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RurouniLoneWolf

[Xrd] Sin Kiske Combo Thread

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This combo posted by Skargust earlier should be able to do that by using a dashing j.P. Though, he does mention on the wiki that the RC route is more stable.

 

j. D>j.214S>Dashing j. P>j.S>djc j.S>j.6H>j.214S>j.236H
Damage: 166
Requires: 3000 Calories
Restrictions: Need to drop the j.6H on females
 

EDIT: Actually found some more while parsing Zidane's overview for combos.

 

(MidScreen)

j.D > j.214S > j.P > j.S > djc j.S > j.H > j.236H - Video Example
Damage: 116
 

(Corner)

j.D > j.214S > 5H(1) > IAD j.K > j.S > j.K > land 623S > 214S > 236[H] > 214P > j.K > 5H > 6H > 236H > 214H - Video Example
Damage: 190

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I'm not sure if 214S is so bad of a starter that nobody commented on it or nobody bothered with it yet but since I don't see any (written) mention anywhere (as a starter instead of mid-combo), I would like to point out that:

 

214S on (high?)AA, AA(CH)or CH > 214P/K[4,5,6] > (late J.6H) > 5S > 5H(1) > 6H > 623S (crit) > 214S > 214P(4) > late J.6H > 5S > 5H(1) > 6H > 236H (> 214H) is a thing. (~273 dmg on sol, don't know how to calculate calorie but less than default amount)

 

It still need more testing, but in general:

 

For the 214P/K [4,5,6], well, it probably need more testing for the characters and all, but:

 - if within far 5S distance, then 214P[4]

 - if outside far 5S distance but within 236H distance, then 214P neutral

 - if outside 236H distance, then either 214P[6] or 214K neutral can work; 214P[6] is more consistent in general but might miss crit on 623S for some heavy/male characters.

 

As most 5H(1) > 6H > 623S combos, use 6H with or without delay to adjust the height of the opponent

 

For 214S on grounded CH:

 

- only thing to note is as above, depending on the distance you're hitting with 214S, it's usually 214P[4,5,6] unless on the heavy/male characters on the tip (combos but probably can't 623S crit), which 214K neutral would be better.

 

For 214S on AA(high?):

 

- usually at the highest point of jump or about normal air dashes. Chipp's normal jump's highest point is outside the reach of 214S.

- light/female characters (and chipp?) when hit would be too high for the (late J.6H), in which case just omit the J.6H, land, 5S > 5H then continue.

- when in doubt, change 623S for 236H (> 214H).

 

For 214S on AA(CH):

 

- in general the character will bounce too high; just land and 5S then continue.

 

214S is slow, but the range on both vertical and horizontal make it sometime useful on air dash prediction or projectile prediction. Regardless, it's meterless mid-screen >250 dmg that can be done from almost across the screen.

 

as an alternative, 214S (CH,AA,AA(CH))> 236K (whiff) > 66 > 5S > 5H(1) > 6H... works too, but will probably not get 623S crit.

 

on close 214S normal hit, there is the > 236H > RC > 66 route.

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Your posted combo does 5k calorie. Pretty low on usage of specials there. Calorie calculation starts at 1k calorie used for any special and then 2k calories for any cancel from the initial special. E.G 1k > 2k > 2k > 2k = 7k calories if you did 4 specials chained. Might be wrong but you can test it out yourself. 

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214S isn't bad, it's just so unlikely you might as well list jD counterhit specific combos there. I mean, the combo route is still the same as it would have been if you confirmed any other hits and then went into 214S.

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214S isn't bad, it's just so unlikely you might as well list jD counterhit specific combos there. I mean, the combo route is still the same as it would have been if you confirmed any other hits and then went into 214S.

 

I get j.D CH a lot, it happens everytime I use instant j.D to bait throw reversal.

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214S isn't bad, it's just so unlikely you might as well list jD counterhit specific combos there. I mean, the combo route is still the same as it would have been if you confirmed any other hits and then went into 214S.

