As for corner combos, I really haven't even begun to tackle them myself, so maybe someone else has some good stuff for those.

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So what do you guys tend to do on midscreen oki?

 

Assuming you have the B net and D ground net on them, they wake up with you pretty far away, what are your main options here?

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So what do you guys tend to do on midscreen oki?

 

Assuming you have the B net and D ground net on them, they wake up with you pretty far away, what are your main options here?

 

I don't have much match experience yet, but what I've been trying to do was dashing into max 2B range and either doing 2B or [3C].  You could also try to Assault j.[2C] if you think they're conditioned to not DP, maybe.

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Has anyone else experimented using 623X during pressure? As litchifayebling said earlier at right distances it works kind of like a command grab and doesn't seem to hard to combo of off.  Long start up so I know but maybe used sparingly when you feel opponent is respecting/scared I could see it begin used. Idk this idea popped into my head at gym so ill see if I can try it out against some friends tomorrow.

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Has anyone else experimented using 623X during pressure? As litchifayebling said earlier at right distances it works kind of like a command grab and doesn't seem to hard to combo of off.  Long start up so I know but maybe used sparingly when you feel opponent is respecting/scared I could see it begin used. Idk this idea popped into my head at gym so ill see if I can try it out against some friends tomorrow.

 

I'm testing it at the moment. It's very easy to disrespect, even if used during tick set-ups. I think Frame Traps are the better way to go.

 

 

 

 

On a side note, I figured out some stuff with how his web works. I'm not sure how common knowledge was this but I recall someone saying that he can only have 2 webs out at a time, which apparently is not true.

 

He can have a total of 3 webs out, they all have to be different ones. Repeating a similar web will erase the previous one.

 

1.) The ground web (214A/B/C). Doing the first rekka into the also web counts toward this.

 

2.) Air web. Doing the 2nd rekka into web also counts towards this.

 

3.) Ground trap web. Doing his command grab (263A/B/C) will leave this on the ground if he's not near the opponent. Can also be done on the D follow-up after his web toss jump.

 

 

A pretty cool set-up that you can do after 623C is: 66C, 236A->A/B/C -> D, jump 214A + A/B/C. Your opponent will recover by the time your A/B/C jump after the web toss (have to delay it a little).

 

If done right, your opponent can be waking up to this:

BtoOkOrCUAAtWaZ.jpg

 

I'll make a video later maybe, but I'm lazy.

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Has anyone else experimented using 623X during pressure? As litchifayebling said earlier at right distances it works kind of like a command grab and doesn't seem to hard to combo of off.  Long start up so I know but maybe used sparingly when you feel opponent is respecting/scared I could see it begin used. Idk this idea popped into my head at gym so ill see if I can try it out against some friends tomorrow.

 

2C xx 623b can catch newer players/players not looking for the command grab. The string is tight enough that it can eat some normals before their startup too. However it can be punished by most characters by back dashing on reaction to the command grab.  I think it is useful, but you can't abuse it - only if they aren't expecting it.

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I'm testing it at the moment. It's very easy to disrespect, even if used during tick set-ups. I think Frame Traps are the better way to go.

Any examples of his frametraps? Since i get disrespected/mashed out quite alot in netplay

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Any examples of his frametraps? Since i get disrespected/mashed out quite alot in netplay

 

I just delay my strings, that's it really. Surprisingly effective though and his normals have good reach to allow it.

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Managed to get past 3K off of 5A.

 

If you're roughly at the middle of the stage, you can:

 

5A 5B 2C delay 236A~delay 6A~delay 4A~A~C 66C (8 hits) 214B/C~B~B (j.A/B/C whiff) 66B 236B~6B~6B [3027/3567]

 

Alternatively, you can do the following combo, but have it work from any range outside of the corner for two more damage!

 

5A 5B 2C delay 236A~delay 6A~delay 4A~A~C 66C (8 hits) 214B~B~(Very slight delay) A 66B 236B~6B~6B [3029/3569]

 

The combo will also work with 2A and net you 2948, but you can only do A rekkas at the end, so you won't get a super if you finish the rekka series. Enjoy!

 

For corner:

 

5A 5B 5C 2C 236B~6B~4A~A~A 66B 236A~4B~B~B 66B 236A~6A~6A [3045] You can super for ~3564 if you do so before the last hit of the rekka.

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5A 5B 5C 2C 236B~6B~4A~A~A 66B 236A~4B~B~B 66B 236A~6A~6A [3045] You can super for ~3564 if you do so before the last hit of the rekka.

 

You could probably swap the second 66B for 2B for more damage, since that pops the opponent high enough to get all the rekka hits and still combo into 236C.  I'll try that out later.

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You could probably swap the second 66B for 2B for more damage, since that pops the opponent high enough to get all the rekka hits and still combo into 236C.  I'll try that out later.

 

It won't work because the combo is so prorated that they'll tech before the final rekka, but I did add one damage by changing moves around!

 

It works but you have to cancel near immediately after the final hit of each rekka.

 

Corner:

 

5A 5B 5C 2C 236B~6B~4A~A~A 66B 236A~4B~B~B 2B 236A~6A~6A [3056/3596]

 

Updated Corner:

5A 5B 2C 236B~6B~4A~A~A 66B 236B~4B~B~B 2B 236A~6A~6A [3082/3622]

 

Let the blood flow!

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ima be honest the 623x series on a scared and or double webbed opponent is a d*** move and i love it, its a command grab at a certain distance even if the opponent is in block stun.

 

for 623A any level of 123 chains (ex. 5a 5b 5c) will put you at command grab range as will 2 2As. after the command grab its a slight requirement to 66 2C to get back the distance required for the jump cancel bnb (jb ja jc) otherwise it'll whiff. 

 

mixing around with charge and uncharged 3C leaves people open to the command grab so is empty web jumps into 2AA>623A/C. command grab is fast at 2AA normal block push back range because he grabs right after the twirl instead of twirl>forward dash animation>grab where its the signal to mash out.

best to keep your combos on the short side side it IS a web starter and it shortens our combos a bit, i got about 3998 damage with chain shift and 200 exes (not optimal but thats for the kill really)

 

so the general 623X>catch>66>2B/C>5C>236A>6A>6A does

respectable damage and you can mix it up with 236A>4A/B>A>D>land 2AA block or 623A again for serious shenanigans.

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Corner overhead starter with floor web oki:

 

B+C CS 2C 5C 236B~6B~4C~C~D [214A~A~B j.A whiff 2C 236A~4A~A~A 2C Rekkas]  [~3176]

 

If the timing for the 214A feels too strict, you can replace the entire bracket with a delayed rekka for the same result with slightly less damage.

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So am I missing something or is B+C as bad as it seems? Feels rather slow, even uncharged, extremely obvious animation, punishable on block, not cancelable (outside of vorpal),and requires vorpal to combo after. I've never actually managed to hit someone with it since they can all simply block it on reaction.

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His B+C overhead might be safer when you have the opponent trapped between web traps in the corner

Eventhough the uncharged version is still extremely slow at 29f

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