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Everything posted by Anne

  1. Old thread has gotten a bit full, and the console version is out, so it's about time for a new one. You can find the previous thread HERE. Real quick I'm going to lay down some rules: This is for Gameplay and News discussion only. Anything else will be deleted, and warnings will be handed out. If it's about colors and character models, go to Zepp. Story mode? Zepp. In depth character discussion? Probably better on that character's board. I've been known to be a bit lax on this if you don't go overboard, so please try to follow it. All site rules do apply here. This is simply a reminder. Seriously, don't whine and be a crybaby, and don't be an asshole. If you feel like something is thread worthy or deserves its own thread, go ahead and make one. Anybody can make threads, we are not stopping you. Also if something already has a dedicated thread already, go to that thread to discuss it.
  2. Anne

    [P4AU] Aigis Combo Thread

    InformationIf you'd like to contribute, please feel free to do so! Just post the combos you created, but please write them properly. If you are unsure on how to write combos properly, then read the wiki page here. Make sure to read the Notation Used section in this post so that you understand the specific notations used for CHARACTER. Also refrain from using move names and abbreviations.Please refrain from going off topic in this thread. This thread is for posting of combos only.The OP is reserved for practical and optimal combos, but feel free to post whatever you find in the thread. Collapsed: General Notations Used: [table] >Gatling/cancel the previous move into the following move. ,Link the previous move into the following move. |>After landing. jJump sjSuper Jump hHop hcHop Cancel adAir Dash iadInstant Air Dash jcJump Cancel sjcSuper Jump Cancel dcDash Cancel OMCOne More! Cancel AoA~CAll Out Attack into C ender AoA~DAll Out Attack into D ender CHCounter Hit FCFatal Counter [ ]Hold Input (N)Attack must deal N amount of hits. [???] xNRepeat ??? N amount of times.[/table]
  3. Anne

    [P4AU] Aigis Q&A Thread

    As the title suggests. Ask a question, get an answer! If you see a question you're knowledgeable about feel free to share. If you are not sure you're qualified to answer something please do not provide answers, we don't want people learning the wrong things here ^_^ Vanilla thread with some still relevant information: http://www.dustloop.com/forums/index.php?/topic/5187-p4a-aigis-qafaq-thread/
  4. *Note* - When browsing the CHARACTER forums please follow the rules of the site, failure to do so will result in an Infraction. If you do not know the rules you can check them here -> Site Rules. If you'd like to contribute, please feel free to do so! Just link the video with the time and list the character and player. If you're familiar with the formatting (just use the insert URL button) please use the formatting for links in these threads, it makes updating the thread much faster ^_^Please refrain from going off topic in this thread. This thread is for posting of videos only.[info=Notable Players] MitafuGarupoSecchan[/info] [info=Tutorial and combo videos] P4U2 Aigis basic combos Various Aigis Combos By: Kagikou Air Mortar Loops [/info] [info=Match Videos] Vs. :ballAI: [1/8/2014]Aigis Mirror [1/8/2014]Aigis Mirror [1/8/2014]Aigis Mirror [1/11/2014]802 PSR Aigis VS Secchan (Aigis) [1/31/2014]Aigis Mirror 1 [1/31/2014]Aigis Mirror 2 [1/31/2014]Aigis Mirror 3 [1/31/2014]Aigis Mirror 4 [1/31/2014]Aigis Mirror 5 [3/29/2014]Garupo(AI) vs Secchan(AI) Vs. :ballAK: [11/29/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs ???(Akihiko) [11/30/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs Sata(AK) [11/30/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs Domi(AK) [12/14/2013]Garupo(AI) vs Moke(AK) [1/24/2014]Aigis VS Akihiko [1/25/2014]Akihiko Vs Nagi(Aigis) [1/25/2014]Nagi(Aigis) Vs Akihiko [1/25/2014]Nagi(Aigis) VS MSR(Akihiko) [2/9/2014]Nagi(Aigis) VS MSR(Akihiko) Vs. :ballCHIE: [11/29/2013]Unnamed(AI) vs STD(Chie) [11/30/2013]Unnamed(AI) vs Chie [12/14/2013]Garupo(AI) vs Chie [12/14/2013]Garupo(AI) vs Ji(CH) [1/11/2014]Chie Vs Secchan (Aigis) [1/26/2014]Aigis Vs Chie [3/9/2014]Chie Vs Secchan(AI) [3/9/2014]Chie Vs Secchan(AI) [3/29/2014]Kirisame(CH) vs Garupo(AI) Vs. :ballEL: [11/29/2013]???(S.AI) vs ???(Liz) [6/28/2014] Damosu (Elizabeth) VS Rori (Aigis) [6/28/2014] Damosu (Elizabeth) VS Secchan (Aigis) Vs. JUNPEI [11/30/2013]Unnamed(AI) vs Junpei [1/11/2014]Junpei VS Secchan (Aigis) [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs Junpei [5/14/2014] Pika (Aigis) vs Hina (Junpei) Vs. :ballKA: [11/29/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs ???(Kanji) [11/29/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs Nikari(Kanji) [12/1/2013]???(AI) vs Kanji [12/1/2013]???(AI) vs Kanji [12/13/2013]???(AI) vs Kanji [1/8/2014]Aigis Vs Kanji [1/19/2014]Kanji VS Minami (Aigis) [1/26/2014]Aigis Vs Kanji [3/29/2014]Minami(AI) vs Oboro(KA) [3/29/2014]Minami(AI) vs Oboro(Ka)(2) [6/21/2014] Nagi (Aigis) VS Kanji Vs. :ballLB: [11/30/2013]Unnamed(AI) vs Labrys [12/14/2013]Garupo(AI) vs Labrys [2/7/2014]Aigis Vs Labyrs Vs. :ballMT: [11/30/2013]Unnamed(AI) vs Mitsuru [1/15/2014]Yamashita(Mitsuru) Vs Gurupo(Aigis) [1/15/2014]Yamashita(Mitsuru) Vs Gurupo(Aigis) [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs Mitsuru [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs Mitsuru [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs Mitsuru [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs Mitsuru [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs Mitsuru [1/19/2014]Mitsuru Vs Aigis [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs Mitsuru [5/18/2014] Gurupo (Aigis) VS Yamashita (Mitsuru) [5/18/2014] Gurupo (Aigis) VS Yamashita (Mitsuru) [5/18/2014] Gurupo (Aigis) VS Yamashita (Mitsuru) Vs. :ballNA: [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs Naoto [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs Naoto [2/7/2014]Naoto Vs Aigis [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs Naoto [3/29/2014]Denpa(NA) vs Eight(AI) [6/28/2014] Rori (Aigis) VS Naoto [6/28/2014] Gurupo (Aigis) VS Naoto Vs. :ballSLB: [1/11/2014]Sorashido (SLabrys) VS VS Secchan (Aigis) [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs SLab [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs SLab [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs SLab [3/29/2014]SLab vs Garupo(AI) Vs. SHO [11/29/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs Okusan Nikuya(Sho) [1/8/2014]Aigis Vs P.Sho [1/11/2014]Kubo (Sho) VS Secchan (Aigis) [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs P.Sho [1/24/2014]P.Sho VS Aigis [2/1/2014]Guns (Aigis) VS Shiozawa(Sho) [2/1/2014]Gunso(Aigis) VS Shiozawa(Sho) [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs Sho [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs P.Sho [3/29/2014]Mao(SHO) vs Garupo(AI) [5/14/2014] Shita (Minazuki) Vs. Gurupo (Aigis) [5/06/2014] Guymam (SHO) Vs. Escaflowne (Aigis) [5/18/2014] Shita (Sho %5BTsukiyomi%5D) VS Gurupo (Aigis) [6/10/2014] Shita (Minazuki) VS Gurupo (Aigis) Part 1/7 [6/10/2014] Shita (Minazuki) VS Gurupo (Aigis) Part 2/7 [6/10/2014] Shita (Minazuki) VS Gurupo (Aigis) Part 3/7 [6/10/2014] Shita (Minazuki) VS Gurupo (Aigis) Part 4/7 [6/10/2014] Shita (Minazuki) VS Gurupo (Aigis) Part 5/7 [6/10/2014] Shita (Minazuki) VS Gurupo (Aigis) Part 6/7 [6/10/2014] Shita (Minazuki) VS Gurupo (Aigis) Part 7/7 Vs. :ballTD: [1/11/2014]Aigis VS Teddie [1/11/2014]Teddie Vs Aigis [1/11/2014]Teddie Vs Aigis [1/11/2014]Teddie Vs Secchan (Aigis) [1/19/2014]Teddie Vs Aigis [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs Teddie [3/9/2014]Mad(TD) vs Secchan(AI) [3/9/2014]Mad(TD) vs Secchan(AI) [3/9/2014]Mad(TD) vs Secchan(AI) [6/28/2014] Aigis VS Teddie Vs. :ballYO: [11/30/2013]Unnamed(AI) vs Yosuke [12/1/2013]Unnamed(AI) vs S-Yosuke [12/13/2013]???(AI) vs Yosuke [1/8/2014]Aigis Vs Yosuke [1/24/2014]Aigis Vs Yosuke [1/25/2014]Yosuke Vs Nagi(Aigis) [2/1/2014]Kameten(Yosuke) VS Gunso(Aigis) [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs Yosuke [6/21/2014] Rita (Yosuke) VS Nagi (Aigis) [6/21/2014] Nagi (Aigis) VS Saji (Yosuke) [6/28/2014] Rori (Aigis) VS Yosuke Vs. :ballYU: [11/29/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs ???(Yu) [11/30/2013]MGN(AI) vs Tamao(YU) [11/30/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs Kould(Yu) [12/13/3012]???(AI) vs S-Narumaki(2)(3)(4) [12/13/2013]???(AI) vs Narukami [1/8/2014]Aigis Vs Narukami [1/8/2014]Aigis Vs Narukami [1/8/2014]Aigis Vs Narukami [1/11/2014]Aigis VS Shadow Narukami [1/11/2014]Aigis VS Narukami [1/11/2014]Aguro (Narukami) VS Aigis [1/11/2014]Aguro (Narukami) VS Aigis [1/11/2014]Aguro (Narukami) VS Secchan (Aigis) [1/13/2014]Aguro (Narukami) VS Secchan (Aigis) [1/15/2014]Yamashita(Narukami) Vs Gurupo(Aigis) [1/15/2014]Yamashita(Narukam)i Vs Gurupo(Aigis) [1/19/2014]Kaze (Aigis) Vs Narukami [1/19/2014]Narukami VS Minami (Aigis) [1/19/2014]Shadow Narukami VS Minami (Aigis) [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs Shadow Narukami [1/22/2014]Shadow Narukami Vs Aigis [1/24/2014]Narukami Vs Aigis [1/26/2014]Aigis Vs Narukami [2/19/2014]Aigis Vs Narukami [3/29/2014]Butter(YU) vs Secchan(AI) [3/29/2014]Aguro(YU) vs Secchan(AI) [6/28/2014] Rori (Aigis) VS Narukami Pt1 (Part 2) Vs. YUKARI [11/29/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs ???(Yukari) [11/30/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs Tahichi(Yukari) [12/13/2013]???(AI) vs Yukari [12/13/2013]???(AI) vs Yukari [12/13/2013]???(AI) vs Yukari [12/13/2013]???(AI) vs Yukari(2)(3) [12/14/2013]Garupo(AI) vs Yukari [1/11/2014]Yukari VS Aigis [1/11/2014]Yukari VS Aigis [1/11/2014]Yukari VS Secchan (Aigis) [1/11/2014]Yukari Vs Aigis [1/19/2014]Minami (Aigis) VS Koichi (Yukari) Vs. :ballYK: Mui(AI) vs ??? [11/29/2013]?? (S.AI) vs ???(Yukiko) [11/30/2013]Mitafu(AI) vs Stunedge(YK) [1/11/2014]Himajin (Yukiko) Vs Aigis [1/11/2014]Himajin (Yukiko) VS Aigis [1/11/2014]Yukiko Vs 801 PSR Aigis [1/19/2014]Shadow Yukiko Vs Aigis [1/22/2014]Aigis Vs Yukiko [/info]
  5. Welcome to the Persona 4 Arena Question Thread! Ask any questions GAMEPLAY related regarding Persona 4 Arena and Persona 4 Arena Ultimax here. Anything story related please take it to the Zepp Museum or your fan blog. Anyone is allowed to ask a question, and anyone is allowed to answer a question. However, please read the following rules as to this thread:You are allowed to ask as many questions as you want in a single post. However, please be smart about what you ask. We don't want to see questions that ask about how much swag Banchou has.If you are going to answer a question, please be courteous of the person who asked the question. Just because an answer may be obvious to you does not mean that it will be obvious to the person who asked the question. In other words, respect the person in your answer.If