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zeth07

[CP] Azrael - Gameplay Discussion v.2 (Discuss Videos/Combos/Questions/etc.)

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So if you Azrael players are cool with it, I'm trying to look at how Azrael wants to basically steamroll matches cause this is seriously one of the more harder matches for me to play cause it feels like everything I IB or do anything against I'm constantly boxed in by his pressure and mix ups. So as Azrael players, what is it you guys are hoping your opponent to do and what you are hoping they don't do? Honestly when I fight this character its like the light at the end of he tunnel fades cause he has such strong normals and pressure that it feels like I have to play 2-3 times more harder to try and keep up with basically most aspects of him. Granted I know some characters like Ragna can keep him honest if played right but as I said, I'd like to understand how Azrael players look at the match, the local player that's been bodying me doesn't have much advise he thinks he can give me aside from the obvious "keep him out" game plan. So I really would appreciate and kind of information I can get for developing a game plan against him. 

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Generally what Azrael wants to do is get in as close as possible, but his approach methods are kinda finicky. So what you need to do is frustrate Azraels a lot, the catch is you have to play a really solid footsie game if you want to do that. Get an idea of how far Dash TK Gustaf reaches, how far his airdash is, how far his normals reach for the speed they have and so on. What you want to do is then dance around in those ranges and bait them(jump the Gustaf etc) or react to Airdash/6C. 5C does have range, but it is fairly slow, compared to say, Ragna 5B. You need to be on point with anti-airs as well. Eventually you'll be backed into a corner or you'll mess up along the way since mistakes will happen but in the end it's all about who makes more mistakes. Think of it as playing footsies with a Tager that has predictable bursts of mobility.

If he does get in on you, realize that his pressure, while scary, has a lot of holes in them and is really short. There's no way Azrael can safely go into a mixup and if you do block an overhead/low then his pressure ends(unless he's in OD, but people tend to save for Bursts anyway). If you don't want to risk a blocked DP then you can just mash anytime you think he's going for a mixup, however you might fall for Gustaf/Rekka frame traps that way. In the end it's kinda like Rock Paper Scissors.

Don't just stick to IB, barrier(and even better, instant barrier) pushes him out of your face and makes typical blockstrings of his whiff. What you need to know as well is that other than 2A>5A and X>Gustaf/Rekka, you can DP through them even without IB.

 

Don't wake up the same way all the time if you're knocked down, his oki forces him to guess to get anything unless you're in the corner, other than TCL knockdowns with Dash TK Sentinel oki. He has pretty much almost no setplay either. Other than that, find out how to punish his backdash and option select his dp/backdash in situations.

In the end, you have to outplay Azrael in neutral, since that is his weakest point.

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So while I'm at it still, so in the situations when he does get in and starts to get tricky with forward dash cross ups, just how safe or unsafe is it to do something like that cause I never seem to be able to do anything against it.

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Dash cross ups can always be beaten by mashing. A lot of people do 4A+B+C/1A+B+C when you think he's going to do it(requires some timing), gets beaten by Dash cross up jump however. If I'm not mistaken 1A+B+C is better imo since it'll come out as 2A instead of throw, which will also stuff the jump. What happens is that if he doesn't cross up you'll break throws/barrier, if he does cross up it would throw/2A him out. If you really intend on calling it out you can also input dp the other way.

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So what does 4A+B+C OS? So as far as timing 1A+B+C goes, should I be timing it as he dashes? I'm just trying to get an idea how generally when it needs to be done before I start putting in lab work cause this is really good info I'm getting.

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Pretty much the same things as 1A+B+C, just that like I've said, it probably gets beaten by dash cross up jump. Upside I suppose is you get a throw if he does anything else, which probably does more than a 2A starter if you manage to hit confirm off of it.

I'm not too sure when you should be inputting it but it should be pretty much as he dashes, since he can't dash cancel out of anything except 6B(though delayed and no one uses 6B anyway, at least not in pressure).

 

I think 4A+B+C/1A+B+C gets beaten by Dash Cross Up TK Sentinel, but you can just 5A/block in time anyway in the case of the latter.

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Welp time to pack it up and move back to finland. So no more early access info for you guys anymore sadly. I'll continue to stalk dogura and tochigin though so i'll try to get info from then as the need rises. Also going to buy a streaming setup so look forward to that! 

