Teach me mobility for Blazblue....

[spades111]

So my main game is Tekken and for 2D fighting I was into Marvel vs Capcom 3.

Both those games, when it came to pressure or zoning you would create space or close in with wave dashing. UMvC3 even had a convenient box dash system where you'd press 2 attack buttons at the same time which made it super easy to air dash at low heights

When it comes to moving around in Blazblue I feel lost. It seems like all that you can do is block punish or randomly counter hit people. Moving around is to dangerous against offensive players... I get hit out of everything I try

I'm sure I'm just playing the game wrong. I've played Blazblue before but not that seriously. I'm sticking with beginner characters, Ragna and Noel So I'd appreciate general tips on mobility or character specific ones (even if its not about Ragna or Noel).

[Zouf]

You can cancel your dash with the barrier : 66 > 4/1+AB

 

It will immediatly stop your dash and go into barrier guard (I believe this is a 0f startup)

 

You can not cancel an airdash into barrier. You need to wait till the end of the recover of the airdash to air barrier.

 

Also, Blazblue uses anti air moves (mostly 6A, 2C depending on the character) that have invulnerabilty frames on the upper body, and are air unblockable. So if you drop down on your opponent, you'll most likely get anti aired. You can use the double jump to bait an anti air to punish, or simply put the barrier again (Yes, the barrier is very important in blazblue)

[GrandAquila]

For Ragna I don't recommend that you try aerial approaches j.C is his best air normal and then there is inferno divider both have their uses but aren't truly remarkable. j.C can lead you into a combo on ground but a character like Izayoi will have no problem taking you out of the sky with her DP. For mobility try using Hell's Fang and Gauntlet Hades with follow ups to close in the latter is an overhead that can mixup when used properly. The main problem to me it sounds is that your moves are getting stuffed or you can't get in. Rely on Ragna's tools like 2D,GH,6C,6B during block strings to get in on your opponent.

As far as air dashes go the Instant air dash is a mandatory tool to have in your repertoire. To get it down you have to practice at it but it's not that difficult.

Hope I helped some also if you can think of any specific char giving you trouble ask about it I'm sure someone will help. But don't be afraid to check the wiki and matchups for your mains for info.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Tong]

While Hell's Fang may hit once a while it's extremely unsafe on whiff and good players will be able to punish you on block. I'm strongly against such unsafe acts, so use Ragna's most safe and reliable footsies/neutral tools such as 5B, 2B, and 2D. Learn his chains as well.

j.C is good if used together with Airdashes as it can beat many air to air and air to ground moves, but, obviously, don't get too predicable with it or you're gonna eat an Anti air. Dont forget also to chain into j.D.

Inferno Divider (use the C version) is a really good reversal, one of the best in the game, and can shut down alot of moves and it make your opponent think twice before attacking you. But it's also very unsafe, so make sure you have some spare heat (50) in case they block.

[spades111]

ah thanks for the info guys. To follow up I have some more questions, most aren't realted related to mobility this time.... but why spam new topics, right?

 

1. How do I know if I'm properly instant air dashing? In UMvC3 its pretty easy to tell as you can see how low to the ground you are. I'm just wondering exactly what a perfect instant air dash looks like in this game (youtube didn't help) Also I'm using a dualshock 3 controller so it would be great if you have input tips specific to that.

 

2. It seems like some characters normals are all safe. you have to block forever until they use an unsafe move or they let up and you have a chance to attack again. Is that the case? I feel like that's exactly why I keep getting snuffed whenever I press a button. I keep telling myself it's online lag, otherwise there's no reason for my 5As to lose to slower normals after I've properly blocked

 

3. Did they change command input driority in this game? For dragon punch inputs I always use f,qcf+ attack in all games and it would always work, I feel like Blazblue was no exception. But now in Chrono PhantasmaI get the qcf attack. Now I have to pay attention and make sure I don't complete the qcf and do a proper dragon punch input of f,d,df vs my usual f,d,df,f. It's really messing me up. Has anyone else noticed this or am I just crazy?

 

4. Framedata is a bigger deal in 3D fighters so coming from Tekken it makes me at ease to know my characters info. How do I read the dustloop frame data page? For data on hits I can't tell if it's after my recovery animation or after my active frames.

 

Say for Ragna's 5A on hit it is 12 frames. Is that +12 frames after he is back to neutral right? That's why his 8 frame start up 5B can connect. That's what I intially thought but that can't be right since 5C is +19 but I can't follow it with 5A which is 5 frames. So yeah not sure how to read these. The colum right before grounded hit frames say opponent  has 11 frames of block stun. It makes me think 5A is actually (12-11) = +1 frames on hit, same for 5C, 19-18 = +1,  which is why you can't link a jab. 

