Posts posted by Amadeous
I'm pretty sure I've seen 6K IAD jS work, but you need to get a very low airdash to confirm. Then the j.S knocks them upwards, and you don't have a double jump to chase...hm.
I want to see someone do IAD Gekirin YRC mixups. Should work similarly to IAD 236P mixup. jS, 5K, or throw for high/low/throw crossups.
Honestly with the range+hitbox of 6H I think doing it after an FD'd max range puffball will be great. Not something you can safely do every time, no, but one you can do to keep them blocking. 6H YRC looks great, but for other reasons. It lets you gatling into an advancing move, sortof replacing her 2D FRC. Still not as good since you have to let them exit blockstun before YRCing, but easier to do and covers more space faster.
H puffball having even MORE plus frames is great news, it means Potemkin can't IB Pot buster you to punish it anymore. Also means it's scarier to block it, giving you more reason to feint with S puffball and get that juicy CH.
I also saw MAX Ryujin is untechable until they reach the ground, it looked like. Cards charge very quickly and being able to YRC and still get the card is great. I'd like to see people get KD with 6H or 2D instead of 46PP, then cancel to 22K, YRC as they get up, and still get legitimate okizeme. Because of the blowback on 6H, you could probably even do 22K YRC 22K and be mostly safe, then boom one more card and you've got MAX Ryujin. I don't think ending with 46PP is a great idea, I think people are still thinking it's too much like AC/ACR. Unless you can cancel from 46PP into 22K/S/H series, which I haven't seen any news of, I'd rather have the frames from getting to cancel into it from a 6H knockdown.
Here are my assumptions:
The frame data may be off by 1 frame. I find it hard to believe 5K is 4F and +2 when it was 5F and +1 in AC/ACR, but we'll have to see. Means 5P may be 3F still. Though as you said, because Parry -> 5P is gone, there's not much point in needing a 3F 5P. Though even if 5P is 4F, if 5K is 4F and +2 I'm not going to complain at all anyway lol.
Parry is likely 9 or 10F whiff animation, then a 3 or 4F startup on the P followup. Parry had a 6F window to catch things in previous games, we'll see if that remains or if she is catching things during those 9 or 10F.
I asked LOX and it sounds like Parry into Parry is possible.
I'm reading that as you can do the following things after a successful Parry:
This is INCREDIBLY GOOD because it means you can still parry safejumps and be safe, or parry crossups and be safe. Also, because Parry is a 46 input, it means parrying Chipp and Sol jH, along with other multi-hit moves, is much easier than it was in AC or ACR.
From the sound of things, I do not think it's possible chief. Since parry does not seem capable of dealing with multi-hit skills as other people mentioned, it's a safe bet parry cannot cancel into itself.
Really hoping this is just early experiment weirdness like what befalls most characters. I seem to recall Mr. Dandyman himself (Slayer) being labeled as gutted early on in SIGN until people figured him out. It might be the same for Jam. I refuse to believe that she of all characters is lower on the totem pole than Ky's little crotch-spawn on principle alone .
Reminder that Johnny was said to be weak 2 weeks ago, and now he's one of the strongest characters in the game. Or Leo being a weak character.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: it's a GOOD thing Jam is weak right now. If she were ACR level of power after a week of a loketest and day 1, she'd be absolutely unstoppable 2 or 3 weeks from now. BnBs haven't even been figured out, give it some time. At her weakest, I'm predicting she'd be at least Slash power, and I seem to recall KA2 OCV'd through SBO that year, so I'm in no way worried.
Card frame data was found, 44F to get the card, 56F to complete the animation. Can't remember how long to get MAX charge off the top of my head. So you can YRC late in the animation and still get a card.
2H 2D 236SK should work on most of the cast, if not 2H 236SK directly and straight into 3 kicks, I would imagine. Though I don't have the game, so I can't do anything, obviously.
She still has 5P and c.S as anti-air options, so I'd imagine with those + good movement + jS you can still control space fairly well. Unless they expect us to DP -> Gekirin YRC as our main anti-air, since that's a thing. Assuming puffballs still have a large hitbox as well?
Question about parry since I never saw definitive answers: can you cancel a parry into another parry? Would be very useful against Sol and Chipp jH among other moves. If not, parry FD isn't a thing anymore, is it? In addition, is 6H + when spaced correctly/done as a meaty? Curious
I am reserving this first post for matches that show high-level play and good commentary over it. Matches that show a lot of good interactions and though, along with good breakdowns that explain things well. If you feel someone's analysis deserves to be in this post, message me and let me know!