 

I see your point. But while I would agree with you if the combo only works on counterhits, the main point I wanted to bring was that the combo works when hitting people from the air such as:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRwt-wJuO3I&t=1m17s 1:17

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdL7IozDsEU&t=1m50s 1:51

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMAYja-Ud2w&t=0m30s 0:30 also happen at 2:15, 4:30, 4:38

 

While it's not common enough that you'll find it in every round, it seems to happen once in a while.

The ground counterhit and air counterhit version of the combo is more or less to complement/cover the alternatives.

 

It was less about the combo itself and more about 214S > 214P/K[4,5,6] > (late J.6H) > 5S part because the combo works anywhere on 214S's range, even at the limit of it's range, which is sin's farthest non-overdrive reach. That and it can be cancel into should give it some kind of niche, something like after a blocked 236H. Perhaps I erred and should have brought that to gameplay discussion? It's because among the videos I've seen most players doesn't seem to do much from air hit 214S unless the opponent was near wall, some using RC too. since 214S's air hit confirm is pretty easy to react to I only though it might be worth looking into this follow-up combo and perhaps it can offer some uses.

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Rec: 11Kcal, 70~ tension, baiting a DP or something of equal value, near corner

 

6H>623S>214S>236[H]>214P>j6H>623S>214S>236[H]>236236P>DASH-236[H]>214K-6>jK>5H>RTL

 

Result: http://i60.tinypic.com/ablc9l.jpg (this is without any risc bar at the start)

 

 

 

Just something I came up with after being inspired to lab some more by the newest combo movie.

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Rec: 11Kcal, 70~ tension, baiting a DP or something of equal value, near corner

 

6H>623S>214S>236[H]>214P>623S>214S>236[H]>236236P>DASH-236[H]>214K-6>jK>5H>RTL

 

Result: http://i60.tinypic.com/ablc9l.jpg (this is without any risc bar at the start)

 

 

 

Just something I came up with after being inspired to lab some more by the newest combo movie.

 

How are you connecting 623S after 214P raw? Is there like a j.6HS in there?

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When the dein doesn't connect it has to do with proximity from the wall, you're likely a little too far away so start the combo a bit closer to the wall. Also it wouldn't work for the heavy chars like Bedman and Potemkin whom you can't do 214S>214k>j6H against.

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I was goofing around with this alot in training mode and it seemed cool to use and possibly practical so I used it in a couple of matches and it worked a good bit from the 4 matches I played. Lol It's a jump in combo that requires no meter and you can eat, at a very good spot for fireball okizeme, or 214S afterwards. The main thing with is the spacing for 236236P. It's not to close to not get all hits or not to far where they can jump out without being worried. When you eat, you don't necissarily gain any protein. You get what you started the combo with afterwards so really it's just to get okizeme or corner carry.

j.S>j.214S>| j.S>jc>j.S>j.HS>j.236HS

It might be just a meh combo as I main Ky and not Sin but I thought I might share as I found the positioning and success for the okizeme after j.236HS effective and common.

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With 236H held just long enough to get wallstick

[9 kcal + 50%] Grab > RRC > 236[H] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H > 623S > 214S > 236[D] > 214K > j.K > j.K > j.214S > j.236H > 214D [160 DM]

[6 kcal + 50%] Grab > RRC > 236[H] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H > 623S > 214S > 236[D] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H  > 214D [159 DM]

 

With 236H held at max length to still allow 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H to connect after wallstick

[9 kcal + 50%] Grab > RRC > 236[H] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H > 623S > 214S > 236[D] > 214K > j.K > j.K > j.214S > j.236H [191 DM]

[6 kcal + 50%] Grab > RRC > 236[H] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H > 623S > 214S > 236[D] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H  > 214D [188 DM]

 

After fiddling around with this, I realized that how long you charge the 236H drastically affects the combo damage. I don't know if it has to do with the level of charge or maybe a clean hit type thing, but it was just strange to see it making such a gigantic difference.The way you'll know if you got the FULL charge is if both hits of 236[H] deal 24 and 35 damage rather than 19 and 28 respectively.