 

In Tekken a 5A (1) is usually +8 on hit but a 5A start up time is 10 frames. You know anything that connects after a 5A is because in chains you recovery animation is canceled by the chained attack. I'm sure its the same for Blazblue. But the Tekken frame data table for getting  a hit was clear. You are +/- x frames from when your recovery animation ends until the opponent can block again.

[GrandAquila]

1. Here is the easiest way to tell you. No, the easiest way to tell is simply how fast it comes out there shouldn't be a noticeable pause in your jump before the air dash and you should still be rising when it happens( I may be wrong here).As far as how to do it I usually mash down 9 66 and it just rolls out.

2). Reversals don't come by as often as you'd think in BB. As Ragna your DP is a powerful tool that all characters have to respect. It's invulnerable property is a great weapon when pressured. Some characters are pretty safe I think Bang is one of the tougher characters to get consistent at dealing with.

Now in response to pressure when you try to poke out with a 5a you may attribute it to lag. I'd refrain from online play to hit practice and get comfortable with blocking the blockstrings you're having trouble with. Try to poke out with some normals without lag and maybe you will have better luck online.

3). They didn't change the priority to my knowledge but the inputs do seem to be tighter. I had the same issue switching from EX to CP

4). Ragna's 5a has 5 frames of start up and 3 frames of activity and 9 frames of recovery to put it simply it will only hit on the 5-8 frames and if you use 5B the recovery is canceled due to the fact that it is a "gatling" normal for 5A . Hope that helps some. Ask away!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Fatalis]

 

 

ah thanks for the info guys. To follow up I have some more questions, most aren't realted related to mobility this time.... but why spam new topics, right?

 

1. How do I know if I'm properly instant air dashing? In UMvC3 its pretty easy to tell as you can see how low to the ground you are. I'm just wondering exactly what a perfect instant air dash looks like in this game (youtube didn't help) Also I'm using a dualshock 3 controller so it would be great if you have input tips specific to that.

 

2. It seems like some characters normals are all safe. you have to block forever until they use an unsafe move or they let up and you have a chance to attack again. Is that the case? I feel like that's exactly why I keep getting snuffed whenever I press a button. I keep telling myself it's online lag, otherwise there's no reason for my 5As to lose to slower normals after I've properly blocked

 

3. Did they change command input driority in this game? For dragon punch inputs I always use f,qcf+ attack in all games and it would always work, I feel like Blazblue was no exception. But now in Chrono PhantasmaI get the qcf attack. Now I have to pay attention and make sure I don't complete the qcf and do a proper dragon punch input of f,d,df vs my usual f,d,df,f. It's really messing me up. Has anyone else noticed this or am I just crazy?

 

4. Framedata is a bigger deal in 3D fighters so coming from Tekken it makes me at ease to know my characters info. How do I read the dustloop frame data page? For data on hits I can't tell if it's after my recovery animation or after my active frames.

 

Say for Ragna's 5A on hit it is 12 frames. Is that +12 frames after he is back to neutral right? That's why his 8 frame start up 5B can connect. That's what I intially thought but that can't be right since 5C is +19 but I can't follow it with 5A which is 5 frames. So yeah not sure how to read these. The colum right before grounded hit frames say opponent  has 11 frames of block stun. It makes me think 5A is actually (12-11) = +1 frames on hit, same for 5C, 19-18 = +1,  which is why you can't link a jab. 

 

In Tekken a 5A (1) is usually +8 on hit but a 5A start up time is 10 frames. You know anything that connects after a 5A is because in chains you recovery animation is canceled by the chained attack. I'm sure its the same for Blazblue. But the Tekken frame data table for getting  a hit was clear. You are +/- x frames from when your recovery animation ends until the opponent can block again.

 

1. You'll just immediately dash in the air if you input it corretly. There shouldn't be any sort of hang time before you airdash. You'll get a feel for it the more you play.

 

2. Depending on who you fight, reversaling pressure can be pretty difficult. Just escaping pressure itself is fairly good result. This kind of requires you to understand everyone else's blockstrings, and know when you have the chance to escape. You also have "Counter Assault" which you do by pressing (6+A+B) during blockstun which will do an attack that does 0 damage, but knocks you opponent away for 50 meter. This can be a big help in escaping pressure.

 

3. Input priority is weird, and for inputs that have both a DP and QCF motion to the same button (Ragna's D Inferno Divider on the ground) you'll tend to get the QCF over the DP. This is getting fixed in the upcoming balance patch, but that is something you'll have to worry about. You may want to consider doing C Inferno Divider as there's nothing bound to 236C, so your DP will be consistent.

