[CS2] Jin vs Litchi

[Yuushiro]

Going to update these as I have time to gather information from people’s and my own experience and translate what the Japanese are saying in the wiki or BBS

For now you guys can discuss the matchup here.

Basic/Matchup overview:

long-distance:

mid range:

short range:

Best tools:

Best way to pressure:

Their strategy vs us:

Best overall strategy:

[Solex]

someone plz help me with this all i got from sg beating on me was that i should 2a AA her alot because it beats all of her air moves except jumping staffless j.c and that was cause he yelled it at me lol

[Tonberry]

Basic info about the matchup:

- 2a AA is useful in this matchup though it's important to note that if she does her jB deep enough you're going to lose. You can probably 5a if you expect that but I don't have enough guts for that.

- DP loop in corner --> neutral jump j2c is a safejump vs emergency tech tsubame. It also catches rolls and if they don't neutral tech you can hit them lying on the ground.

- Midscreen you can roll backwards if they do tsubame --> 13 orphans. In the corner you can and should Yukikaze if they ever do 13 orphans. It's definitely worth the meter to go back to midscreen and not have to deal with safe and hard to see mixups.

- You can IB first hit of the mid guard point and dash after the second hit

- If you IB the second hit of 6d it's only even on block instead of +f. This allows you to throw her if she does 2a mindlessly after it but it's a better idea to 2a or jump back barrier.

- Magic jB beats her wakeup dp.

- Post 5d dash on hit isn't very much in your favor. Her double backdash(227) requires you to specifically read that in order to beat it. The reward for her doing guard point is also way too obscene.

- If you do j236a/b airdash jb/j2c if she does dp after the ice sword the last hit always whiffs(aka she gets like 4.5k)

- If they hop on top of staff to go for crossup hatsu you can just dash to get out 100%.

- She has an OS with 421abd. If you do cross under 2a she gets wakeup tsubame. If you stay on the same side she gets barrier.

My overview of the matchup

The general strategy is to play somewhat careful vs her in neutral. If you try to just run at her and hit her you'll get CH into oblivion, carried to the corner, and take massive damage, frequently into daisharin.

Fullscreen neutral: Move forward. Litchi putting the staff out and sending it at you is way better than anything you have full screen and she might eventually come after you with staff making it safe.

Midscreen neutral:

- 2d is really useful if you get a chance to put it out. It can hit her if she lets go of her guard point and if she doesn't obscenely delay letting her staff go the staff will clash with 2d and you won't get hit by her guard point. Dash barrier backdash 2d can catch them trying to react to you running forward with pokes.

- jC and jB are both good air to air. jB is better used preemptively to catch her being sloppy near you, jC is better when she's further away.

- Against mid range guard point: Jump forward barrier or IB dash if they mainly do mid guard point. Jump forward barrier can often go over the arc of anti-air guard point.

- Against far range guard point: Jump back low c ice sword or just back off until they cancel it and move forward again.

- Against 6b: While 2d does beat it, good Litchis won't just let you put it out. Neutral jump/jump forward barrier and if you can get above 6b height put out jc. This can CH her out of her 6b.

- Against 3c/2b: If you're really confident they're going to put it out you can dash 6b. The reward is very high if you're right and a number of her pokes in neutral aren't going to deal massive damage without CH, which she won't get because you have to be pretty close for 6b to hit.

- Against staff projectile: Ice swords will clash with them. You have to guess which direction they're going to send it and try to dance around it as best as you can. If you can make her block or hit her after dodging it on the way forward it won't hit on the way back.

- Against glide throw - Mash really hard and hope you hit them before they 2a/mash dp.

- NEVER EVER EVER EVER challenge hatsu. If she's staffless and you're airdashing at her from far away they will always autopilot hatsu because it comes out way too fast and has an obscene hitbox. Doesn't matter if it's LK or randomly PSN Litchi 18238420 it's COMING. If you're ever unsure if it's coming in neutral put out j236d from an appropriate range if you're in the air or backdash/walk back 2d.

Pressure:

You need to be able to block at least staffless 6a well. I'm fairly certain 4d can be blocked on reaction but no one uses it enough point blank for me to ever find out . The rekka overhead is also annoying if you're not used to seeing it but it's not safe most of the time. Her pressure is overall really tight staffless and barrier isn't that effective against it. That makes good defense is very important in this matchup because her mixup leads into massive damage. If you're confident on when she's going to put her staff down in pressure you can dash 5c and CH her. If you get hit by 3c or 6d it's not too bad(unless she has 50 meter after 6d) but 4d kind of hurts so don't do this too much. If you're just getting hit by mixups all day, mash out DP(especially if you have 50 meter) or counter assault. Sometimes you really need to just put them in their place.

against 4d - If she has 50 meter they're going to rapid if you block it. If you see she has 50 meter you might want to just block high when she has her staff and she's next to you. They also use 4d more often when they have 50 meter. From far away 4d is safe on block, might even be +f. Close range it's -f though so mash after it.

post staff 6a(hit/block): Litchi players usually guard point here. Jump barrier beats all the options off that though you can alternatively dash 3c or sit on the ground and IB the mid guard point if they do that.

vs Daisharin: This move is really, really, really, good. If you have trouble blocking immediate airdash jb vs land 2b/3c because she's really low to the ground it helps if you delay the tech. If they're bad the Daisharin will hit you in a sloppy way and you can tech out. Yukikaze is really risky because if she does land low after it or throw or delayed jc then it whiffs. Jump back barrier beats some of the mixup options but if she does hatsu you take massive damage.

Jin pressure:

Go in HARD if you catch her without her staff. Don't ever give the Litchi player the slightest amount of credit if they're staffless. If they're midscreen always dash 2a in midscreen post ice car and always meaty 5b so she can't backdash. When she has staff the only thing she should hit you with is dp unless you went for a mixup. If you're worried about dp or messing up tech punish, high jD land 5a--> air pressure is strong.

Ren vs Shounen

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KHC4ANgnGc&feature=feedu

www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjJetmMeb74&feature=feedu

www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SiSe35Wl_E&feature=feedu

These are really good matches.