[P4A] Elizabeth Self Improvement and Critique Thread

[Kiba]

Post videos of yourself playing so we can give you pointers, tips and advice on how you can level your play up.

[mMarikom]

I'm kinda looking for a general GOOD liz player to sort of show me the ropes of liz...she feels a lot heavier than I thought and I'm kind of struggling just doing some of her basic combos (not an amateur to fighters in the slightest just to Liz)

any help would be appreciated

[Kiba]

Try going in the archive and watching Shadow and/or Kaqn. I believe they're a good start. The players in the current video thread are more advanced than them.

[Elochai]

I suppose I'll be the first to post videos of myself playing. Here are three matches against Akihiko players. (1) (2) (3)

[Kiba]

You need to be very careful with using SB.Agi at mid range, because it's much easier to get you this way. Players could dash then quick escape through the flames and score a full combo on you, or in Aki's case he could just box you in the face. In fact, you probably shouldn't be using it at that range at all.

Seeing you get hit out of 5B > Sweep is lol.

I think should be a little careful with your R-Action use, and I also feel that there are times where you could optimise your corner combos. For example, against aBL4CKST4Ra part 2, at 2:06, instead of ending with B.Bufu > JC, you could do B.Bufu > 2C > SB.Zio and get your paralysis. There were points were you could've won/won quicker against Aki had you used the more optimal combos, but since he had a burst I suspected that you may have wanted to bait them.

While 5C(2) > 5D resets are cool sometimes, I don't think you should grow to get accustomed to this because in the long run I feel they'll hurt you more than work in your favour.

[Elochai]

After 5C, aren't the only options 2C or 5D? I suppose I would rather not throw out 2C because for some reason, I think it's as easily disrespected as 5D, and at least with 5D, I can get like 2k midscreen.

I sometimes get myself mixed up on corner combos, lol. But I'll practice, surely. Thanks.

[Kiba]

After 5C(2) on hit you have two combo followup options. You can go for A.Zio, or JC, JC being the preferred option. With JC ender you can go for an air dash and go for JB > Pressure if necessary.

NP.

[malakyoma]

Here's a link to me playing a few matches online. theres a timeline in the description if you want to skip to a certain match. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxK3uojGyQ8

Any advice is very much so appreciated.

[Kiba]

Against Akihiko:

Nice, you were good. The Akihiko only went for AOA mixup during kill rush stuff which I figured was easy for you to get out of.

Against Naoto:

At 3:13 you could've followed up from SB.Zio with either 5C or 5B. Everything else was fine.

Against Kanji:

Tis all good.

Against Naoto (2):

I don't think 2A > 5C links on normal hit, but I believe it does on FC, so instead you should use 2A > 5B > 5C. I may be wrong on this.

Against Akihiko (2):

All good.

Against Labrys:

Remember against Labrys you only need to hold 2 during D.Garu.

Against Chie:

You relied on the F-Action a little more than usual in this match compared to the others and it seemed to really work against you rather than for you.

Against Aigis:

You need to be a little more careful about the way you use Thanatos in this matchup because it's very easy for Aigis to persona break you since she has quite some control with bullets. That includes using 2C at the beginning of the match or using JC.

Against Yu:

It's fine.

Against Yosuke:

That match was way too random but that wasn't your fault. ;/ The Yosuke only seemed to know auto combo so I was surprised they knew how to the IK unless that was mapped to an easier route.

Against Teddie:

You can't use thanatos the same way you do against the other characters here because Teddie has a lot of ways to hit it. The Bat being the most evident, so I think you be a lot more cautious. I think you should use Zio more when you're far.

Overall:

• Your Thanatos pressure seems to be the same - 5C(2), and then a slight delay into something. You should mix it up a little more like 5C(1) > 5D, or 5C(2) > 2C (input 2C just before the second 5C hit comes out). If you keep that same stuff up you're bound to get persona broke pretty quickly once people get used to ya.
  
• Remember you have a free action after SB.Garu (air dash, JA, JB etc)
  
• Just out of curiousity why do you use JC air to air from a distance when you have JB and JD? I just think JB and JC are better options.
  
• I think you should use JB more to make it more awkward for your opponent to get in.
  

[malakyoma]

More recent gameplay. I won a local tournament on saturday, this is the grand finals:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94ZZE8KuPdY

Thanks for your advice.

[Kiba]

You're good. You're patient with the matchup and your Thanatos use is good. You are anti - airing him where necessary, but I think you could be careful with 5C(2) > Stuff on block though since Naoto's R-action seems to eat anything you throw at her, but at the same time you could try doing just 5C(2) and waiting. It may cost you a persona life but in that case, that player seems to resort to R-Action each time you used it. You could score some nice 5C(2) CHs. (Actually you started to do this near the end so that's good!)

Each time you burst or use a successful R-action, be careful with attacking from afar (SB.Agi/Zio), because Naoto can counter that with her R-Action for free. In one of those moments the player even used the super against you.