JAM VIDEO DATABASE:
Will be added once footage becomes archived. Thanks to @www.keeponrock.in for creating and managing this wonderful database!
JAM VIDEO DISCUSSION:
Thanks to KeepOnRockin's work with the video database, posting a bunch of links in the thread and maintaining it becomes a bit extraneous. Rather than just being a thread to post videos, I'd prefer this thread to dive into in-depth discussion over a given match video. Simply link the footage, and write out a post with your overview. Novice or high level play, it doesn't matter, as long as you are able to break down and analyze what is going on at any given time. If you have a video that is not in the database, or even your own match footage, looking for advice or critique, feel free to post it here and go into it. If you want to build off of another person's analysis and provide your own commentary, that's fine too! I want this thread to foster communication and thought, to get people to really think about matches and not just the how things are being done, but the why as well.
Please do not post Loketest footage in this thread. We'll be seeing plenty of footage soon enough, and things may change in the final version.
Jam comes out in 2 Days, confirmed! Expect stuff to come up Wednesday around 7PM EST I'd assume, maybe a bit after that.
Re: Parry discussion and drama:
Yes, I hate it too. No, it's not the end of the world.
Parry having a whiff animation is completely understandable. Not having a whiff animation would be silly with YRC in the game. YRCing specifically to call out a parry should give you a reward, and without a whiff animation, there's no way to do this.
The problems that the current parry has (as LOX and DarkJamOjiSan described): 46P is unsafe on block, so safejumping at Jam will allow you to punish if she parries your jump in. 46PK feels more safe, but there's a large enough gap between the hits that you can poke her out easily. Additionally, 46P DOES NOT autocorrect. So, as example, Sol does IAD jS and crosses up, even if Jam parries, her followup will whiff. And, as has been discussed in the thread, it does make maneuvering with her possibly awkward.
HOPEFULLY Pachi listened to twitter and the stronger Jam players, and touched up the parry followup some to fix these problems. It was a loketest, but I will say don't get too hopeful. A large part of the test just seemed to be just testing for glitches and bugs. Don't expect her parry to go back to XX versions anytime soon though.
Sadly the biggest problems from the current parry is her lack of a solid anti-air. Her 6P was never good for anti-airing, and according to DarkJamOjiSan, her 2H is even worse at AAing than it was before. You will need to use your maneuverability and high speed to use 5P, cS, and jS as proper anti-airs.
The good stuff is though...
Her new 2S is amazing. While it lacks range, it still has a great hitbox and is even faster. People have said that max range f.S 2S whiff is even on block, if not plus. Jam's pressure game will be insane. Her j.K has more of a use, covering an angle that j.S didn't with more range, along with being a combo tool. A new gatling route of 2H -> 2D is incredibly useful for her, as now 5H 6K 5D and 5H 2H 2D are strong blockstring mixups. In addition, her new 6H is VERY GOOD, even if you are spoiled by AC 6H (we all are, lmao). It's completely low invul, has an amazing hitbox that looks unthrowable if spaced correctly (does not actually have throw invul!), moves her forward very quickly which makes it great to YRC during pressure, and is special cancellable. While no numbers have been released, it looks like it will be + on block if spaced correctly as well! LOX said Jam still feels very fun and has lots of room to grow; he made the point that you can play her in many different ways (The safe, solid approach of KA2, the mocking, amazing mixups of Mike, etc) and she still feels like she will be strong. Remember, people said Johnny was weak in loketests, too.
In other news, I'm gonna go ahead and create the Jam Video thread in preparation for matches being uploaded. Please don't upload loketest footage there, I'm sure it'll be full enough after she releases.
I think I'll drop this here:
KA2's alive. He hasn't gone to an arcade in years though, lol.
Shoutouts to @GREATFERNMAN on Twitter for gathering and translating a ton of notes together. Here's his completed list.
So here's the article with all the information:
And hopefully streams with footage will be coming in soon. Please link to the streams when they go live here, and don't be afraid to make threads for more in-depth discussion. Thanks! Jam looks great and fun, curious how her parry and super are gonna work. No flip makes me sad though.
Honestly as much as I would like to see her +R style of gameplay return, it's not likely. She doesn't function in the AC or ACR styles without Force Breaks. Unless they change her card system to be closer to Arcana Heart Akane's charges, or give her a super that gives her multiple cards, she won't really work lmao.
