Baiken's Tension Counters (AC)

[CactusGuy]

Hey, new to the forum, need to learn higher level play, all that jazz. First question: What do Baiken's tension counters do? A friend and I tried over and over to see what the heck each one specifically does, but we're at a loss. Second question: Is that chain-arm with the pull in frc-able? Or just rc? Third question: The punch-counter, I've seen in videos people get launched sky high by it. Whenever I do it, they just take a tiny bit of damage. Is the launch counter-hit, clean hit, older gg, or what? Fourth question: I see air-dashing after air-dusting quite a bit in upper level videos, but have been completely unsuccessful doing it myself. Is there a specific window wherein I can start air-dashing after I air-dust, or am I just executing it incorrectly?

[POscrub]

http://www.dustloop.com/data/ac/baiken.html

Other than speed data, most of the moves have their special properties recorded here.

If you take a look at her FB counters, if you connect with a Baku (tension counter) followup, you can seal their jump/dash, make them unable to block your next hit, or all hits are CH for a short period of time. Pressing an additional button after this seals one of their 5 buttons.

If you look at the cancel column for Kabari (the chain pull), it's listed as R. So it can only be RC'd, not FRC'd. However, the followup sword slash to it (Tetsuzansen) can be both FRC'd and RC'd.

Punch counter, Youshijin only causes that nice untechable float on counter hit.

As for air dashing after air dust, I think it's just timing, but I don't personally play Baiken myself. After she's done recovering from the air dust, air dash again. Probably just a timing issue. A real Baiken player would be better suited to answering this question.

[Hellmonkey]

POscrub pretty much got everything, although Youshijin will launch if they're airborne even without a CH (not untechable though) Similar to previous versions, she can loop with j.D in the corner, but since it recovers quicker now the air dash is a lot sooner. I'm guessing you just don't have the timing down. Watch videos and see how baiken players loop in the corner, and try to reproduce that.

[CactusGuy]

Moar questionaz: I've been doin a really simple combo for most of my damage: 2k > 5s > 2d > Tatami > j.s > j.D The biggest problem I get is the tatami. About 50% of the time, rather than popping my victim straight up, it just scoots them over about an inch to the right. I've been using it in combat, and havn't really tested "is it counter hit" or what, and I'm wondering if someone else already knows. On the Tension Counter > Next hit unblockable, does that include the followup "cant use this button?" 'Cause if it does, why would I ever use it? Come to think of it, I rarely see these counters get tossed out. Are they viable weapons for Baiken, or should I save my tension? Lastly, what moves of hers are overhead? I have a lot of trouble getting past crouching-blocks.

[Hellmonkey]

Which version of the game are you playing?

[Kevinforce]

A real Baiken player

as soon as i see another one i'll let you know

[CactusGuy]

Oh, I'm playing GG AC. Thanks for the help btw. Another question, about baiken's air HS. Is that the only move in the game that remains on until it hits the ground, even after being blocked/striking?

[Hellmonkey]

No, May has one.. I think A.B.A. has one. Faust's force break brings him to the ground.

[Mike Z]

Wasn't answered, so: "next hit unblockable" takes effect when the current combo is over. So if your "seal the button" hit combos (which it does unless you do it really slowly) then no, the next hit is still unblockable. As another note, (at least in Slash, didn't test in AC but no reason to change it) if you combo off your "seal" hit (RC or whatnot) then when you finish that combo, the next hit is unblockable. If they burst your combo (or you do a techable combo and they tech) and you airthrow and it combos, then the next-unblockable effect is still preserved. However, if you airthrow and it doesn't combo, then the next hit after that will use up the unblockable effect, even if it combos off the airthrow. Mike Z

[CactusGuy]

Excellent info, thanks

[tki]

OK I feel real stupid about this, considering I've played Baiken since #R, but how the hell do you do the seals in AC? Are you supposed to hit the button at the same time as D for the baku, immediately after, or what? I've tried both and it only randomly seems to work when I get lucky.

