Death Battle: Ragna vs. Sol

[Arcus Diabolus]

I hated BB.  Going from the GG series into BB was too much of a step back for me.   ;/  No idea about the future iterations, but yeah...  went into SF4 over BB after that experience.

Do you mean you haven't tried the newer versions of BB at all?

[Arcus Diabolus]

Many GG fans dislike BB a lot.  Not every one of them, but just saying that liking GG means liking BB is quite wrong.

I see... I'll try to not make that mistake again.

[werewolfgold]

I personally like both sides, and personally I could care less who exactly 'wins'.

Heck if anything if you guys know the two characters well, you could deduce the winner.

Yeah Sol has the intelligence since he was a professor in the past, but unlike him, Ragna has more combat experience.

You do realize that Sol is, like, 150 years older than Ragna, right? I doubt Ragna has more fight experience. Sol actually created ridiculous magic weapons that he and other people use in his game. Ragna was just given stuff and taught how to use it well. Unless Ragna can summon forth experience from each of his timeloop variations all at once...experience would also go to Sol.

 

But, that said, experience doesn't mean that Ragna couldn't overpower him. But, I doubt he could without just turning into the Black Beast. But, then the question is is the Black Beast still "Ragna" for the purposes of this battle. And even then, not much is known about the extent of Sol's full gear form power.

[Arcus Diabolus]

Just for the sake of discussion and my own personal interest, how strong is Sol anyway? There was some guy somewhere on another site that said he was a class 100 or whatever. Someone care to shed some light on this for me?

[HoudiniJr100]

You do realize that Sol is, like, 150 years older than Ragna, right? I doubt Ragna has more fight experience. Sol actually created ridiculous magic weapons that he and other people use in his game. Ragna was just given stuff and taught how to use it well. Unless Ragna can summon forth experience from each of his timeloop variations all at once...experience would also go to Sol.

 

But, that said, experience doesn't mean that Ragna couldn't overpower him. But, I doubt he could without just turning into the Black Beast. But, then the question is is the Black Beast still "Ragna" for the purposes of this battle. And even then, not much is known about the extent of Sol's full gear form power.

you bring a good point, that could be something that can give Sol the win.

Though I'm still questioning how they'll go about mentioning Order Sol in terms of fighting Sol Badguy in accent core.

 

but still, you're right. while Ragna has experience, Sol has more age, intell, and he created magic weapons crazier than the nox nyctores, azure, and ars magus.

[Lou_Cypher]

Gear Project seems to have scenes of him drop kicking a massive airship and causing it to crash. And destroying a meteor-like Gear object in the same novel that had the Hydra Megadeath Gear.

 

We know the nature of his opponents now though. Justice had a Gamma Ray that could devastate all of Japan and parts of Korea. Dizzy can bring down a fleet of airships with hers in the erased timeline. Sol can hang with them at the very least if not surpass them.

 

My thoughts:

 

Both Sol and Ragna get stronger the more they release whatever limits they have. But Ragna dies faster the more he uses the Azure just like that ending in Continuum Shift. Sol can simply keep piling on the damage. His soul is still somewhat protected thanks to That Man in Overture. He seems to have kept that when he wanted to take the fight with Justice in the Backyard in Xrd. Whatever Soul Eater can do, he'll have some form of resistance to it. He just needs to wait out Ragna while he piles on hits.

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Looking forward to watching this when it comes out.

 

Regarding the relative strength of Sol vs. Ragna, it isn't even close, IMO. Sol is the type of character that is so powerful, the only way they can keep his story interesting is by putting him in situations where fighting it out will not bring about a solution. Ragna, on the other hand, is a jobber who is constantly getting told how weak he is and gets bodied all the time (especially evident in CP story).

 

Ragna's fighting experience is NOTHING compared to Sol's. Dude has been a bounty hunter for over 100 years. This would have to be a very well done fight to be interesting, IMO.