 

I'm sure someone has to have figured this out by now so I am probably being surprised by nothing.

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With 236H held just long enough to get wallstick

[9 kcal + 50%] Grab > RRC > 236[H] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H > 623S > 214S > 236[D] > 214K > j.K > j.K > j.214S > j.236H > 214D [160 DM]

[6 kcal + 50%] Grab > RRC > 236[H] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H > 623S > 214S > 236[D] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H  > 214D [159 DM]

 

With 236H held at max length to still allow 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H to connect after wallstick

[9 kcal + 50%] Grab > RRC > 236[H] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H > 623S > 214S > 236[D] > 214K > j.K > j.K > j.214S > j.236H [191 DM]

[6 kcal + 50%] Grab > RRC > 236[H] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H > 623S > 214S > 236[D] > 214K > j.K > 5H > 6H  > 214D [188 DM]

 

After fiddling around with this, I realized that how long you charge the 236H drastically affects the combo damage. I don't know if it has to do with the level of charge or maybe a clean hit type thing, but it was just strange to see it making such a gigantic difference.The way you'll know if you got the FULL charge is if both hits of 236[H] deal 24 and 35 damage rather than 19 and 28 respectively.

 

I'm sure someone has to have figured this out by now so I am probably being surprised by nothing.

While those routes are not bad, the optimized thing to do from that is:

grab>RC>236[H]>214P-4>J6H>623S>214S>236[H]>214P>J6H>5S>5H>6H>236H

 

also, if you delay the second 236H the maximum amount you can also do this after it:

same as above > 236[H]>214K-6> jK(as late as possible)> 2H(2)>5H>6H>236H

Basically, j6H is your heaviest normal so pile in as many of them as you can. Also, during the parts of the combo where you have special moves, you wanna include as few normals as possible. Basically, Sin combo theory is something like "maximize j6H inclusion, minimize the amount of normals used during the segments of a combo where you are still trying to land 236[H]s in".

 

 

 

 

As for the damage thing, what changes has nothing to do with 236H being held longer, it's the RC forced proration. If you hold 236H longer the slowdown ceases and you hit your foe after it has ended so the usual forced proration which would apply had you hit them during the slowdown period does not apply here. It is indeed recommended to delay the 236h as long as possible but it won't actually lead to more damage in situations where RC is not being used right before it (you can test this by trying various delays with the second 236H in the above combo and seeing if it does different damage or not :P).

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Ah so it has to do with RRC. Alright thanks for clearing that up.

 

I have yet to get that full combo to work in training room so far, but I have been able to abridge at least the last part of it for a decent 203 damage combo. I really really can't get the second j.6H confirm into the rest of the ground normals. I still have a lot of trouble getting the first j.6H to go into 623S and still get the red lightning, so getting the second one down is just too much for me right now for  probably less than 10 more damage.

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I was messing with Sin combos against different characters in training earlier when I found that the usual ... 623S > 214S >214K[6] > late j.6H seems to not work on Ramlethal. In cases like this, do I need to do something like 214P[4] instead (I know I got that to work on May, anyway), or is there a better option I'm not aware of?

Also, when it comes to the heavyweights like Potemkin and Bedman, it seems like grounded 6H > 623S > 214S > 214K[6] > late j.6H doesn't connect (as was mentioned in a previous post on this page), so what's the best alternative in that case? Maybe just ... 6H > 623S 214S > whiff 236K, > 2H(2) > 5H > 6H into ender?

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I was messing with Sin combos against different characters in training earlier when I found that the usual ... 623S > 214S >214K[6] > late j.6H seems to not work on Ramlethal. In cases like this, do I need to do something like 214P[4] instead (I know I got that to work on May, anyway), or is there a better option I'm not aware of?

Also, when it comes to the heavyweights like Potemkin and Bedman, it seems like grounded 6H > 623S > 214S > 214K[6] > late j.6H doesn't connect (as was mentioned in a previous post on this page), so what's the best alternative in that case? Maybe just ... 6H > 623S 214S > whiff 236K, > 2H(2) > 5H > 6H into ender?

