4r5 Report post Posted January 6, 2008 KY MATCHUP INFORMATION Poking Game More to come!...? You can help! Strategy More to come!...? You can help! Specific Punishes More to come!...? You can help! Setups/baits More to come!...? You can help! Knowledge More to come!...? You can help! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
4r5 Report post Posted March 3, 2008 So yup, nearly impossible to air-to-ground Ky. 6P beats beats everything you can throw at him. At every angle, with every timing, best you will get is a clash, at which point you need to FD because you got nothing left that will save you frome another 6P or whatever else Ky may do. A high enough DB will obviously beat his 6P or a VT, but if it gets instant-blocked the situation resets and your back to where you started. If I must go air-to-ground with Ky, I use KJ, since it gives you a bit of trickery to work with. Ground-to-ground, Ky still got you beat. Faster pokes that match or out range your own; Stun Edges help too. Not as hopeless as going air-to-ground. Going to have to make sure your spacing and reflexes are up to par, if you wanna counter-poke him. Don't want to dash in on Ky either, liable to get you hit, with your only recourse is to cancel into a jump, which puts you in to that air-to-ground problem. Though if you anticipate a poke you can hit him with a tigerknee'd DB or KJ. You don't want to run straight in at Ky, you want to run around him; if that makes sense. Like, you can't just run away from him, 'cause then he just throws Stun Edges all day. (Which gives him a surprising amount of tension, if you haven't noticed, especially on block.) But you can't charge in at him, 'cause then you're likely to get hit for it. You want to be that annoying fly. Close enough that you can't be ignored, but far enough that you can't be swatted. So I guess what I'm trying to say is that you want to pretend he's Potemkin and you're Chipp. At least this is what I've found so far, after months of fighting Steve Harrison's wall-like Ky. Ky's f.S has less range then the graphics would lead you to believe. From just where Ky's f.S would whiff, you can 6P it with out trading. Any closer and you trade. You can combo the trade with a JH, or if you trade closer you can dash up with a f.S or K. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SSMugen Report post Posted March 5, 2008 damn so that means j.hs doesn't work as a safe jump-in? and for punishes can you 6p his GS if he tries to use it at he end of a pressure string? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
4r5 Report post Posted March 5, 2008 Nah, even sloppily timed 6P's will trade, which sends you knocked down across the screen. Depends what move he made you block before the Greed Saber. Properly spaced, a HS>GS, you would have to instant block the HS to 6P the GS. 6HS>GS, you have to block the GS, or super it. Lvl4 moves, or less, into GS you can 6P. But, no matter how far away he spaces the GS, if you instant block the GS you can always hit him with f.S-6HS. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
低姿勢 Report post Posted March 5, 2008 6p deffintly does not beat everything johnny does. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
4r5 Report post Posted March 5, 2008 I think you can space a KJ so that it's un-6P-able, but I haven't had time to try it out lately. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SSMugen Report post Posted March 6, 2008 ^ yeah I tried that before but I haven't found the proper spacing fo it yet. I'll go into training mode and practice it to tell you guys. and what if you DB FRC then dash around him and try to go for a Dash then throw if he doesn't instant block it? that should work shouldn't it? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kiflo Report post Posted March 7, 2008 does 6K go through ky's projectiles? I tried teleporting through using mist stance but that didnt work Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
4r5 Report post Posted March 7, 2008 nah, not the ground ones. you can 6K past the air ones if you get the right angle. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tj3ssa1 Report post Posted April 25, 2008 does 6K go through ky's projectiles? I tried teleporting through using mist stance but that didnt work 6p goes through all of his little ones if that helps... also, someone mess around with ways to punish Ky on burst most damage i got was 275 (at lvl2) more damages. p.s. pat i cant count how many times i've accidentally clicked your sig... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Camo Report post Posted June 11, 2008 Between Ky's Gatling 6P>6HS, Joh's super work fine. In air, don't think to attack Ky, you'll always lose. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YanisDLooper Report post Posted September 7, 2008 I fought a guy in casuals when he was Ky. It wasn't actually a hard fight (except for my newbish lack of execution), but the reason I was able to do well against him was because I watched him play 3 matches previously to me and he started the round off the same every single time. He had habits that I was able to pick up on from watching him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
qwerty Report post Posted September 7, 2008 consider youself lucky. ky is one of my most hated matchups in the game . fb crosses completely dominate johnny's air game. if he gets you in the corner and he has quarter tension, i'd suggest you get out of that shit asap before he places a cross and pretty much holds a choke point on the stage. the most i've been able to do in that situation is stop his rush in with 5K (kinda hard, depending on who's playing ky) and fd until the cross disappears. you don't want to jump into it, period, because he can capitalize on that from anywhere on the screen, be it with a dp combo or a projectile (or in some cases, another cross ). pretty much, this is a matchup where you have to be aggressive and try to get an advantage as early as possible. land a coin before he can gain tension and try to dominate him on oki with enkasu setups. be wary of his pressure (ky's 5K looks like it hits high, but it hits low. this used to get me all the time) and if he manages to trap you, be patient. the difference between a good ky and a bad ky are that a good ky will back off and try to bait you some other way, whereas a bad ky will just keep spamming crosses all over the place and try to bait you that way. if you just stay put and throw out safe pokes to counter his rush ins, those crosses will disappear and then you'll be free again. then he'll have no tension and you can rush him down johnny style. hard matchup (for me at least), but it's definitely doable. ky's kinda like venom in the sense that good players can be very versatile with them and really fuck you up, but bad players just use gimmicks and bullshit that will only work the first time. luckily, most of the ky's i've had the chance to play have been good, so i can at least offer some (somewhat) valuable advice for him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YanisDLooper Report post Posted September 8, 2008 My opponent (I suppose) was in the fledgling Ky category. He abused ACSE and Greed Sever with some Stun Dippers thrown in. Not once did he throw a cross. Other than that he didn't really mix it up. As I said, I was able to watch him for 3 matches before me and learned his habits. I don't remember if I won the match but it was a lot easier on me then trying to fight the ABA or the Jam players. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
