Tong Report post Posted August 3, 2011 What is this? From internet: "A frame trap is a sequence of moves where the first move's frame advantage (or disadvantage) plus the startup frames (not counting the first active frame) for the follow-up move creates a window (the frame trap) where the opponent, even if they perform a move to react, will be stuffed (or even counterhit) because the active frames of their move will not come out before the active frames of the second move of the frame trap." Thats the general concept for most, if not all, fighting games. I shall not waste time, I will put these for leechers who just want to memorize and spam online. These are all grounded, stringed traps for Ragna. 1 Frame traps 5A/2A> 2C, 3C 5B/2C> 5D 2 Frame traps 5A/2A> 5C 5A> 6A 2B > Hell's Fang 5B/2C> 2D 3 Frame traps N/A 4 Frame traps 5A/2A> Hell's Fang 2B> 5D 2C> 6C 5C/6B/6C> 6D(BK) 1~4 frame gaps are preffered, since within this range 99% of 5A/2As will lose to these. Its perfect for people who like to mash jabs in pressure, these will cut them off right away. Explanation(boring stuff) Using the gdlk framedata I could find these precise values.Taking as an example 2A 2C 2A is a level 1 move, that results in 11 blockstun frames. Instant Blocking is not taken in account, for awhile. 2C has 12 startup frames, meaning it hits in the 12th one. This means, the opponent is free to do anything as soon 2A's blockstun ends, but at same time, he's going to be hit on the same frame. Blockstun(first move) - Startup = Frame Advantage 11 - 12 = -1 Frame Adv. Actually, a disvantage. By finding Attack Levels, and their respective blockstuns, and startups for all moves in Ragna's framedata it is possible to obtain every Frame Adv. in strings and ,at same time, the fabled Frametraps. Level 1 / 11 Blockstun 5A, 2A, j.A, Level 2 / 13 Blockstun 2B, j.B Level 3 / 16 Blockstun 5B, 2C, 6A, j.C, j.D Level 4 / 18 Blockstun 5C, 6B, 6C, 3C, 5D(1), All Special moves Level 5 / 20 Blockstun 5D(2), 2D, 6D, Black Onslaught Remember that we need 1~4 frames gaps, this can be done by finding moves with, 12~15, 14~17, 17~20, 19~22, 21~24 Startup frames for their respective level moves. Which are: 12~15: 5C, 2C, 6A, 3C, Hell's Fang 14~17: 5D, Hell's Fang 17~20: 6C, 5D, 2D, Gauntlet Hades 19~22: 6C, 6D(BK), Gauntlet Hades 21~24: 6B, 6D(BK) Crossed this values blablabla and found the said traps. But that's not it, traps are not limited to Gattling/Special Cancels. Some moves like Deadspike leave you at +3 frame advantage. You can do your stuff before your opponent, frame traps are however all about apparent disvantage... Something can be done, as stated by LuminAbyss: Originally posted in... "Deadspike > 5A/2A pressure resetter is good on when the characters don't have fifty meter (since with meter, everyone has reversal supers or CAs) 214D > 5A provides a 2-frame window for the opponent to do something 214D > 2A provides a 4-frame window for the opponent to do something Note that Deadspike > 5A only works on standing opponents, with the exception of Carl and Platinum, whose midget ass hitboxes will cause the 5A to whiff. Completely Safe On: -Lambda -Platinum (without the bat) -Valkenhayn -Litchi (staffless) -Taokaka -Arakune -Hazama The following characters you can use it on, but only if you've really scared them into not trying to disrespect your pressure, otherwise, they can pretty much say "No" to it, so you have to be careful. People Who Can Disrespect it: -Ragna (Inferno Divider) -Jin (C DP and D-DP) -Noel (All of her drives) -Litchi (DP with staff) -Bang (His drives except for 2D) -Platinum (with bat) -Mu-12 (Origins A.K.A 623C) -Rachel (Cat Chair) -Carl (Vivace A/B) -Tsubaki (A and D DP) -Hakumen (All of his counters except 5D) -Tager (360A) -Makoto (Her DP) REMEMBER: Everyone has a way out with fifty meter, so watch your opponent's meter when using this frame-trap. You can always use the Deadspike to attempt to bait these things out, since they're all easy to punish on whiff. If I have any of these wrong, please point it out. I just thought I'd share this, since I like to use it myself to keep people in the corner, and is amazingly useful in many match ups." I believe this was posted with pressure in mind, but should work as a trap as well. Remember, even 1 frame graps CAN be punished by many many things. IB'ed stuff is seriously dangerous to you, however I would like to mention gdlk 2A 2C. It is hard to reversal from and 2C recovers fast enough to save you from most reversals, not to mention, if the opponent messes up he will get Fatal Countered. 2A is very hard to IB if used correctly. Remember, 2A 2C is just too good, both as a frametrap and combo starter. Notes -Tight and safe strings like 5B 5C can be delayed to create a gap. -Not every "fishing" results in Counter, watch for it. -Some IB'ed stuff will become a trap, that previously wasnt. -If you wish to test or figure out more strings, set the Training Dummy to Block only the First hit For awhile, I think it's better to not talk about what can punish those gaps, just too many too mention here. That's it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HolyOrderChipp Report post Posted August 7, 2011 Nice! I am gonna use these incessantly, especially the Dead Spike dash 5A/2A thing. That is just too sick. Lessee... Lambda, you don't happen to have any Heat, do you? No? Good. All your primers, they belong to meeee~! (Now the ball is in my regular opponent's court to find something to do to this. Which probably means letting me push myself out of range because I don't have him in the corner. But hey, that's what longer dashes are for. Whee, mindgames!) Edit: Dead Spike for frame advantage is the greatest shit ever. Also Belial Edge for frame advantage. God I love these frame traps. But it's still hard to hit my opponents with 2C. Maybe my Tsubaki player friend will fall for 5A/2A > 2C... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
