[VS] Felicia: Cat People

[ailerus]

I was talking about Matt's cause I kept stuffing his throw attempts in casuals on Saturday. Maybe it's because he was too predictable but he adapted by doing meaty cr.fierce into sweep...but at least I stopped him from trying to throw me.

[Lion's Eye]

At the very least we now understand your wakeup ES command throw is gonna beat everything Gallon has if they're in range. This will actually help me refine my game against Felicia.

[omegaryuji]

I've been using this string and it really does work well to keep Anakaris in one spot once you have him in the corner. I understand that it punishes mashing, attempts to jump out, and his disappear thingy, but can he Dark Force out of it? I don't think any of the ones I've played have tried it and I was wondering if it works as an escape for him.

Firstly, sorry for taking so long to get back to you about this.

Anyway, I tried it a bit in training mode (which is kinda poverty when you're trying to work both controllers at once by yourself, so take this all with a grain of salt *laughs* ), and from what I can tell, there is a window for Anak to reversal DF. However, since Anak's DF is so slow, you have plenty of time to react to it getting activated, avoid getting punished, then look for an opening to take momentum against once the other player deactivates DF. It's something that they can do as a sort of hail mary escape attempt, but definitely does not seem stable.

[Kyle]

From XenoZip @Srk. Post#2276

c.LP to c.MP is a 2F link.

c.LP-c.LP to c.MP is a 4F link but only combos to dp+LP and only if you link the mp fast enough (making the bigger window kind of a moot point).

I did some research on her framedata regarding her dash attacks. Her d.MP and d.MK give a lot more hitstun than d.HP or d.HK. Also her landing pose is about 7F but the pose itself is special/super cancelable which is why going right from a dash attack to ES/EX roll is easier than dash attack into c.LP link. Of course it's easier to hitconfirm the link but w/e.

[Kyle]

From XenoZip @SRK. Post#2300

QBs c.LP, c.LK, and c.MP all hit low which combo to CR or chain into c.MK which is +frames (+5/+4) or c.HK for a knockdown.

So blocking high all the time is just begging to die about as much as blocking low all the time.

Regarding the QB/Felicia matchup: Chicken blocking sometimes works against QB because her airdash autotargets, and she can't chain during airdash, so having her fly up off the screen is the last thing a QB player wants. Felicia's c.HP is also off the ground on like the third frame, I think, so you can use that in lieu of chicken blocking. Getting reset in the air is bad because it gives QB a free mixup opportunity but it can sometimes work in your favor (at least it gives you a moment to think).

I think Felicia does very well against QB. Her anti-airs work against QB's airdashes and normal jumps, but QB has a very hard time anti-airing an unpredictable Felicia. A neutral jump spamming, backdash spamming, and walljump spamming Felicia can give a QB a real headache. I think Felicia kinda wins air-to-air also. And Felicia's HK also stuffs a fuck of a lot of QBs low pokes since it takes her off the ground and has an awesome hitbox, and QB doesn't have much that can stop her from tossing out HKs in general. Felicia is good at playing like a little bitch and running/poking all day, which happens to work on QB because QB has no fireball/dp/anti-air to stop it and her airdash gets thrown off by jump-shenanigans. The trick is to get her to start relying on her MP, which you can then play the guessing game that's in your favor once you get her to start doing it.

However, both matchup charts I've seen put that in QBs favor slightly (either 6-4 or 6.5-3.5). Though personally as a QB and Felicia player who's played against other QBs and Felicias I'd say it's pretty close to even. The one thing that really hurts Felicia is that QB can use meter effectively but you really have to know what you're doing to use any meter with Felicia. She basically just has her dash overhead link, meanwhile QB as ES CR and EX Honey Bubble and ES cmd grab.

[Kyle]

Get knockdown,

Activate DarkForce

They roll into you,

You get "which-way" combo

cr.lk, link cr.lk, assist, walk, link, cr.lk link cr.lk, assist, dashing.j.mp, land, Delta kick, Assist, OTG ToyTouch

or

cr.lk, link cr.lk, assist, walk, link, cr.lk link cr.lk, assist, dashing.j.mp, land, 41236PPP, Assist, OTG ToyTouch

Don't tell me this is unrealistic. I have seen it. d(0.0d)

[Kyle]

From Feliniki i@SRK Post#3797

On the subject of Felicia's meter: Her ES Guard Cancel is one of the ones that have unblockable startup. It seems that in general, during the first 7 frames of an ES Guard Cancel, the opponent is incapable of blocking, so if your Guard Cancel can hit within the first 7 frames, it can be unblockable. Felicia's happens to be one of the ones that can hit early enough for that to occur. Don't know how useful it actually is competitively, but I figured it's worth mentioning.

[Kyle]

You can/should kara cr.hk into toy touch for more meter gain.