qwerty Report post Posted April 6, 2009 this is admittedly a pretty question, but how do you dudes typically meaty against dp happy ky's? i tried standard 3H, got dp'd. tried 2K, got dp'd. tried whiffing 2K and baiting a whiffed dp for HMF combos, that worked once; every other time i got greed severe'd. tried 5H from a distance, which also worked once but i was too far away to follow up with anything. it's just annoying the hell out of me because ky's standard one-hit is so incredibly easy to execute, yet he can manage to weasel out of any meaty i throw out and there goes my corner jackhound combo x 3. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
4r5 Report post Posted April 6, 2009 I use meaty 2K or meaty 2S from a distance. Sometimes meaty c.S, usually after a OD, but the timing is really strict. Coin for easy-mode. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frcflyingjohnny Report post Posted March 19, 2010 1.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCRFAJAXZxc 2.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCRFAJAXZxc#t=3m42s 3.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCRFAJAXZxc#t=8m17s 4.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMBHH1t-TcM#t=6m41s 5.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_AxBQsk860 wow DC u so craaaaaazy 6.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_AxBQsk860#t=3m55s 7.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_AxBQsk860#t=7m55s 8.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6vdV2cYE-4#t=4m11s 9.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgjQJKYUFSw 10.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgjQJKYUFSw#t=5m23s 11.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaI9oIgzzZc 12.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaI9oIgzzZc#t=4m47s 13.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bs0f3PDlEMg#t=1m54s 14.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bs0f3PDlEMg#t=3m51s (this takes place directly after the 13th) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frcflyingjohnny Report post Posted March 22, 2010 Videos 188 1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_IbSelZPmk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frcflyingjohnny Report post Posted March 29, 2010 bigOOOOOOOOOOOOOO 1. www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zz3tXs7iGvw 2. www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVMRlEqorFY <- good mist setup vs. KY he does it like 5 times Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nattak Report post Posted November 26, 2012 I'm having a bit of trouble against his 2D, it just seems to work wonders. -It looks like you can dash over it but doesn't work -seems like a free f.S to 200 + damage combo when it whiffs, but the f.S misses. I facepalm myself every time i fight ky's because i forget that. Might be just me, but it seems really good for ky to use as a poke while being pressured. I have found out that you can stuff it in the startup with a 2s but in order to connect 2s-5hs i need to be in a specific range. i'm not good enough to connect a dashjack from 2s so only mistfiner level 2 can connect from it i think. Does anyone know more ways around it? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
4r5 Report post Posted November 26, 2012 You can dash over Ky's 2D, but its active frames out run your hopping frames. You can dash>OD and not worry about whether or not you made it through his active frames, but to do anything else to him you have to time the dash over the trailing end of his active frames. f.S will whiff unless you catch Ky very early in 2D's startup, or very late in its recovery. Possibly only the first and last frames of Ky's 2D are hittable with f.S? You say he's using 2D while under pressure? At level 2, HS>MC,f.S is a true blockstring. You can frametrap him by delaying the f.S to catch his 2D, but if he's hitting you then you are either delaying the f.S too long, MCing too slow, or aren't looking out for the IB on your HS. But I still wouldn't use f.S, even as a frametrap. Ky has too many ways around it. f.S in this matchup is mostly a reactionary poke against Ky's 6HS. Johnny's 6HS and 5K can be used to force a whiff. 6HS, of course, moves your hitbox back, and 5K you hit him with the leg that would of got you hit. Johnny's crouching block hitbox is wider than his crouching hitbox, so there is a distance where you can crouch and Ky's 2D will whiff, but if you down-back then you block it. Beating 2D, and the matchup in general, is mostly about spacing and some decent reactions. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nattak Report post Posted November 27, 2012 Very much useful stuff sir, thank you! I've been trying to keep an "open" pressure game lately which have been working out very well. What i mean by that is giving ky some room, walking back and forth to clutter his sense of spacing, lure out moves that whiff, and then punish it at range with 5k, f.S, 5hs or 2s. It just came to a crash whenever there is a 2D or ky starts shooting up close. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
qwerty Report post Posted November 28, 2012 Generally speaking, I consider Johnny as having two kinds of matchups: f.S/5K matchups, and 5K/2S matchups. Ky definitely falls into the latter, as a lot of his moves aren't easy to whiff punish due to them lowering his hitbox and the relatively fast recovery on most of his normals. Not to mention, many of his pokes can make short work of your f.S. The way I like to think of it is that Ky excels in the long and close range game, and as Johnny it's your job to get in the range where he has to take the bigger risks, that being approximately 5K max range. 2D out of pressure sounds to me like straight up disrespect, lol. The way I'd punish that is by just MC'ing and waiting. If you space yourself right, it'll be easy to react to whatever the other guy does (usually a jump or mashing something out like Stun Dipper/2D/whatever). In general, I don't recommend trying to beat out any of Ky's moves unless you know the spacing is just right. So instead of trying to 2S/3H a move like 2D, just IB it or react to the whiff and wavedash in. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