[BlackYakuzu94]

Ya know what's funny about Ragna is that in CT, his hype is pretty similar to Sol's; everyone fears his Azure Grimoire, his feats of killing thousands of soldiers is constantly mentioned, and everyone treats like some walking path of destruction that nobody can beat.

 

 

Then in CS and onward, they just kind of dropped that angle and made him look weak as fuck to the likes of Rachel, Terumi, Kagura, and Azrael. Even Jin punks his ass in CP eventually. 

 

 

It's like Mori didn't want him to be too much like Sol, so he just threw him in the other direction lol. In regards to this fight, at the very least I can see Ragna putting up a decent fight and giving Sol run for his money but ultimately, Sol is just overall more powerful. The only way this fight CAN be interesting is if both of them lose control of their power, or some Dues Ex Machina bullshit.

[LiveWireX]

I may not know much about Guilty Gear canonical strength, but I have a suspicion that Sol's going to win. I've had this theory for a while now that lately with Death Battle when 2 Fighting Game characters go at it, the one who wins usually has like a newer game coming out, or is coming out with some DLC, etc. It's probably silly to think that, but I dunno.

[Stryker115]

All of you people seem to keep disregarding one important fact in here...

 

Ragna is That Man.

 

Doesn't Sol always lose to That Man?

[Tong]

Perhaps, if we compare them outside gameplay Sol would be the obvious winner.

Now, if we were to put both in a fighting game where each character had their own mechanics from their respective fighting games, Ragna would win in the end. Why do I say this? Well, Ragna has better movement options (has air options on High jumps), he has more teching options (forward, backwards, neutral and delay), can block in the air without sacrificing meter and arguably the better footsies.

 

Sure he may not have a command throw like Sol, but because Sol needs to spend meter to air block he definitely would be forced to block Ragna's pressure to not get tagged by one of his many air unblockable normals, while Ragna would be able to chicken block his way out of Sol stuff. And finally, Ragna's damage potential skyrockets when he's low on health and has an OD charge to spend.

 

DISCLAIMER: I know it's pointless to compare completely different characters from completely different games and universes, but hey it's a Death Battle.

[Lucalibur]

On the other hand, GG chars deal around 50% damage of the enemy's HP if they hit them at full HP, and 90% of their ground stuff is air unblockable. They also become ridiculously harder to kill the lower they HP is. Also, Sol's frame data is infinitely better than Ragna's.

 

Can't act like only one game's mechanisms are in effect, bro.

[NecroTheReaper]

Just by mechanics, Ragna could kill Sol in 3 hits with his 5A due to simple HP differences, so I'm pretty sure we're avoiding mechanics

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Even in game, Sol would still win. He is an infinitely better character design. I'm also fairly sure most of his normals would interact with Ragna's in his favor. Even if you make the argument that Ragna can chicken block out of all of Sol's pressure (he probably couldn't anyway but JUST BECAUSE), it is MUCH easier for Sol to continue pressure in that scenario, whereas even if Sol has to spend meter to get out with FD, once he gets out, it's much harder for Ragna to get back in.

 

I'm telling you guys, Sol >>>>>>>>>> Ragna. I even like him better as a character after Xrd story mode, they fleshed him out really well and made him much more relatable. Ragna is a clown in comparison.

[NecroTheReaper]

You cant compare their frame data and mechanics, like I just said lol. But I agree that I like Sol more than Ragna. Plus, Ragna never punched a missile and took it for a spin to a different part of the world.

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Actually you really can, because that has a lot to do with how the characters play individually. Now, if they were actually to do a crossover, then no, everything would be done in a more unified way. But let's say you were to copy paste their most recent versions into MUGEN or something similar, then you could DEFINITELY make comparisons based on mechanics and frame data.

[NecroTheReaper]

If you were to take them as is though, Ragna would literally only need 1 ID to kill Sol. Is it smartass-y? Of course, but it still exists that normals in BB do like 10-20x the damage based on the system lol

[BlackYakuzu94]

I'm telling you guys, Sol >>>>>>>>>> Ragna. I even like him better as a character after Xrd story mode, they fleshed him out really well and made him much more relatable. Ragna is a clown in comparison.