[Ciccio]

The other day me and kyle was talking about Felicia's renda bonus combo and what attack we must use to hitconfirm, if EX or ES

for my experience i know the ES roll do more damage than the EX, alone or in combo, but i tested a few combos again for check the damage , just for be sure

NOTE: i tested the damage on ps2 version (psp was a too hard cause awful controls but i'll work on that too)

j.mk,c.mp ES roll =

Red damage: 46 - Overall Damage: 71

j.mk,c.mp EX roll =

Red damage: 45 - Overall Damage: 69

-----------------------------------------------------

j.hp,c.mp ES roll =

Red damage: 49 - Overall Damage: 76

j.hp,c.mp EX roll =

Red damage: 39 - Overall Damage: 58

----------------------------------------------------

i tried to do her Renda combos, but i wan't able to remember how the combo was (i tested cr.lp, s.lp EX roll)

i tried different times but the EX at the end just don't want to link, maybe because i'm not good with the pad or maybe is the infamous input lag but i just can't link that EX

a different story for the ES, that attack link perfectly and here's the damage i got:

c.lp,s.lp, ES roll

Red Damage: 34 - Overall Damage: 53

In conclusion: the ES roll is the best choice for hitconfirm and finish your combos, but would be nice if someone can link the EX attack and post the damage

[Kyle]

I have spent time playing/researching Felicias dashing attack combos. Here's my educated 2cents.

My earlier post is wrong. Felicia cannot cancel her dash recovery. However, there are workarounds and a trick to eliminate dash feint recovery.

Which combo you do is dependent on which distance you start the dash.

Max range is best with mk. Long dash and press d.mk just before you land. Felicia should land during the active frames and have enough hit stun/blockstun to continue combo/pressure w/ lp or mp.

Just outside max range, the best answer is d.mp. Once again, land during the active frames and you are covered either way. This should be a 2hit d.mp which can link into lp's, mp's or buckler/ES buckler.

Last range is mid-range or up close, but not belly to belly. This is going to require the Feint Cancel technique.

66, 4, d.mk

You have to input d.mk just a few frames after the feint begins. Really, you are kara canceling the feint startup into d.mk. Because of the kara, you keep the downward trajectory, but the game doesn't register you did the feint and the additional landing frames are not added. This is instant recovery after you land. Link into anything.

[Kyle]

Lastly, to comment on TOTAL damage of ES buckler vs Super Buckler:

Super allows the ToyTouch & ESToyTouch follow up. The ES Buckler does not. The combo into Super has a much higher total damage potential & a better okizeme because of ToyTouch.

Anyone confirm?

[Skankin Garbage]

It might have higher damage potential, but how easy is it to land, compared to combos into ES? Since the typical ES Combo is (some jump-in) \/ C.Lp, C.Mp XX ES Rolling Buckler, it's much easier to hit-confirm. You also can't do that link and combo into EX; C.Lp, C.Mp XX Dancing Flash does not work.

[Ciccio]

The Jump to ES roll hitcomfirm is the easiest ES combo in my opinion, is even easier than Cr.lp, cr.mp to link , you just need the right time to strike (usually in corner), but is also effective when you know your opponent will try to tech hit (air resets, wakeup)

and you can link the EX too, but is not worth it cause the lower damage

@Kyle: you're wrong, both attack (ES and EX) allow you to toy touch, and you can also do lp.catspike to command throw on enemy wakeup

you can't toytouch only if you strike in the corner cause you don't have time to step back, but allow you to a do Neutral jump to Command grab

[Skankin Garbage]

If less attacks are easier to hit-confirm, I think you might not understand what "hit-confirming" really is. To clarify, hit-confirming is literally confirming that the beginning of your combo connected without blocking, allowing you to safely continue the rest of your combo without wasting meter, leaving yourself in an unsafe position, getting Alpha-Countered, etc. It goes without saying that the more hits you have to hit-confirm the second half of the combo, the better the hit-confirm is.

To use a different game as an example, this is why in Street Fighter 3: 3rd Strike, Chun-Li's C.Mk xx SA2 is so powerful. It's not simply the fact that she can combo a stray low into a super (otherwise Elena would be top tier also). It's the fact that the window for canceling the C.Mk is so long, that you can do the move, buffer 236236, check and see if the C.Mk connected, think about what you wanna eat for lunch, and then press K to start the SA2.

The meta-game for hit-confirming is slightly different in VS with the prevalence of Guard Cancels, however; you want to hit-confirm with as short of an opener as you need, and you would want to use as safe of a move as possible. This is why Felicia's ability to link things off of her jab make for excellent hit-confirms. You can see some videos of Orecom (or Orekon, whatever), one of the best Felicia players in the world, do [C.Lp, C.Lk -> C.Mk -> C.Hk] when he could just do [C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mk -> C.Hk]. The fact of the matter is, that link is really important for someone like Felicia who relies on chain combos to do the bulk of her damage; unlike, say, Talbain, Morrigan, Rikuo, etc. people who have one particular attack that is the main goal of their offense.

