[CP] Makoto vs Azrael

[Dark Ranger88]

We both hit like tanks. Discuss the matchup here.

[Angry Guy of DE]

I personally don't like this matchup because attempting to do oki is very difficult because of his growler field and how good his backdash is.

Azrael has more range on the ground and things like 5B >B leave him at frame advantage which can get you bullied in the corner. At midrange Gustaf Buster (236A) aka The swipe will be used as it is safe on block (+ frames even?) and on counter hit can be followed up. Azrael's 6C which is the jump kick is +2 on block, similar to Bullet's 6C Azrael will go over lows but isn't as easy to 6A because of the horizontal reach on it.

In the air Azrael's j.B can cross up and his j.2C (The dive kick looking move) can catch you if you attempt to 6A too soon. Another thing to note is that the j.2C's hitbox is very weird and you can get crossed up and anti-airing it is very difficult as a result.

In terms of damage Azrael can equal you and exceed with any weakness applied. If you haven't played against Azrael much you need to low how to block his D moves as all of them are either overheads or lows:

5D : A double handed strike down. This hits overhead and with a weakness you will be put into a crumple state which allows a combo follow-up.

2D : A low boot to the shins. This is a low and with a weakness causes a hard knockdown which again allows a combo follow-up.

6D : A huge heel drop. This hits overhead and done along with 3D as a high / low mixup. Again with weakness causes ground bounce for combo follow-up.

3D : A Boot crushing stomp. This hits low and looks similar to 6D to startup. With weakness causes ground bounce.

Azrael's that try to use any D moves in a string will give up pressure as the moves are -2 for 6D and 3D and -4 for 5D and 2D. Backdash after a blocked D move is something to expect with a Gustaf buster to get back in and start pressure.

This matchup is difficult from my experience and is 4-6 at best because orb oki is not viable in this matchup.

[Wild Candy]

Azreal can be a little hard to deal with, but I feel like it's not the worst match up for Makoto.

Makoto is a lot more mobile then Azreal, and while her normals have a shorter range, most of them are a lot faster then Azreal's. Plus, we have it a little better then some characters because none of Makoto's normals have projectile properties like Rachel's 5B or Noel's 5C, and Corona Upper is actually fairly effective at escaping pressure in this match up.

You have enough rope to deal with Azreal, just don't hang yourself with it.

[Angry Guy of DE]

I will agree that its not her worst, but its one of those match-ups where you can't use the orb oki.

Micro-dash 2A and 5B can help make up the range against Azrael, I'll have to test IB'ing strings that attempt to do D moves and determine if 5A, Parry, or Corona Upper can be used to CH them and get a combo. Growler field is highly unsafe on block and is a full combo punish so the wake-up options he has is back dash or GF.

Provided if the wiki's data is accurate...Most of Azrael's normals (A and B at least) are not all that slow in comparison.

Makoto's startup vs Azrael's with some normals:

5A: 5 / 6

2A: 6 / 9

5B : 6 / 9

2B : 9 / 12

At Neutral Makoto can beat out Azrael with her normals, but be mindful of your reach and also after normals that leave him at frame advantage:

5B > B : +5 (Also a frame trap if delayed)

2A : +2 (Hits low)

6C : +2 (Push back can leave you in 5C range)

Gustaf Buster : +1

Playing very smart and simply out-fundamentaling the opponent is key to winning.

[Wild Candy]

Just tack on Corona Enders to corner combos, and the lack of Comet Cannon Oki shouldn't be a huge issue.

Also, SAVE YOUR BURST!

Your going to want it if he applies weakpoints on you. If he scores a combo with a weakpoint applied, he can a large chunk of heal away in one mere combo. (I'm not talking like a Makoto BnB, I'm thinking along the lines of Naoto SMP loop from P4A. And those combos could take up ALL of your health when done right!)

[Angry Guy of DE]

I think its possible to reach around 4K meterless with a basic starter in the corner if you opt to maximize damage and give up orb oki...its rather difficult and it pushes hitstun as far as it goes.

Its best to hold onto burst until you he uses up a weakpoint in combo as most combo can end with another weakpoint applied. Its similar to Bullet in that regard where the next combo is going to really hurt in comparison, although Azrael's is far more scary.

OD should only be used for guaranteed kill as you are only aiming to maximize damage from combos and doing 1.5~2K more is not worth not having a burst when he does a 4-5K weakness combo.

[Dark Ranger88]

The good thing about fighting Azrael is that you get multiple chances to block mixup before he can really do any damage. So don't feel tempted to jump out or try to do stuff on wakeup if you don't have any weaknesses applied (this often plays right into his hands and gives you weakpoints). Even if you can't block the mixup on reaction you have a 50/50 chance of him being minus on block and having to end his pressure or get 5/2A'd.

Also if you get him in the corner, you can do the 2A > (1)B option select on Growler field.

And for the love of Amaterasu...don't let him hit you with Black Hawk Stinger unblockables. If he does BHS when you have both weakpoints it becomes unblockable. Simply inputing Corona Upper, Particle Flare, or Parry during his superflash will counter him. However he may be able to use BHS after one of his normals to hit you while you are still stuck in blockstun. If this is possible then the only way out is to have 50 meter and counter assault before BHS hits you.

Edit: Found out that he CAN do BHS while you are in blockstun.

[Kcin]

And for the love of Amaterasu...don't let him hit you with Black Hawk Stinger unblockables. If he does BHS when you have both weakpoints it becomes unblockable. Simply inputing Corona Upper, Particle Flare, or Parry during his superflash will counter him. However he may be able to use BHS after one of his normals to hit you while you are still stuck in blockstun. If this is possible then the only way out is to have 50 meter and counter assault before BHS hits you.

It CAN be air barrier blocked if they're cocky enough to just do it outright.

If you're like me and horde your burst for OD clutch combacks, doing OD 5D should hit as an FC that you can convert to a full combo without the need to RC, giving you a comeback 6k+ with 100 meter and enough OD time.

[Dark Ranger88]

More about the BHS unblockable ... Some Azraels will combo into Scud Punishment at the very end of a combo, then try to reset you with BHS. This is a VERY difficult setup to counter for various reasons:

 

1.) Scud Punishment leaves you in a stagger state without knocking you down, meaning you have no invincibility when you tech and you can't roll / delay tech.

 

2.) BHS hits on the first frame after you recover from stagger, meaning you can't jump and have a very tiny input window to do reversals.

 

 

3.) Getting Blue Beat by BHS still adds on a ton of minimum damage.

 

4.) BHS seems to freeze your inputs. Preemptively inputing Corona Upper or Particle Flare during BHS's superflash does absolutely nothing. You'll just tech and get hit by BHS. You have to activate Corona or PF on the EXACT frame that BHS would hit you or they won't come out.

 

One strange thing is that OD WILL activate if triggered during BHS's superflash. The only surefire way to beat this setup, I've found, is to: Hold A during Scud Punishment so that you tech at the first available moment (You should see your tech flash right before he goes into BHS) > Activate OD at any point during his windup / superflash > Go into unburstable OD punish combo of your choice

 

 

TLDR; Save your burst if you know the Azrael player likes to do this setup, Then OD into kill combo.

 

Also if anyone knows why OD activates but nothing else does that'd be interesting to know.

[Kcin]

I did some testing so I tried holding A and 1 to see how long it took her to crouch and it took like 3ish+ frames for her to start crouching after the recovery. Its like being in a block stun state before truly being back to neutral, but since it IS neutral OD can still be activated.

OD seems to be the only way out for any character period, othewise the next best bet is to eat the minimum damage or hope they input BHS too slow.