 

in general 214P[4] works more consistently and for more characters than 214K[6] for mid-combo, although 214K[6] carries further to corner if it doesn't switch side.

 

when it comes to heavyweights, use 6H > 623S > 214S > 214P[4] > j.S > j.6H >...

 

BTW, how many reliable meterless mid-screen dust combo are there aside the challenge mode one? It doesn't seems to hit Chipp past the first j.6H and I can't seem to get the 5D > 6 > 5H... one  to work on any characters aside Potemkin.

The combo I'm using in the meanwhile is : 5D > 8 > j.D > j.D > j.D > j.c > j.S > j.6H > j.214S > j.236H for 144 dmg 3k calories but something about it seems....unoptimized. Replacing the first two j.D with j.6H gives 10 more dmg but won't work well with Elphet.

 

*EDIT* Found a decent dust combo: 5D > 8 > j.6H > j.D > j.D > j.c > j.K > j.S > j.6H > j.236H (> j.214S > j.236H if close to wall) for 143 (151) dmg 1k (5k) calories.

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Would one of you be willing to explain to me the setting up and execution of these "Beak Diver Loops" all the hip young Sin players are talking about? Nearest I can tell, he sets it up in the corner on any juggled/bounced opponent and has to hit them with the charged version as late as possible before they touch the ground.

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Would one of you be willing to explain to me the setting up and execution of these "Beak Diver Loops" all the hip young Sin players are talking about? Nearest I can tell, he sets it up in the corner on any juggled/bounced opponent and has to hit them with the charged version as late as possible before they touch the ground.

 

You are correct. That's the gist of it. The rest is self explanatory and just practicing the timing and eyeing the height of them falling. The practical starters are corner dust and corner grab RC straight into dash charged Beak Driver. When charging Beak Driver you want to time it the moment he fully extends his hand out, that's when it's fully charged. And when he hits them you don't have to wait for the full recovery animation, you can skip it by doing another one. And then you keep going until you get pushed out.

 

The amount that you can do varies on the characters and if you can do micro-dashes in btw some charged Beak Drivers (which is really hard btw). For example chars like Pot and Bedman is easier to get 4-5, chars like Milia are smaller so you'll hit 3-4. Been practicing Beak Drivers for a while and I rarely get to do it in match lol. But it's still useful to learn since it hurts so much and it's super Calorie efficient. Plus it's sick!

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Can he actually start it off of cr.K, cr.S xx 236K xx 623S xx 214S in the corner? The ground bounce seems like it might work, but as my previous post might imply, I'm not sure if it actually works there.

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Can he actually start it off of cr.K, cr.S xx 236K xx 623S xx 214S in the corner? The ground bounce seems like it might work, but as my previous post might imply, I'm not sure if it actually works there.

You can do 2K>2D>236K>623S>214S>stuff in the corner but it has to be from a certain specific range and closer since 2K.2D does not combo from a too-far-away 2K.

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Can he actually start it off of cr.K, cr.S xx 236K xx 623S xx 214S in the corner? The ground bounce seems like it might work, but as my previous post might imply, I'm not sure if it actually works there.

 

As Dreiko said, you have to be super close. To answer your question, for this particular starter, yes you can time it so they crumple to the ground but you only get one extra charged Beak Driver. Don't forget that particular series uses up 7 Calories from Elk Hunt to the charged Beak Driver. So you will want to keep in mind of any other special moves you've done before or any extra you want to do. 

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Max range on counter hit, 236HS, 214K, JS, J6HS, 5S, 5HS (1), j.c, js, jk, j.c, js, j6H, J214s, J236HS, RTL. I feel like this combo has room for more damage, specifically after 5S, 5 Hs. I thought about using 623S after 5H, but it doesn't seem to connect in all MU's, so I'm not entirely sure where else to take this combo. Although it may be good enough as is. Any thoughts?

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