[CS1] Carl Clover Tactical Discussion/Questions/Help

[ZONG_one]

From what I've read, the 8D that we know is no longer in the game. Its different somehow.

Source plz.

[Zeero]

what i'm wondering: slower j2C = no 3c->summon->iad->2C8D loop? easier to tech = less iterations of 2C8D loop? changed 8D = no 2C8D loop at all? so technically, carl who used to have 3 main useful combos -> throw loop, clap loop, ground loop, only has ground loop remaining? And i've also read somewhere that ground loop can only do 2 iterations before it doesnt connect anymore. And no JC on 5B blocked = no summon->5b->iad j2c setups? so doesn't this mean they reverted Carl back to the bottom tier when BB first came out because he had so little options and damage output is very low? Yet they seems to have kept him with low life, low guard libra, and low damage. Carl users will never get any love lol.

[Purumatic]

Apparently, the nerf was Nirvana dies on a second repetition of the clap trap.

http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showpost.php?p=465139&postcount=114 - Source

[MisterBadguy]

hahahaha, hmmm, projectile loop

Get hype. :CA:NIRVANA-DOKEN!!!

[Zeero]

I'd like to see this new 8D so that it is like a mini 214214D now. it still makes sense...sorta?

[feri]

unless the projectile is completely fucking awesome carl looks like trash. whats funny is carl now has even less synergy with nirvana... lol.

[BloodyHands17]

i wonder how carl is going to play without the clap loop? mmm..

[DJ Kyu]

I hope he'll at least be as interesting to watch as he was before. It's like they're taking away everything Carl had that made him a playable character. Taking out the clap/throw loop was one thing, but the J2C overhead, too? What kind of offense could he muster when all your enemy has to do is block low and watch for grabs? It's not like his weird trample horse is scary or anything. But then again continuum shift is going to have a new kinda system over all-so maybe things just work differently there.. Oh well. That Nirvana projectile better be good, and I mean LOL ICE CAR good. I'm already kinda disappointed, it'd be good to know something useful was coming over the horizon.

[feri]

Just random notes. IAD j.2c is still a crossup but with 5b gone you have to be very sly about doing it There is still 2b frametraps, right? Can people still mash backdash to get out of the 236236d super? How many reps of sandwich loop until nirvana dies? Is there any changes to fuco/anima/4d/623d/3d? Does 623c combo off a 5c max range/do anything different? Instant block/OS throw will shut down Carl completely, I fear. I mean Japs are already clearly adept at getting out of sandwich loops when they barely eat them (since its usually going into clap loops asap) and when its all that Carl has people are going to get better and better at getting out.

[Kyle]

Great thread. TX Mika.

5B no longer JumpCancels on block! I feel is the biggest Nerf he got. IAD J.2C cross-ups will still works tho. =/

-They removed-

Throw Loop :As stated

Air Throw BnB :2C has less hit stun.

Our strongest Mix-ups :J.2C Alle~Can NOT an overhead.

3C, IAD, J.2C combo: Slower J.2C start-up

Most of this is expected. I'm curious to see how well he stacks up to everyone else in the final iteration of Continuum shift.

[ZONG_one]

Great thread. TX Mika.

5B no longer JumpCancels on block! I feel is the biggest Nerf he got. IAD J.2C cross-ups will still works tho. =/

-They removed-

Throw Loop :As stated

Air Throw BnB :2C has less hit stun.

Our strongest Mix-ups :J.2C Alle~Can NOT an overhead.

3C, IAD, J.2C combo: Slower J.2C start-up

Most of this is expected. I'm curious to see how well he stacks up to everyone else in the final iteration of Continuum shift.

Give it time, in a couple months, our friendly Japanese mentors will come up with something for him.

[4Corners]

Here's hoping his solo damage buff is a considerable one. I want 3k offa 2a without Nirvana. D:< Hazama, I may just abandon Carl for you.

[Mikachiru]

...What happened to my thread...? I thought my post was first... I'm gonna eat you Slowpoke.

[Kyle]

...What happened to my thread...? I thought my post was first...

I'm gonna eat you Slowpoke.

What? Didn't mean to leave you hang'n Mika.

[Mikachiru]

What? Didn't mean to leave you hang'n Mika.