you notice any information from an answer to be incorrect or an opinion that's completely skewed, you are allowed to make a post regarding your corrections or thoughts. However, the same rule applies. In the case of opinions, please keep your own to a minimum. This topic isn't meant for arguments or debates, but rather for helping the ignorant and curious.Don't make any flammatory or pointless posts. Try your best to refrain from making redundant posts. Our forums have a "Search Thread" feature located in the bar above the first post of the page. We'll be lenient on the redundancy, since we understand very well that searching through Dustloop posts is not only an absolutely cringing hassle, but also because some of the posts here aren't what we call "quality posts." However, if you ask a question that's just been asked a few posts ago, we will give you a warning.Breaking these rules will either result in an infraction, tempban, or permanent ban, depending on how bad the offense is, past offenses, or the mood that the mods feel. Seriously, don't mess with us on this. Love you all, go nuts.
  6. Anne

    [P4AU] Aigis Q&A Thread

    She's really not all that difficult, she just plays a bit different from everybody else and requires management. Learn the safejumps and the more basic BnBs and try to move around with her properly, if you can do that then you can go ahead and get rolling.
  7. My favorite part about putting info on character forums was that time we changed forum software and all information archived using outbound links got lost. We should probably move video archival to databases, move match use combos to wikis, etc. Slim down on the stickies and open up the forums to talking about shit and keep that information from being eaten by forums. The new wiki format works for this, Polka's way of going about it is more or less fine. Also the upkeep requirement by mods can be lessened enough so that you could redo the mod systems.
  8. Actually it's a bit different due to Carmine's jump origin. The normal rules of cross up protection should protect against a cross up based on jump origin(very simple way to think about it) until landing. He puts the projectile down on one side, goes to other, then jumps back over. Now the only way to block the projectile is from the original direction right? That's the similarity, it's based on the origin of the move. The difference is that Carmine jumps over and the cross up protection didn't "properly" interact with the projectile hitting based on Carmine's jump origin, and if he hits another button that would hit in the opposite direction of the projectile origin you have to block according to that button. It's a pretty unique case because Carmine doesn't have to land after the jump to create a left/right situation, similar to most other fighters without the level of cross up protect in UNI. The projectile origin interacting with Carmine's placement made the "normal" rules of cross up protection not apply in reference to his jump origin. You're right in saying the system change shouldn't affect mix up like Orie's, but it's worth noting the differences in this specific engine exploit and that measures were added to the game to prevent it. It's less about it being slow and more about that type of situation not occurring with her though. It's also worth pointing out that Orie using j.2C like this creates a situation that follows the "normal" rules of cross up protection, and its use as a left/right is fairly minimal in regards to the total situation it creates. It's fairly easy to deal with that aspect of it, especially in regards to the other types of situations that exist.