 

4. For frame data, the most important parts are really if the move is +/- on block (frame advantage). If you want to look at how combos will work, look at the revolver action table towards the bottom of the frama data. That tells you what each move can/can't cancel into. You'll see that 5A can cancel into 5B, however you'll also see that 5C can't cancel into 5A, but it could cancel into 6A. Revolver action is going to be what determines what you can and can't combo into, not necessarily the frame data.

 

I believe 5A is 0 on block because it doesn't count the frame you hit on. 5A = 3 Active + 9 Recovery.  If you hit on the first active frame of 5A, your opponent's blockstun starts on the second active frame of 5A that's why (3+9-1) - 11 = 0 frame advantage on block, as opposed to +1. That's how I think it works at least.

[spades111]

Thanks again for the info guys. You guys are being really great with answering all my question. I know I could always search my questions up but its nice to have the answers directed to me and the full question specifics.

 

Hopefully the patch makes my life easier. As for frame data I guess I'll just use it to know which attacks are highly plus and negative so I know when to safely punish or chill out.

 

While I still have this topic going I guess I'll keep my questions coming. I'd appreciate if someone could explain the invunerablityframes of getting up in all the ways there are to get up. In Tekken you could get full combos on back rolls depending on your character. I noticed while I was playing the other night my 5C hit a back rolls but didn't  at times. Which is why I ask when are get ups invincible?

[Were-Wulf]

for pad iad I just press 96 (up forward, forward) something about how the game counts a jump forward as a forward motion so only one more forward motion is necessary to start an airdash - blah blah - it works

[GrandAquila]

Forward Roll

+ A/B/C

1~3F Fully invincible

4~17F Throw invincible, if hit you will be in the air

18~30F Guard possible, if hit will be in crouching position

1~10F can pass through opponent

Back Roll

+ A/B/C

1~10F Fully invincible

11~17F Throw invincible, if hit you will be in the air

18~30F Guard possible, if hit will be in crouching position

1~10F can pass through the opponent

Quick Tech

+ A/B/C

1~13F Throw invincible, if hit you will be in the air

14~19F Throw invincible, guard possible, cancellable into any grounded attack, if hit will be in standing position

Will automatically Quick Tech after laying on the ground for 68 frames

Neutral Tech

no direction + A/B/C

1~32F Fully invincible

Copied from wiki same for all characters.

Edit: it is important to note that some moves will hit on wakeup as their active frames will happen after the invulnerable status of the tech is up we call it a "meaty".

[Zouf]

Thanks again for the info guys. You guys are being really great with answering all my question. I know I could always search my questions up but its nice to have the answers directed to me and the full question specifics.

 

Hopefully the patch makes my life easier. As for frame data I guess I'll just use it to know which attacks are highly plus and negative so I know when to safely punish or chill out.

 

While I still have this topic going I guess I'll keep my questions coming. I'd appreciate if someone could explain the invunerablityframes of getting up in all the ways there are to get up. In Tekken you could get full combos on back rolls depending on your character. I noticed while I was playing the other night my 5C hit a back rolls but didn't  at times. Which is why I ask when are get ups invincible?

 

The Frame data is useful for a lot of things. The startup for each move is really important, as well as the active frames. For instance, if you want to punish a roll with Ragna, you'd rather use 5B instead of 5C, because 5B has 8 active frames while 5C only has 4 frames. You'll most likely be able to punish a roll with 5B than with 5C.

 

Later, when you get used to the game, you'll want to know what the levels of your moves are. BB uses a move level system that is useful to master to comprehend what's happening on the screen (why do i get pushed back when my opponent uses the barrier, why is the blockstun so huge on this move and not this one etc...)

[spades111]

Later, when you get used to the game, you'll want to know what the levels of your moves are. BB uses a move level system that is useful to master to comprehend what's happening on the screen (why do i get pushed back when my opponent uses the barrier, why is the blockstun so huge on this move and not this one etc...)

 

What exactly is the move level system?

[Zouf]

This is kinda off topic, oh well

 

http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Ragna_Frame_Data_(BBCP)

 

See the "level" column. 5B is level 3, 5C is level 4 etc...

 

The Attack level indicates the blockstun, the hitstun, the pushback (with and without barrier block) and probably some others things. For example, a level 5 attack will always have 20f of blockstun. This is standarized for every character in the game

 

More infos here : http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Attack_Attributes_(BBCP)#Attack_Level

 

(The hitstop values are wrong here, they changed it in CP)

 

Try to barrier block a level 1 attack and then a level 5, and notice the huge difference in pushback. The higher the level, the bigger the pushback. This can help you during your pressing or your opponent's, to prevent whiffs or provoke them.

 

I wouldn't recommend learning them now, this is a (very) advanced mechanic that is not useful for now.