[CS2] Ragna vs Bang

[Leonil_Requiem]

"The defender of justice has arrived!"

"Alright, let's do it!"

One of the more stylish match-ups if you ask me. Both these characters have changed a lot. So please invest a little time into figuring out how to beat Tsuuna, eh, Bang and make sure he never get the CS advantage he did back then. Have fun!

[Tong]

This match is pure horseshit.

According to BBS, this matchup is 5.5 in Ragna favor, which I honestly, cant just buy.

First of all, Ragna doesnt have a reliable solution to his Rushdown, as in:

-Bang dashing 5B will beat/stuff CLEANLY every normal, even your famous 5B. Absolutely, dont try anything stupid while hes pressuring you.

-Not even IB'ing or Barrier will save you from dash 5A/5B pressure resets, Ragna just CANT counter that shit without spending meter with ID.

-Watchout for his D shurikens, If you're near, prepare to fucking block a lot. Even If you're airborne and block some, he will get you on your way down.

Thats what I felt. /NaCl

[LuminAbyss]

I feel like it's his mobility and nails that get in the way. Ragna definitely beats his range, and his 5B will beat Bang's 5B when spaced properly.

x__x I don't know about 5.5 in Ragna's favor, though, cause there's just too much for Ragna to keep track of in this match-up. And if Bang gets FRKZ, he becomes a lot lot harder to block.

All I really have on this match-up is try to keep and control your space. Stay out of his 5A range, and don't try to fight him up close. Try to make the most of long range hitconfirms (Ragna can get some nice stuff with meter off them), and keep him from getting in.

I might be approaching it wrong, but that's how I kinda feel it should be played.

[xlolxlolx]

match is all about spacing, if theyre throwing out d nails from far away, super jump forward and block, airdash or w/e you want after they go away

i havent seen a single bang that does spam air dash after frkz, get ready to air throw/6a/id/5d

everything else.....cough CS1

[A.X.I.S.]

This match is pure horseshit.

According to BBS, this matchup is 5.5 in Ragna favor, which I honestly, cant just buy.

First of all, Ragna doesnt have a reliable solution to his Rushdown, as in:

-Bang dashing 5B will beat/stuff CLEANLY every normal, even your famous 5B. Absolutely, dont try anything stupid while hes pressuring you.

-Not even IB'ing or Barrier will save you from dash 5A/5B pressure resets, Ragna just CANT counter that shit without spending meter with ID.

-Watchout for his D shurikens, If you're near, prepare to fucking block a lot. Even If you're airborne and block some, he will get you on your way down.

Thats what I felt. /NaCl

1. It feels easier for Ragna than CS1.

2. Bangs 5B is slower and doesn't have the same Range as Ragna's 5B, your spacing it wrong or hitting 5B too late if your being stuffed by his 5B.

3. IB if for the meter or to punish stupid, you know the usual reason to IB, Barrier him when he pushes himself too far and doesn't use something jump cancelable, if he does jump cancel then react accordingly.

4. Jump and IB nails, Jump IB is still good so make the most of it.

[Famhuss]

So how are you guys holding up against his guard points?

I usually use 3c which often hits him for some reason or if you are able to react to the fact he guardpointed you gatteling into 5D will score you CH against him.

In my experience you should never block his 2d since he can JC it and you will end up going through one of his blockstrings again or worse, your DP will be baited.

[LuminAbyss]

His 5D and 2D can be beaten by lows like 2B or 3C, they only guard point high and mid attacks. Watch out for 6D, which blocks lows and mid, if you block it though, it's usually easy to punish.

If they anticipate you trying to punish after a blocked drive, however, remember that 5D and 6D can be special canceled into his fire punch special, which scores a fatal on counter hit. 2D is jump cancelable, and j.D has 3 frame recovery upon landing.

[KayEff]

just mash 2A against his guard points

other than against 2D, chances are you'll beat it out

[huey253]

Key Frame Data for Bang Pressure

5A - 6 frame startup - 0 on block (jc on block)

2A - 8 frame startup - -2 on block

6A - 17 frame startup - +1 on block (jc on block)

5B - 10 frame startup - -2 on block

2B - 13 frame startup - -6 on block (jc on block)

2C - 13 frame startup - -4 on block

5C - 18 frame startup (hits overhead on frame 24) - -8 on block (jc on block)

TK Dnails - 9 frame startup (+ 4 frames of jump startup) - +6 on block

623B - 16 frame startup - -7 on block

This is a guide to help defend againist Bang's standard ground pressure as Ragna.