  9. So you block a j2C. Even if it's TKed, that's still a jump in? I've seen it a lot, I know it's good and why it's good. Like you said, it's just not what we're talking about and it's misleading to go on about it and use the left/right as the key point.
  10. I was under the impression the mix up was started by blocking a j.2C.
  11. Like I know you're arguing just to argue and make me upset, but I do need to clarify where you're wrong. There's a large difference between trying to create that cross up situation and protected airdash high/low. Can it be a left/right? Totally. Is it a left right 50/50 we were talking about, based on projectiles? No. Are you going to use those options like land 5B/3B in a left/right situation? No. Do the gaps in the strings leave practical room for mitigation using other options and fuzzy defense? Yes. Is the primary reason for that situation hitting based on the left/right mix up? No. Is it completely plausible to react to the air special based on her height after a period of time where the move connects? Yes. Is it a bad thing to do? No. Is it good? Yes. Is it good based on what you're saying? No. It's far more likely that somebody is going to block the jump in and then attempt to input a delayed option and get caught by the special move, and the variations between that and 2A are going to do that. The left/right in this scenario also works differently than in the projectile based set ups. It might catch some people sleeping as the left/right, but that's far less likely. We've been talking about left/right 50/50s using projectiles to beat cross up protection in a unique way, in ways that Carmine, Seth, Hilda do very often in the current game. Those are completely unreactable and more or less safe to defensive options we know about. The way those specific types of set ups work have been altered in UNIST and possibly DFCI (same dev, lots of similarities in the core). Edit: SKD basically filled in the gaps left by me and Tari and we had a fine discussion about it. I'd just read those again.
  12. Your point? There's a difference in timings there, it's simple. She can't really delay either, I mean all there is to it if she doesn't keep falling you hold 4, if she keeps falling you switch to 3. And again, that's not the type of situation we are describing. Edit: DFCI probably has the same cross up properties as UNIST considering how they were updated, it's just that is a different game with much different ways of dealing with it. I wouldn't call it too off topic if you understand better how it works in UNI from the discussion. Edit edit: I get why the Orie thing exist, and you don't actually fuzzy block it like that, but it's really not a left/right like that either. There are a few ways to mitigate it I believe and it's not super strong and is reactable as far as I can tell. It's def a much different situation than the ones were talking about mechanic regarding, it's unique in how it will hit you.
  13. You don't react, there's just a point where you can switch your guard and you'll be fine. Again, the delay makes that harder but optimally defending against is actually pretty simple. You're far more likely to get hit in that situation for other reasons than the left/right. It's a lot different than the 50/50 where somebody is jumping over you and they can do a really tight cross up without needing to land. You can in theory mitigate it with fuzzy guarding but that is really impractical with how it is now, but might be more practical with the change.
  14. You just hold 4 in that scenario, then switch to block the 2A when she'd be hitting the ground. It's very different. I understand the timing is weird because of the delay of the move but that's not the scenario we're talking about.
  15. If they did just add left/right autoguard for a number of frames along with the current cross up protect, that would explain what I've been seeing in DFCI, yeah. Would mean the idea would still work in UNI same as in DFCI, but it would be way easier to defend against and way more difficult to apply it as an actual mix up with how characters tend to do it, you'd just fuzzy it. If it does work like that you'd need to create a different type of situation than the tight puddle stuff Carmine was doing before. Idk enough about what Seth can do to comment on that.
  16. There's a bit more it with stuff like character facing and yeah. To cap it off about DFCI, I have seen some sick nasty cross up stuff, cross up protection is broken in every other game I see. I only wanna mention it because it all the traits of cross up protect in UNI were carried between DFC as far as I knew until they were updated. It would make sense considering the implications of how strong it is between games. Hmm, maybe DFCI has the same change and the game is just more flexible in how people are exploiting it? Cause it seems to still happen regularly.