[Ciccio]

So i was thinking a thing for an other :/

my experience in fighting game in general is very poor, i play only Vsav because i started with this game 10 months ago on ggpo,so my FG vocabular is pretty poor

Anyway:i use the Orekon combo too [cr.lk cr.lk cr.mk (i use cr.mp the damage is the same but the range is not) cr.hk] and after that i try tro pressure my opponent with a command throw attempt or a dash attack

there are any other way to do a good pressure after that?

Oh and: i keep failing to start Dark force pressure, i activate it when the enemy is on the ground, but i get hit or throwed all the times loosing the opportunity and getting punished very hard (most of the times by loosing the match)

do you guys have any tips for start a good DF pressure?

EDIT: just for let you guys know: in the first page the links:

Wiki - Special moves

Wiki - Ground combos

Wiki - Dash combos

Wiki - Jump-in combos

are broken, the site does not exist anymore

[Ciccio]

I don't know if anyone else noticed this,if not is probably because is useless but:

last day i learned the Felicia renda combo (that one in the renda tutorial) and i tested the overall damage, but then something weird happened

if i start with the 2 rapid Stand Close pokes and then do the combo [jlp-jlk-jmp-jhp- land cr.mp- EX ] the damage is different all the times:

18 hit combo=

Red damage: 44 - White Damage 74

Red damage: 41 - White Damage 72

Red damage: 42 - White Damage 73

here's the result by starting the combo without the 2 rapid stand close pokes:

16 hit combo=

Red damage: 44 - White Damage 74

i don't get any random damage just this one, i really don't know why

Just for being sure i tested these combos with the Dark Force too

, and again: if i start the combo with the 2 rapid stand close pokes the damage is different all the times

18 hit dark Force combo (no rapid pokes startup)=

Red damage: 46 - White Damage 76

As you see, even if i get more hits thanks to the helper the damage is still 44-74 but sometimes i get 45-75 so: 4+ hits = 1 damage point...but again: i do more damage by not using those 2 rapid pokes but why?.

is because the damage in general is reduced after 15+ hits?

i tested this on psp and ps2 version

[Kyle]

I had some ideas for Felicia UB's. After testing, it did not work. But I did find something awesome. =D

1. Headstand while Kitty helper hits. I had to activate Dark force & whiff a far standing lk then 9jump to opponents head. I managed to get into Headstand before kitty helper connected, but the opponent could block during this scenario.

2. Clingy Kitty (6Taunt) while kitty helper hits. I had to 8jump w/ an attack than do clingy as soon as possible. The opponent is Invincible during this entire animation. Helpers does not connect.

3. There's a sweet spot where you can continuously go from the headstand to the wall cling to the headstand. Spacing is depending on opponent, but LeiLei all the way in the corner is working scenario. Looks funny. DJ cat is scratching.

4. While Sasquatch & Victor are in the corner. Felicia can pull them out and force a crossup into a super. =) You have to activate headstand and drop yourself into the corner. You have ativate j.lk before the wall cling activates. This is FAST, should double strum j.lk for consistency. The J.lk crosses up and and you can land into cl.lp, renda lp xx Super.

Taunt does not activate helper.

Negative edge does not activate helper.

[Ciccio]

intresting i'll try the option 4 for being sure

and MAYBE this can work against crouched bulleta and q-bee (most of the times you get a crossup against them after a dash attack)

[Kyle]

You cannot activate headstand while opponent is crouching. But, your jumpin will punish their crouch anyways.

[Ciccio]

i tried that combo and i recorded it, plus i tried to do more headhop combos like that, this is the result

[Ciccio]

I have an update: i found you can do the crossup combo against sasquatch even without using the Head Ride by using a late j.lk ,j.lp or j,mk

you can crossup sasquatch with j.hp too but the timing is harder

[omegaryuji]

EDIT: just for let you guys know: in the first page the links:

Wiki - Special moves

Wiki - Ground combos

Wiki - Dash combos

Wiki - Jump-in combos

are broken, the site does not exist anymore

Updated. Thanks for pointing that out.

[jedpossum]

Head ride does a lot more sure this is some gimmick stuff, but should be noted.

[Ciccio]

OK i was waiting Kyle Wattula to test this because he was searching for a Felicia unblockable but he is missing for such a long time that i tried with an other friend.

i did found a felicia unblockable, it works on ps2 and original arcade port but it didn't work on Vsav2-Vhunt2 and Darkstalkers on psp

is based on Bulleta's unblockable that if you use j.hk when your opponent is blocking high he will not be able to block down cause the blockstop

it works in the same way, you activate DF,whiff a jab to make the kitty jump on your enemy and then you jump toward your enemy ,land and hit down while he is blocking the kitty, this will be unblockable

but this does not work all the times, you need to be fast enough to land in front of him and hit before he will able to block down ( you must not use the headride or you'll fail) also i don't know when use it in a real match, is almost impossible

i tried to record him during a ggpo match, is a lot harder cause the imput lag , but maybe this video can help

again i don't know how use it in a real match but now we know that Felicia have an unblockable

[Ewickify]

http://www.mediafire.com/?fed3h24xhnc2ceg

Re-uploaded Magman's felicia guide, since the old Megaupload link is destroyed now.