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I missed all of Arc Revo so I'm really itching to see Dogura running it back all the way too lol There's a video of the Grand Finals on nicovideos but seemingly no vids of the rest of the tourney. Hard to search anyway with no ability to moonspeak.

 

Anyway, found a weird thing with Valiant, you guys probably have seen this happen the odd occasional times.

 

Typically we would do [uW] 5B>2C>2B>TC>236D... but if you do [uW] 5B>2C>2B>TCL(fastest)>RC>236D(slight charge/delay required maybe)...

it would send your opponent flying out of the corner. You can still chase them though your inputs are reversed somewhat(press 6 to chase even though they're going left)

 

The funny thing is if you chase immediately you go under them and because you travel faster, you pass through them, unless it's Tager since he's too big I guess. If you hit them they go flying back into the corner you came from. Basically it's just a different entry to Love Phantom as you can go right into that too. Works with Hornet as well though you have to charge it longer and the different heights you hit them make the flight path vary a little. However it's more lenient than the Valiant version as I can only really replicate it with 2B>TCL>RC>236D with Valiant but I can do 5B>ODC>2C>3D>TCL(fastest)(no delay in between 3D and TCL)>RC>214D>... for Hornet.

 

Doubt it's practical for the damage it does and the resources you use but if you wanna finish them in style;

[70% hp maybe?] [uW] 5BB>ODC>2C>2B>TCL>RC>236D>6*(fly out)>6C(hit them back the other way)>6*j.C>jc j.D>BHW(direction might change)

6C seems to whiff on characters like Jin though.

 

There's also a gimmick you can do where you hit them back and just chase them, you end up right next to them though you're the one that's in the corner. You can also delay chase so you don't cross under them(though this would end up somewhere midscreen) and you can probably manipulate where you end by inputting 5A/2A in both cases. Results in a very gimmicky cross up reset. However this all goes down the drain if they air tech in a direction, only neutral air tech ends up with them right next to you. Still, it might work since it probably would surprise whoever you are playing with the first time they see it but I wouldn't really recommend it.
 

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Hey everyone! I've been lurking for a while and messaged rath about some stuff and I have decided to come out and start contributing some stuff I have found out. First I had been experimenting with 22C. I have experimented with some things to try and figure out when this move can be used and this is what I found. I apologize if this has already been found out, but for anyone that did not know. I have found out that this move can usually be done when the opponent is considered downed/airborne/launched. For example it can be done after 5B+C>6A, 3C, 5B>2C>3/6D (using weakness), and combos that use CT just to name a few. I then saw a combo listed on the combo page as a bnb:

[both] and 25% heat

5A>5B>2C>3D>CT>Valiant>{6>5C}*3>6A>6D

I decided to experiment with this combo and realized that you can delay the 5C's after the valiant slightly to get a bit better carry if you need it and add a 214C to extend the combo a bit more for more damage. That route seemed a bit finicky so I kept playing with it and realized I could 22C during the valiant charger and it did a bit less damage, but it was a lot more consistent. So the new combo I was working with was:

[both] and 25% heat

5A>5B>2C>3D>CT>Valiant>{6>5C}*3>22C/214C>6A>6D/J.2D

The timing is pretty strict, but I feel like it is worth it as this could possibly lead to new valiant routes. I am still experimenting with this and would love to hear others thoughts and ideas on this. Side note, when doing this combo some strange things can happen when you do sentinel dump (both versions)>6A. It sometimes causes wall stick like normal and other times you will side switch and the opponent will just be stuck floating in the air or you can sometimes make them fly to the other corner. Still haven't quite figured this one out.

Last thing I have recently been experimenting with is Scud Punishment/OD Scud. I have read before that it doesn't seem to be worth the meter/damage because there are combos that end up with both weaknesses on the opponent for no meter. I definitely agreed with that until I saw a combo video posted the other day when someone was asking about AZ's OD damage potential. I agree scud is more of a scare tactic/can help clutch out situations, but after watching that combo video that was posted I was baffled seeing that you can combo with it and I thought about the possibilities that could come from that. The combo that I saw and started messing with was:

CR FC 5C>6C>2B>cOD>5C>OD Scud>5B>3C>3D>etc.