Most Bang players will try to approach on the ground with 5A and 5B. A well timed 5B will beat both and lead into HF ender. If you feel that your ground footsies are superior to the Bang player, try getting even closer with 5B so that you can score a good combo with proper confirm. Ragna's 2B will go under both Bang's 5A and 5B, so it is good at for ground footsies as well. Bang's 2B, at 13 frames, is much slower than Ragna's 5B/2B, but it hits to the ground, and Bang's hitbox retracts really fast. 5C is really risky to use as a poke vs Bang, so its much safer to go with 5B. Bang's reward on standing CH 5B is higher than Ragna's, so don't recklessly approach him.

Assuming the Bang player gets in at some point, you have to figure out how to deal with his pressure. From Bang's 5A, he has a couple of choices. He can do 5A x N for stagger pressure, 5A 2A to keep you honest on defense, 5A 6A to try to ghetto reset pressure, or 5A 5B for the most standard of play. If you can iB Bang's 5A properly, it really limits his options to 5A 2A and 5A 5B. Bang's 5A does not chain into itself, so he must recover and do it again if he chooses to do so. The two major ways of dealing with 5A x N and 5A 6A pressure are using barrier defense to push him out really fast or IBing 5A or 6A and hitting 2A after it. Bang's main options of stopping you from doing 2A after IBing 6A are TK Dnails or 2C. TK Dnails have really awful proration, and 2C is techable so Bang doesn't get anything other than an unconfirmable 623B. If the Bang player is uses 5A 5C, you should hit him out of it via 2A or Inferno Divider. Bang's 5A is the main source of grab/command grab attempts. If you sense a small pause after Bang's 5A, you should backdash or jump if you think the command grab is coming. The best way to stop command grab attemps are with barrier or poking out with 2A.

After Bang gets to 5B, this is where is becomes complicated. Bang's 5B is his only useful normal that he is able to late chain with, and it has enough blockstun to create frametraps. However, the hitstop of the move is big enough where that it obvious If the Bang player didn't chain into another normal, which is a good chance to take pressure via 2A. However, assuming the Bang player decides to use his 5B, his main options are 5B 6A, 5B 5C, 5B 2B, and 5B 2C. 5B 6A is useful for resetting pressure only if the Bang player is really close, and can be stopped by barriering 5B. If Bang chains into any of his normals off of 5B, it is either gapless or auto frame trap. 5B 5C is the mash safe blockstring into overhead (still loses to Inferno Divider). If he uses this string, he will be pushed out too far to the point that he would barely be able to combo off overhead (which leads into nonexistant damage midscreen). 5B 2C is to keep you honest in the blockstring (should be blocking low and reacting high) but leaves Bang in a bad spot, so it won't be used often. 5B 2B is the most commonly used string that allows him to go to Dnails. The best way to deal with 5B in general is by barriering the move to limit his options after it.

Bang's 2A is actually kinda bad in pressure. Usually, most Bang players will continue to 5B after 5A 2A, 5A 2AA, 2A, or 2AA (can gatling 2A twice on hit or block) due to the move being negative on block. For some reason, it is pretty easy to react to Bang's 2A's recovery, so it is really bad for resetting pressure. It is a 8 frame low, and it usually for keeping the opponent honest on their blocking. Bang's 2A is level 0, so command grab attempts will most likely come off of this move occasionally. If you barrier Bang's 2A, he cannot command grab you after it unless he does a purple one, or does it really close to you. Normal grab attempts for Bang are strong off of this normal.

Bang's 6A is really good on paper, but is generally only okay in actual functionality. His main options off 6A are reset into 5A pressure, gatling into 2C or jump cancel into TK Dnails. Bang's 6A is +1 on block, so it is ESSENTIAL that you MUST IB this move. If there is any move in Bang's pressure that you must IB, it is this one. iBing 6A shuts down Bang's realistic options because 6A 2C has to be done relatively fast, and 6A TK Dnails is only to call out 2A mash (with very low reward). If Bang does 6A and doesn't gatling into 2C immediately, the best option after INSTANT BLOCKING 6A is to 2A and start pressure. Avoid barriering this move unless you must, it is pretty much a pressure ender if you can consistently instant block.