 

You're breaking my heart man. 

 

Xrd made me love Sol more too, but that doesn't mean Ragna suddenly sucks lol.

 

 

If you were to take them as is though, Ragna would literally only need 1 ID to kill Sol. Is it smartass-y? Of course, but it still exists that normals in BB do like 10-20x the damage based on the system lol

 

Well on the flip side like was mentioned, GG characters take less damage the more damage they take. Ragna doesn't have a system like that. I guess Soul Eater technically counts here, but still.

[Lucalibur]

We can probably ignore HP for such a comparison because GG chars have 420 HP and BB chars have variables between 9000 and 13000. It's much easier and fairer to compare if we take the MUGEN solution and give them equivalent HP numbers.

 

The thing between Sol and Ragna is that despite system mechanics, Sol has better frame data, a more complete design and overall better tools. In story, Sol is also overpowered to the point the story has to adjust itself to make sure problems have to be fixed through means other than brute strength, because otherwise he would do everything by himself.

 

I'm not going to say the result will be Sol winning with 100% accuracy, mainly because Death Battle clearly has a good amount of favoritism going for certain results, but the odds are definitely stacked against Ragna.

[Tong]

Say, it's CP 2.0 Ragna vs Xrd Sol. It doesnt even have to do with damage or the guts system, Sol wouldn't be able to emergency tech (GG characters dont have wakeup options) out of Ragna's finishers, this alone gives him an advantage. Neutral would be even though, both have similar tools at their disposal and can counter each other with the right moves. Plus Inferno Divider feels a little more realiable than Volcanic Viper, just because the former can be cancelled at any given time provided it hits, and a better hitbox/trajectory.

 

One may also argue that GG characters are tougher, but the way Ragna deals damage (more meter = more damage off the same starter) balances out that extra resilience guts gives. And last but not least, BB's bursts are safer in case everything goes wrong for Ragna.

 

But yea, both are fishes out of the water if we talk like this, so it's nothing but mere conjecture.

[BlackYakuzu94]

Well Dea

 

Say, it's CP 2.0 Ragna vs Xrd Sol. It doesnt even have to do with damage or the guts system, Sol wouldn't be able to emergency tech (GG characters dont have wakeup options) out of Ragna's finishers, this alone gives him an advantage. Neutral would be even though, both have similar tools at their disposal and can counter each other with the right moves. Plus Inferno Divider feels a little more realiable than Volcanic Viper, just because the former can be cancelled at any given time provided it hits.

 

One may also argue that GG characters are tougher, but the way Ragna deals damage (more meter = more damage off the same starter) balances out that extra resilience guts gives. And last but not least, BB's bursts are safer in case everything goes wrong for Ragna.

 

But yea, both are fishes out of the water if we talk like this.

 

Wouldn't Sol have an easier time getting in because he can just YRC his IAD into a normal?

 

 

 

In any case, I don't think Death Battle takes system mechanics into account but rather just basic attacks and abilities used by them; basically just the moves like Inferno Divider and Volcanic Viper and not the frame data behind them. Obviously innate abilities like Ragna's Soul Eater would probably apply due to it being related to it's plot point about it needing souls and some shit.

 

So really, it's just down to who's normals and specials are better...even though Sol technically has more useful tools.

[Lucalibur]

Meh, just DI and nuke entire area then.

[NecroTheReaper]

Yeah, based on accomplishments, its DBZ character vs Hellsing character. One gets beat on a daily basis to beat the next bad guy while one is just a badass from the start that only needs to get serious if its literally an army against him

[BlackYakuzu94]

So it's Goku vs. Superman all over again.

[Narroo]

So it's Goku vs. Superman all over again.

Hm...Superman can punch reality and time travel, while Goku can blow up planets.  Not sure who is better.