I labbed it for a bit and saw that you can link 5B off OD scud in this situation. I tried it on a few other characters and saw that it was not Litchi specific. I tried a few more characters and it can also be done on Izayoi and Nu-13. I need a bit more confirmation on other characters. Here is all that I have tested:

-CR FC 5C>6C>2B>cOD>5C>Scud>5B
-CR FC 5C>cOD>Scud>5B
-CR FC 6C>2B>cOD>5C>Scud>5B
-CR CH OD Scud>5B
-FC 5C>cOD>Scud>5B
-FC 6C>2B>cOD>5BB>Scud>5B

I am very curious to see what can possibly be done with this since tagging someone with a FC 5C isn't super situational and if you don't have both weakpoints on the opponent you then get both as well as a possible OD combo which really hurts. I however could not link the 5B into 3C like it was in the video without it being blue beat. I am unsure of if this is a change from 1.0 or if my execution is off since I was super focused on getting the 5B link. Would love to have some others test this with me and help me confirm what can be done. Hope this is helpful to you all!

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I missed all of Arc Revo so I'm really itching to see Dogura running it back all the way too lol There's a video of the Grand Finals on nicovideos but seemingly no vids of the rest of the tourney. Hard to search anyway with no ability to moonspeak.

 

Anyway, found a weird thing with Valiant, you guys probably have seen this happen the odd occasional times.

 

Typically we would do [uW] 5B>2C>2B>TC>236D... but if you do [uW] 5B>2C>2B>TCL(fastest)>RC>236D(slight charge/delay required maybe)...

it would send your opponent flying out of the corner. You can still chase them though your inputs are reversed somewhat(press 6 to chase even though they're going left)

 

The funny thing is if you chase immediately you go under them and because you travel faster, you pass through them, unless it's Tager since he's too big I guess. If you hit them they go flying back into the corner you came from. Basically it's just a different entry to Love Phantom as you can go right into that too. Works with Hornet as well though you have to charge it longer and the different heights you hit them make the flight path vary a little. However it's more lenient than the Valiant version as I can only really replicate it with 2B>TCL>RC>236D with Valiant but I can do 5B>ODC>2C>3D>TCL(fastest)(no delay in between 3D and TCL)>RC>214D>... for Hornet.

 

Doubt it's practical for the damage it does and the resources you use but if you wanna finish them in style;

[70% hp maybe?] [uW] 5BB>ODC>2C>2B>TCL>RC>236D>6*(fly out)>6C(hit them back the other way)>6*j.C>jc j.D>BHW(direction might change)

6C seems to whiff on characters like Jin though.

 

There's also a gimmick you can do where you hit them back and just chase them, you end up right next to them though you're the one that's in the corner. You can also delay chase so you don't cross under them(though this would end up somewhere midscreen) and you can probably manipulate where you end by inputting 5A/2A in both cases. Results in a very gimmicky cross up reset. However this all goes down the drain if they air tech in a direction, only neutral air tech ends up with them right next to you. Still, it might work since it probably would surprise whoever you are playing with the first time they see it but I wouldn't really recommend it.

 

Ah, I was wondering why this was a thing.

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Oh when will someone upload Dogura matches from Revo? So much testosterone.

@Kinkuli: city?

I will be living in jyväskylä. If you are around helsinki area then, like i said way back, there's weeklies at youthcenter happi every thursday.

Also i might do match analysis stream of doguras arcrevo matches in near future. Or a learning stream dunno. Need to get life bavk in finland on track first!

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Hey guys, this is my first post, so sorry if this question was answered before (most likely was, but a quick search didn't find anything), but something caught my eye browsing through some combos here.

What's the real benefit of substituting 5C in Chaser combos with 6C into j.C? The only thing I see is that it wallsticks the opponent a little higher, so I guess it can lead to longer combos still involving launching/aerial? Will it make some combo routes that involve Chaser and TCL easier/possible at all?

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You can use it to get 2 weak points in one combo or just go for max damage. 5C loop works fullscreen while 6C variation is corner-only.

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Hey guys im trying to pick up azrael as my sub, im not sure if this is the right place to post this but i have a quick question: how do you do the starter > j.bc > j.d > rapid > falling j.c combos? for some reason the falling j.c never hits. what am i missing? thanks in advance!