That said, I hope her AC 6H is at least her Blitz Attack animation. Also, if that new move is 2H I'll be happy, since it means her 2H still vacuums, which it didn't in Reload (it was bad in Reload).
Amadeous, the reason why I disagree your assuming is that when I watched the reveal video, I felt that Arcsys is trying to change Jam's style into more traditional kung-fu style, not old JKD-like style anymore, that's why they changed the motion of senri shinshou and 6p (maybe), I think Arcsys will keep old 5HS and AC 6HS because of that, and I guess S series will also be changed because they are JKD-like, too. Well, I hope we'll get more news of Jam today.
This would go against the established character however? JKD is a fighting style of being fleeting, adapting, and not limited to styles and stances. Jam's fighting style is specifically noted to be self-taught, so I feel going to more traditional wushu style martial arts would be odd.
But as you say, there's no way to tell until she's out.
That's what I'm assuming NeoJET, remember that Johnny got entirely new Slash and Heavy moves, and many other characters (Like Potemkin) got new moves overwriting their old ones. As Jam's old 5H was general combo filler and not used for neutral, changing the animation and properties slightly won't affect much while looking prettier.
Big advantage of it only being 2 hits now is making it harder to FD to push Jam away. A core part of defending Jam is FDing when you see her go into 5H on block, to shove her away. Hopefully this new normal remains + on block as well.
We don't know if that's her 6P, it could be her 5H still, which wouldn't be new.
The question would be, can she still do 5H 6K? And does her 6K still force standing?
Arc have announced they'll be doing a stream on the 24th for the release of GGXrd. Apparently major information will be revealed. I suggest we all watch this as there's a chance for some good footage of Jam before she's unlocked on arcades!
As hilarious as Banri Senken YRC would be, I highly doubt she'll get anything like that. Her toolset is very much complete to me anyway, and didn't really need many additions, if any.
Also, that could be a charged Ryujin, but in Reload and Slash charged versions were always used whenever a normal kick would normally be used. In AC, you had to cancel from one special move into the kick to use the charge, and in ACR you choose with the K or the D button.
Personally, I hope for the ACR system as well, but it could also be the pre-AC system.
Ryujin to me is strange;
She jumps up much higher and the move comes out very quickly. I'm wondering if it was a special cancel or she TK'd it in the trailer.
If it's the latter, that means whatever that normal is is jump cancellable, which regardless on her 6p or 5h is new!
TBH I don't expect her to change much. Probably be closest to Slash, with a few more specials?
If we assume that's her 5H shown in the trailer, that means you can combo directly from 5H Ryujin. I'm wondering if they're trying to eliminate the need for f.S TK Ryujin and make her more accessible, but I'd like f.S TK Ryujin to still be in the game as a higher level combo. Also, there was no giant puffball part of the puffball by the looks of things, so I'm worried the hitbox will be nerfed on it along with the speed.
She'll definitely still be a ground game based fighter, with strong normals, good maneuverability, and amazing damage. These have always been Jam's archetype. I can't imagine her basic strategy will change much.
I really doubt she'll have AC 6H, but at least with her old 6H you can YRC the startup and get a high/low mixup for only 25 meter. Though, I'm also expecting her to have a totally new 6H too. They seem to be really making her animations way more fluid though which is amazing.
Opening the general discussion thread for Jam Kuradoberi. Please feel free to talk about the character's gameplay in Xrd here, ask questions, look for matches, and anything else. Just try to keep it somewhat on-topic.
PRE-RELEASE NOTE: Jam's not going to be out for at least 2 weeks after Revelator drops, so for now feel free to speculate! Discussion of matchups or theoretical gameplay based on her past games is encouraged.
It's still a ways out, but I wanted to go ahead and start putting together a Skype group for players that are interested in playing Jam in Xrd:Revelator. Expect this first post to get updated as soon as Jam becomes playable.
For now, please post in this thread with your Skype name if you'd like to join the Dustloop Jam Kuradoberi Skype Group. Or, send me a friend request (Amadeous4446 on Skype), saying you're interested in joining, and I'll add you to it.
SHE'S FINALLY CONFIRMED YES FINALLY ;W;
General GG Fanart Thread ~Great Posts'o'Stuff - #305 and onwards~ [may be NSFW]
in Zepp Museum
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Finished some artwork. It's somewhat NSFW, so I'm keeping it behind links.