Bang's 2B is mainly used for gatling into 2C for end of blockstring or going into TK Dnails. If you barrier 2B 2C, Bang can't do anything to keep you in blockstun after that unless he rapid cancels. 2C is -4 on block, so it is the realistic end of his pressure. TK Dnails are +6, but we'll get to how to dealing with them in a second. You can Inferno Divider through the TK Dnails if you know they are coming.

Bang's 2C is Bang's second low attack, which leads into no damage due to the move being techable. Bang can connect 623B if he does it without confirming if 2C hits, so it is a pretty risky thing to do. Usually the end of Bang's pressure unless he feels like pushing his luck. This is another move that you should IB as well. If you do, it greatly limits Bang's options and allows you to punish with Inferno Divider if close up (safe to do unless they RC) or 2A, which is risky due to the fact that Bang can still technically gatling into 2C.

Bang's 623B is usually for only frame trapping, and taking away a primer. It is unsafe on block and should be punish with 5B on instant block. You can get a 2A on normal block if you are close enough. This is an important move to instant block. Bang can late chain into 623B from 2C late to increase to pushback to prevent a punish from occuring. If you IB Bang's 2C, the fastest 623B possible is the only way to catch a 2A punish of 2C, which means you should wait a quick second before pulling the trigger on 2A. Bang's damage off FC 623B is under 3k without meter, even in the corner. Overall a very risky move to use in Bang's pressure.

Bang's 5C is overhead and has gatlings into 6A, 2C, 5D, and 623B. 5D and 623B are punishable on block by Inferno Divider and 2A, so they really shouldn't be using these gatlings on block. 5D is - 15, so you can actually get a really good punish if Bang uses that move on block. He can gatling 5D into 623B, but it ends up leaving him at -7 and -10 if you instant block it. He can only do 5C 6A super close to the opponent, and it doesn't even work if you barrier him out (6A wiffs unless you are standing pretty much on each other). 5C 2C is pretty useless on block, so the Bang player will most likely jump/instant air dash or do TK Dnails.

Tiger Knee D-Nails are Bang's most useful tool for resetting pressure. They are supposed to be really good, and they cost 3 nails so they end up being +6. There are a couple things you can do about them. You can instant block them and jump or backdash if the Bang player isn't right next to you. You can Inferno Divider through them if you are sure that they are coming and you are in range. If Bang is really close to you, you just have to let him continue his pressure. If Bang is greater than a character's length away, you can IB the D-Nails and 2A him out of his 5A. There is one thing that prevents this from always happening. Sometimes, one of the Dnails will bounce on the ground much later than the other two, and hit you on block later. This means that the TK Dnails have become much more than +6 on block, so do not do anything if this happens. You can't really stop this from happening, and it kinda sucks when it does. Other than that, Bang is using alot of resources to use TK Dnails, so its supposed to be his move to get free pressure.

TL DR VERSION: BARRIER 5A/5B/2A/2B/5C INSTANT BLOCK 6A/2C/623B and TK DNAILS ARE STRONG.

(I wrote this pretty late so sorry for any grammar errors )

[Tong]

Very thoroughful, thanks

[advancedNoob]

Nice info. Sadly, even though I know his weak spots and strong points, I will still lose to good bangs. He dominates ragna and the only thing you can do to win, is read his his pressure well, or just change your character.

[Tong]

or just change your character.

Please dont.

[LuminAbyss]

Thanks for the info Huey! That really helps a lot, Bang has been giving me a lot of trouble lately.

[huey253]

Thanks for the info Huey! That really helps a lot, Bang has been giving me a lot of trouble lately.

No problem. Spirit Juice asked me how to deal with Bang's pressure as Ragna, so I wrote this up. If you have any other questions about the matchup, just ask.

[Fistmaster049]

normally with this matchup, my money would be on Ragna, even if Bang's 5D or low D would happily just go through most of his ground combos

but online (or at least Xbox live) Bangs usually tend to just run and throw shuirkens, Ragna can't do shit about that really

[A.X.I.S.]

Actually part of your job in this match up is to play it safe and IB the nails.

He only has 12 nails so he only has 4 safe/safe-ish approaches on you.

Bang has to stay in the air because he cannot beat you on the ground, once you landed a hit you stick to him like white on rice.

Ragna vs Bang is the usual business for Ragna, just look out for drives and nails.

Bang vs Ragna is a no fun zone for Bang, Bang cannot afford to get grounded and must always move in a unpredictable pattern.

[MashThat5A]

Aren't air dash>A nail approaches also good? Baits the fuck out of anti airs.