  17. A technique exists in UNiEL involving projectiles. If you put a projectile on somebody, cross them up, then cross them back up, cross up protection breaks. If the defender stands up and walks backwards, cross up protection kicks back in, so the character jumping over whiffs a button to trigger proximity blocking so the defender can't walk and that stops that. The same thing exists in DFC, somebody calls an assist and jumps over you, then jumps back over and whiffs a button to break cross up protect and it's a left/right 50/50. It's pretty timing sensitive but is totally easy to do with the right set up. It's really just exploiting the way projectiles are coded to be blocked from what I understand, but it's really weird and murky. Carmine would just hit with his capture super, throw the delayed projectile on the ground, run to the other side of you, then jump back over you and it made it work. By making it so you can block facing forward for longer, it makes it hard to keep somebody from walking and gaining cross up protection while still creating that left/right mix up. I'm not even gonna consider looking at a full tier list unless I know the name of the player attached, and then it's a moment in time and it's just there to help ask more questions.
  18. Ah, that makes sense. I wonder how much worse the actual mix up is then.
  19. I was informed the left right nonsense was gone from some people who are usually right and keep up to this, and I haven't seen it even after the usual super set up, so I assumed they were correct. For all I know it could still exist and it's just been limited on how it could be set up? Or I could just be wrong. I remember around console launch I thought Hilda was garbage, and a lot of lists had her on lower mid, then after a few months she was upper mid or even pushing up into A tier, then she settled back down in upper mid. Her design is super linear and limited so her placement just ends up being meta dependent.
  20. I'm not entirely sure, I don't know enough Japanese to navigate arounf their side of the internet and find things. I just know some general stuff like Wald didn't change much so he moved slightly down, Hyde got better at being Hyde and he hit like a monster truck so he went up, Carmine shot up with all the damage and oki optimization, etc. Console release and the year or so span of time after gave people the chance to just get really good at situations and optimization. That and people just being better at neutral helped, it was funny how a year ago I thought "how do some characters fight these big buttons?" and now I'm seeing players so good at neutral they just blow through them. If you want a better answer I can ask around but that's a lot of effort for very little. I'm not too worried about the exact tier list personally, it's just easier to illustrate my point of things go past the surface level or the understandings of a period of time. There's also wonky things I'm not sure how they worked out. Like Vatista in theory land is contender for best character but in actual play she's so difficult and weird it's hard to back that up or explain why her winrates are so poor. We had that happen in Persona with SLab, thought she could be busted but she kept getting blown up, then BKen happened and suddenly 2 of the top players from Japan and America are pushing that character up. Also, the wording on saying Eltnum could be 3rd "depending on the MU" makes no sense. Character tier positions relate to the accumulation of their MUs vs the entire cast, not in a singular MU. The wording you used really confuses me.
  21. So like, I'm several weeks late to this discussion, but Merkava is more or less the same character with quality of life buffs. Still seems very strong. He still plays neutral the same way, which was his biggest strength. His pressure is the same, 2B and dash B buffs help make confirms more consistent. Damage is more or less the same, even if it's barely nerfed it's not like he lived and died off damage. I've already seen some new routes dealing more though, so whatever, damage isn't what I'm worried about. Flight works the same, worms got easier to set up, he can still convert the same, etc. Good character. It's worth thinking about what made a character good, bad, or even busted and then evaluating if they can still perform the same way. Like Gord for example, the things that made him good still exist, he's probably strong. The things that made him busted were his ability to RPS you on defense with all the invuln and all the low proration, and the grab range was silly in certain situations. He lost that, so he's probably "normalized" along with the rest of the strong characters. Similarly with Carmine, the things that made him good are still there, but the left/right 50/50 nonsense and the explosive damage got taken away, so again he's more "normal" in line with the strength levels of the cast. For a low tier like Seth, I mean, he was already good at murdering people once he got a hit, the low health and inconsistency on confirms really made him hard to perform with. Oh look, they gave him better ways to confirm and health. Neato. He's still really similar though, so I'd expect his power to again be more "normal" in how things work. Seems like FB's balance philosophy lately has been to make very minor changes and to try to condense tiers into certain power levels. Like, I'd expect the tiers to look similarly in UNIST to UNiEL with the exception of some swaps and slight bumps up and down. There are a few exceptions (what the hell is going on with Byakuya), but that's the gist. A lot of people might not be aware of this, but the tier list for UNiEL towards the end probably looked way different than what most people think based on the play around console release. It wasn't uncommon to see Eltnum in the #3 slot with Hyde even possibly being in top 5. When the game became optimized and people figured out advanced defense/offense there was some wiggle room in there.