[POscrub]

tki: If you look at the system data, one of the lines is like 12~ Follow up attacks possible. Baku startup is 11. So anytime after the Baku (214D) connects, then press P, K or S to get the next attack. After any of the above, you'll notice you can do button sealing part from frame 25-36. Recovery starts on frame 18. So after they get clocked by the 2nd counter, wait a tad, then press a button to seal theirs. Try it out in training mode.

[tki]

Alright, I guess I do just need to keep trying it. If I can get the second counter out I almost always land the seal, I'm just having trouble with that second part.

[Aurelious]

What about her Overdrive Counters? Do those have the Baku effects already built in or do they function differently?

[Hellmonkey]

...

[Aurelious]

Yea, I deserve the psyduck. I don't actually own ^C yet and was going off Reload. I was playing ^C with a friend and saw that they were actually replaced by the Force Break.

[Frank Cue^Bacon]

So, other than looking flashy, are the baku counters worth doing? I haven't seen anyone do them in any matches. *Nobody really answered this question.

[Hellmonkey]

It's situational. It's her fastest counter, and she can get the most damage off of it if you land a CH as opposed to sakura or youshijin, but it costs her tension which she doesn't gain very easily and if you don't land that counter-hit it's basically wasted (unless you use the extra 25% for the followup) If you can get instant counters down well, you can punish literally any non-invincible move which doesn't move out of her range with baku because it activates completely during hitstop, but that isn't very practicaly and will cost you the tension for it anyways. I have started using Sakura FRC more than Baku lately simply because you don't have to use the tension if you don't want to and it's easier to confirm when it does hit.

[Zakuta Asura]

Depends on how you want to play, they are useful, but you may want to consider the pay-off you can get w/ 50% tension. It also depends on distancing too because if you land Baku on CH and you're close, getting a combo afterwards will be easy and you save on tension. If your opponent has little life remaining then you may as well go into full Baku and net some free CHs to seal a win. Or even go for the free UB, it's really up to you.

[Frank Cue^Bacon]

Thanks, that definitely answers my question.

[radish]

hey, so i read around the forums and i'm still curous about baikens baku counteres. i know after you tension counter you can hit P- seal away their jump/dash for a peroid of time K- all hits act as counter hits for a peroid of time S- allows one unblockable hit so i got that much down but i'm curious on the follow up, when they refer to the 5 differnt follow ups you can do to seal away a button so they can't use, does that mean you have to follow up with a actual contact hit(if this is the case is it ok if they block it) or is it just a input of certain button after the tension counter(P,K,S) and how long does this sealing away a button last. thanks

[rtl42]

after the tension counter, you then hit either P, K, S, H, or D. it has to be done within a certain amount of time from the tension counter, otherwise the opponent will block the button seal attack (or it'll whiff, lol). the button seal attack has to hit the opponent; if they block it, their button does not get sealed. the button seal lasts as long as the tension counter part.

[Hellmonkey]

I undeleted poscrub's posts which had explained it

[Yurlungur]

I don't think I'll say anything that wasn't already covered but It's my findings (so far) on the Baku counter. It will hit completely in hit stop so it will get someone off of you, yet it does use 25% tension. If a alternate way out of pressure is available you should probably do that, your call. I found (at least in my team) that it's not very expected, even if it is, they can't dodge it if they're too close. No one explained the attacks that the sealing does so I'll throw them in (generally what they do) P seal: A fast jab, Baiken slides across the ground and punches her opponent. K seal: Hits twice, once on the forward flip, then once when she stomps the ground. S seal: A flash strike. I think it will go straight to the enemy as long as they are on the ground, you slice them and end up behind the enemy. H seal: A flipping fire strike. If you're too far away this takes too long to do, I've missed it actually. D seal: A windmill attack. Baiken gets right under them and slices 'em up with a windmill arm above her. I have killed Zappa will Raou out quite a few times by sealing his movement and Slash button. That way you can mix up behind him (after S seal) and take Raou's time down. Raou will end before Baku wears off, during this time you can punish him for using that frick'n thing.

[evilragnarok]

Is there a preference as to which tension counter you want to use?