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Hey guys im trying to pick up azrael as my sub, im not sure if this is the right place to post this but i have a quick question: how do you do the starter > j.bc > j.d > rapid > falling j.c combos? for some reason the falling j.c never hits. what am i missing? thanks in advance!

 

try doing late j.d to give them a little extra height. also i would recommend trying it in the corner first cause it's easier there than midscreen. also i would watch this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8R887tFvfc&list=UU4n3mpDrD-noB7uMkKSD00Q cause it is a really great teaching tool. let us know if u need anything else :)

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try doing late j.d to give them a little extra height. also i would recommend trying it in the corner first cause it's easier there than midscreen. also i would watch this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8R887tFvfc&list=UU4n3mpDrD-noB7uMkKSD00Q cause it is a really great teaching tool. let us know if u need anything else :)

ty for the extremely quick response, i think ive got it now! ^_^

 

 edit: another quick question, when should u use 214C (the sit down move) as oki? i know it can catch rolls, but the start up is really slow. so wut are some common knockdowns before using this move?

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ty for the extremely quick response, i think ive got it now! ^_^

 

 edit: another quick question, when should u use 214C (the sit down move) as oki? i know it can catch rolls, but the start up is really slow. so wut are some common knockdowns before using this move?

 

TLC 66 dump is pretty common and sometimes it will auto bait dp's. i learned that from watching dogura and like. the funny thing u can do thou is 5b dump. if u are really close to the opponent then the dump will actually cross them up and u get a free combo. nobody knows about this and it's pretty funny lol. but the reward is amazing especially with a week point or 50 meter (remember the jbc jd RC jc. yeah u can do this here) also dump is very plus and if u need the extra frames you can go for it. it also has auto guard and i have baited a burst with it b4 lol. this is just my take thou someone else may have something else to say.

 

also you can use dump in combos like 236d 6 5c 6 6c 6 jc 6b dump 3c 6a 2c 6d/5b BHS

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Hey is there going to be anymore loketest talk? I mean, I haven't heard about it in I don't know how long.

 

the last one there was nobody knows anything about really. i also know that mori said they wanted the game 2 b more fun. i want to talk more loketest but idk where to start. hopefully they  will release the full change list soon cause the game hits arcades in OCT

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Hey guys i'm not sure if this is the right place to ask but here goes : 

 

1)what is the most optimal combo u can do in midscreen off of raw [LW] 3D and raw [uW] 6D (i would like one non-CH combo and one CH combo for both)?

 

2) does forward throw > 6a > iad j.c >214D > 5a > TC > 236D work for every character?

 

Thanks in advance.

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Hey guys i'm not sure if this is the right place to ask but here goes : 

 

1)what is the most optimal combo u can do in midscreen off of raw [LW] 3D and raw [uW] 6D (i would like one non-CH combo and one CH combo for both)?

 

2) does forward throw > 6a > iad j.c >214D > 5a > TC > 236D work for every character?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

1. um what? okay ill try i guess. im just going to go with u started the combo off with 5b 2c okay.

 

[LW] 3D TLC 3D(midscreen) 5b aerial (if u hit the corner)

 

[uP] 6D TLC 3D(midscreen) 5b aerial (if u hit the corner)

 

yeah basically the same one's if ur asking if u hit them with a raw 6d/3d the same ones should work. i would check the combo thread to see.

 

HOWEVER IF U GOT A COUNTER AND HAVE NO WEAKPOINT THE FUN STARTS :)

 

CH 6d 2c 6d 236d 5b TLC 3D(midscreen) 5b aerial (if u hit the corner)

 

CH 3d 5b jbc j2 TLC 3D(midscreen) 5b aerial (if u hit the corner)

 

if u get a raw 6d/3d non counter hit and no weak point then ur combo ends there unless some situations that apply. here is an example that is my favorite combo with azeral

 

[LW] 5b jbc j2d 2c 6d RC 5a TC 236d [6  5c] *4 3c 6a 5d

 

2. yes it does. try doing late jc and try to get the 6a as high as possible after the throw. eventually u will get it. it gets very easy in time just keep at it.

 

1 was kind of confusing for me to answer but im not that smart lol. if u need anymore help check out the combo thread for stuff. this is just what i use and feel like i won't drop in an offline setting.

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