Thanks Kyle. Added some stuff (I think I'm still missing things...)

Here's hoping his solo damage buff is a considerable one. I want 3k offa 2a without Nirvana.

D:<

Hazama, I may just abandon Carl for you.

...HAZAMA, STOP STEALING CARL MAINERS!! IT'S NOT COOL!!!

It's not like we're overflowing with Carls here (Hazama= Sakuya is awesome).

Uh, this is actually a negative. Also, I'm not really liking the changes so far; they took out not only the loop (which I can understand), but they nerfed his offensive options as well?

WTB next loketest changes, kthnx.

Fixed. Can't believed I did that.

Er...This is still the first test, right? :vbang:

[Kyle]

Thread needs more pics.

On a serious note. MY SPECULATION is they purposefully over nerfed most characters for the lokeTest because they wanted people to experiment w/ options they don't usually. I find it hard to believe that Carl will get stuck this hard. Same with Rachel. She got raped the worst.

[Mikachiru]

Thread needs more pics.

On a serious note. MY SPECULATION is they purposefully over nerfed most characters for the lokeTest because they wanted people to experiment w/ options they don't usually. I find it hard to believe that Carl will get stuck this hard. Same with Rachel. She got raped the worst.

Ah, poor Rachel...

I'm going with Zong on this: Carl will be S-tier by the third test.

[4Corners]

Thread needs more pics.

On a serious note. MY SPECULATION is they purposefully over nerfed most characters for the lokeTest because they wanted people to experiment w/ options they don't usually. I find it hard to believe that Carl will get stuck this hard. Same with Rachel. She got raped the worst.

I have a friend with that gun. It's tight. I wanna get the shotgun. You load it the same way and everything.

Buuuuuut anyway

Good news that I remembered!

We still can do iad j2c off a lot of things. Our new 50/50 will have less range, of course (will prolly have to do it off 5a), buuut at least we'll have it.

Though really, if it's not an overhead, it'll be just as easy to block as Bang's mix-ups. Boooo.

[Mikachiru]

I have a friend with that gun. It's tight. I wanna get the shotgun. You load it the same way and everything.

Buuuuuut anyway

Good news that I remembered!

We still can do iad j2c off a lot of things. Our new 50/50 will have less range, of course (will prolly have to do it off 5a), buuut at least we'll have it.

Though really, if it's not an overhead, it'll be just as easy to block as Bang's mix-ups. Boooo.

I thought J.2C was too slow...

50/50 range? Mika's confused...

[4Corners]

We dunno just how slow it is. That's why I said it may be just as easy to block as anything that nonFRKZ Bang can throw at you. 50/50 is a situation where they have a 50% chance of guessing wrong. Anywhere in a blockstring where you can go between a low and an overhead with them having to guess, rather than react, is a 50/50. 5a>2b/j2c will be our new 50/50. Either that, or we're gonna have to get really creative/good and just bust out unblocks all day long. I guess I should work on that anyway. Blegh.

[Zoogstin]

5a>2b/j2c will be our new 50/50.

Remember j.2c is no longer an overhead.

Guess we're gonna have to stick with 6C for now.

[4Corners]

I know that. We're gonna have to play without overheads, and just xup on the x axis. Unless 6c gets buffed. Seriously, that move is garbage. Though I might have a use for it. I'll letcha guys know in a day or two if it works.

[Mikachiru]

I use 6C sometimes...=3

[soujiro seta]

Remember j.2c is no longer an overhead.

Guess we're gonna have to stick with 6C for now.

I know that. We're gonna have to play without overheads, and just xup on the x axis. Unless 6c gets buffed. Seriously, that move is garbage.

Though I might have a use for it. I'll letcha guys know in a day or two if it works.

I was disappointed myself too to find out j.2c is not an overhead, i mean how does having j.2C as an overhead give carl an andvantage in anyway what so ever? Not making it an overhead implies that they probably thought it was too good. 6C is too slow and you can easily get poked out of it and eat a combo. If that change stays, then they need to make 6C much much faster.

[Kyle]

J.2C, Alle~can is still a Throw bait/low crush. It still has it's uses. It will feel more like SFIV Cammy now. =/ A suggestion I could make: If J.2C is no longer an overhead would Aksys consider giving Alle~can a larger Y-axis value?