I also think you should try mixing in some normal throws, especially when you have Naoto in the corner.

Nice, and you're welcome.

[TD]

here's some matches of me on freesn, using the lethal elevator attendant. gawk at my ability to steer the elevator in the wrong direction! be amazed at my lack of manners! and lastly, please watch your step as you get off.

vs ciddypoo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3MeSgJxjhE&list=UUvnyPCVTaSxdB76NY5x5MYw&index=19&feature=plcp

first match was alright, we were feeling each other out and stuff. as you guys can see i'm overly turtley but turtling is a great pace setter. l prety much yomi'd the match with zio mixups, l played him before so l kinda went in prepared. so, yomi or just downloading? who. knows.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kq1IUCiYs5A&list=UUvnyPCVTaSxdB76NY5x5MYw&index=20&feature=plcp

watch us both go batshit crazy. l...l cant even give explanations for the shit l did this game, l barely know myself! go ahead and laugh because l sure did. hard, too.

comment/critique/love/hate, don't hold your tongue, speak and l shall listen! thanks all for watching, ciddypoo for uploading and ggs.

[Kiba]

I can't comment. Zio seemed to be working a lot for you in match 2/3, but you didn't use it so much in match 3/3. I think you could've used it a little more, but as you said you've played him before so you're a better judge as to whether it'll be a good idea or not.

Nice to see you play.

[TD]

oy, l flip-flopped the videos! yeah the top is on the bottom and vice versa.

thanks kiba. l'm glad zio was able to put in so much work, because it's hell blocking yukiko for long periods of time (not particularly hard to block, but it's like naoto almost, you have to wait for specific openings which sometimes puts me at the mercy of other attacks). being patient is like liz 101 because these matchups can get pretty crazy.

[jo-p]

Me playing against FC Chris G tonight at Big Two.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpfVicrgTVw

tips, advice and criticism is appreciated! Just dont be too rough =p

[TD]

two things. one, the characters are mixed up (you're playing mitsuru not chris). not to be a nazi but l thought it should be brought to your attention. two, this is the wrong thread. as you're playing mitsuru, you need other people who play mitsuru (more than us) to critique you for better accuracy.

the right thread for that would be here: http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?14924-Mitsuru-Kirijo-Critique-Thread/page2

lt'd be easier to help if say... you played liz and chrisG played mitsuru, but that's not the case.

[jo-p]

lt'd be easier to help if say... you played liz and chrisG played mitsuru, but that's not the case.

nope TD you've got it mistaken. Chris dropped Liz and now plays Mitsuru. I'm the one playing Liz in this video. Lol i'm not THAT crazy.

[TD]

oh shit really!? wth... when did this happen? l guess it was only a matter of time lol. my bad btw. that totally mind fucked me.

ok i'll review it later on today after l get some shuteye.

[Kiba]

Doesn't surprise me that ChrisG changed.

At 1:30 Mitsuru used her r-action annd you blocked it, but you backdashed instead of punishing it (She only had 41 SP so she couldn't super cancel either). That was your opportunity to land at least 5k.

Be careful with 5C(2) > stuff against Mitsuru. She can coup through them for free breaking Thanatos and scoring a CH on you. Then again, you should be careful with using 5C in this MU because Mitsuru can coup Thanatos for free.

Last round - Man I feel for you ;/ Unlucky you actually nearly had him.

[jo-p]

Yeah I was pretty disappointed with the way it went down, felt like I could've beaten him ya know? Asides from the all the dropped combos though haha, how do u guys think I played?

[TD]

l saw it and l agree with kiba, mostly. 5c was getting you punished often. it's particularly bad vs mitsuru.

your pressure could use some touching up. after 2b, delay the j.b so that it'll connect. you were doing it too early and mitsuru can punish that hard. delay j.b isn't gapless either, so mix it up between 2b delay j.b, 2b delay jump, 2b OMC j.a/land 2a/land throw for mixup. instead of 5c in pressure, opt for stagger strings like 5a 2aa, safe strings and crossups like 5aa IAD air turn j.b to keep your strings fresh. use 5d during random points in your pressure so your foe doesn't block all day.

other than that l feel you did pretty well, as far as this matchup goes.

[Kiba]

I also feel that you did pretty well.

Keep at it.

[Kane]

Gonna add something really basic, but I noticed happen a couple times. VS Mitsuru, there absolutely no reason why you shouldn't be constantly blocking low when she is on the ground. It seems a couple times you were only blocking high and getting hit by 2AB. When being pressured by Mitsuru just block low.

[xlolxlolx]

only problem is that you 5b>5c too much so its really predictable and youre not doing anything like 5c(1)>rc>j.d/214a/b/ex

tbh chrisg's mitsuru looks pretty bad imo

[cash money]

5c(1)>rc>j.d/214a/b/ex

How does this work? Whenever I rc 5c(1), thanatos will still do the second 5c liz will just be able to move around during it.