  22. I mean, if somebody wants to make a guide, they'll make a guide and post it and it'll be fine. Fuck it, make a header on the wiki of links to resources that are deemed very helpful/important. It's a bit redundant, but I mean that way people reading the wiki will be able to just find it from there without having to dig through the forum. If it is a forum thread, they'll get linked to the forum where they can post about it. I mean I think I've said like everything I've needed to say about the ideal split between the forum/wiki and the best ways to use both.
  23. Zissou's idea on how to handle MU threads is godlike. Implement that for the love of everything and consolidate them in a forum somewhere. The forum will be crowded, but if you stick that super easy navigation tool on the front of it that problem goes away. Just make a MU subforum for each game that should have one. Edit: Just make an image that's easier to read, call Dawn or somebody.
  24. I mean for strategy, it's not hard to just say a basic gameplan. Like, let's take Millia for example, the wiki should def have a paragraph saying "Millia wants to knock people down, here's how, here's some of her more prominent tools to use in neutral blah". Then have a section for the various ender > oki set ups and the basic idea of how to use them. I'm pretty sure an evernote or thread OP already lists a lot of the general stuff you will use as Millia. There's not much more to discuss on that other than when to use what, but that falls under critical thinking and should be in the forum. I really don't feel like that's unreasonable. On a tangent to this I also believe this helps people discuss things in a more positive way. Like, people look for answer x for problem y and they just do that forever until they think they have all the answers. Then they spend so much time talking about that, that they never learn how to use the answers and miss out on critical thinking skills and discussion is a never ending loop of rediscovering information. Again, I'd rather just tone down the raw information in discussion and focus the threads on more open ended thinking. Part of that is just me thinking we're doing a disservice to learning players by throwing up all that information in a space where they should really be talking about how to play a fighting game vs another human being. The more logical part is that frees up space to breathe and be a little looser in conversation. It also frees up some space to have gen threads. I'm to the point where if there's breathing room and info isn't being buried, I don't mind BS threads that exist as long as they're talking about the game and within the rules.
  25. There's a lot of shit in character subs that should just go on the wiki though. Combos, safejumps, set ups, common strings, general gameplan, etc could go on there. The only thing you'd need to discuss in a thread is the critical thinking stuff, how you approach things, when you want to use those options etc along with MUs. Like nobody needs to ask me what my options are when I get a knock down. Anybody can look that up in a video or whatever. Just throw it in the wiki. What I'd like players to talk about or ask is "why would you choose x option over y option in z situation?". That should go in the forum. Any hard info will end up getting buried behind that conversation unless it's stickied, and anything that's hard info that's gonna get stickied should just go on the wiki. Again, I just think it makes sense to have things that don't need to be talked over again to be housed in a place they won't get buried by people talking. Things that are going to be continuously talked about like critical thinking and MU development should be in places where it's easy to talk, like the forum. You can say combos/set ups/etc aren't "concrete" cause new optimal ones get discovered, but I mean there's not much more to it than "hey here's a new thing we can do for better damage. Oh geez, that sure is more optimal, update the combo list". I feel like people keep taking this to extremes when all it really comes down to is that it makes more sense to use the wiki more for what it's good at, and free up the forum to do more of what it's good at.