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Onilink

So, it turns out .. I don't know how to BlazBlue.

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First off, sorry if this is the wrong place to post this. If it's not a good place to post this, feel free to move or close this.

All right, as the topic title says - I dunno how to BlazBlue. Allow me to give you a bit of a background.

I recent purchased a copy of CP, however, I had been playing CSE for a while before. I play Relius and Makoto. I know midscreen combos, corner combos, combos into super, oki, etc. However, when I play in a match, I seem to be unable to do well at all.

I am aware that knowing combos isn't enough to do well, though. I've been playing Street Fighter for a few years, and Tekken since I was just a kid - I never had trouble getting right into them. However, BlazBlue is a different beast. When it comes to the neutral game, getting in, punishing, and overall gameplay, I just can't do it. At least in CP, that is. In CSE, I could hold my own. I did take quite a long break to play other games like P4A, SG, and to become more skilled at Street Fighter, so that might explain why I'm so much worse.

I'd really like to get better at this game, but the other day, after losing .. I believe nine times in a row to my friend, I'm kinda losing heart. (Eh, well, he has been playing BB far longer than I have, so it shouldn't be a surprise that he'd wipe the floor with me. Hell, he's the one who introduced me to CSE.)

If anyone has any tips on how I can get better, I'd absolutely love to hear them.

However, I have a feeling that the only way to fix my problem is to play in more matches instead of cowering in fear.

But I can only fail so much before I give up.

Of course, I'm a little stubborn, so even if I tell myself, "I'm NEVER going to play this stupid game again." .. I usually just go right back the next day.

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Personally I think you're playing too many fighting games at once. Some are capable of doing it and some are not so reevaluate what you want to play at a competitive level and casual level and work from there. Don't treat yourself as an omnipotent god without limitations and come back when you're ready to commit. Most of the players you'll encounter will have Guilty Gear history that will carry over into Blazblue while others been playing the game since launch so there's going to be a lot of catching up to do joining this late in the party.

 

Who knows, maybe your technology for the other fighters will actually prove useful and you'll undoubtedly do something so mind bending you'll body the whole community.

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Well, I really only play Street Fighter and BlazBlue now. It's been a while since I've taken P4A or Tekken seriously. And SG? Never really took it all that seriously. I played it, learned combos, and dropped it. And I feel pretty comfortable with Street Fighter now, so BlazBlue has my focus.

I totally understand where you're coming from though.

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I play Relius too! So tell me how you play, what your common troubles and pitfalls are, what your current set of combos confirms, and oki methods you use. What pressure and mix-up tricks and tactics do you know? How are you on gimmicks and stuff? What is your current perceived skill level and how good do you want to be?

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Well, most of my trouble comes from not knowing how to work out any real tactics. I pretty much get stuck in SF mode in a match and try to approach, but get crushed. When that happens, I usually start to panic and go for throw starter combos instead of normal starters. I caught my friend off gaurd a couple of times using Val Lyra (Actually seems to work .. okayish against his Nu, sometimes.) to start my combos, but usually I start 'em with 5B .. if I can even start them.

Other than that .. I usually can't even get my offense started because I dunno how to go about it.

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Two things, can you get Ignis out okay, and can you get your opponent to block a move?

 

If the answer to both of these things is yes then you can start pressure whenever and I'll tell you how now, if one or both are no then I'll give you some useful strategies to turn them to yeses.

 

6D is a god move. if your opponent blocks any ground hit or any move that leads to a ground hit, then you can use 6D to let yourself dash into 3C range and start pressure looping.

 

5B>6D>663C is a blockstring that can be used even from max range 5B and 3C can be jump canceled even on block. from 3C you can do (3C>jump forward +6D>falling j.C>665B>3C>jump + 6D>repeat) this is a basic relius pressure loop that can go on forever so long as you have Ignis to burn. you can even do this string without Ignis to waste time or try to get solo combos, but you have to watch for anti-airs and bait accordingly.

 

All you have to do from there is add mix-up. In place of 665B you can do 662B 663C 66A or 66grab, and you can cancel 5B or 2B into 6A at any time. you can get rid of falling j.C once the opponent has learned to expect it for empty jump 2B/3C/6A/grab. you can replace falling j.C with falling j.B>doublejump + immediate j.C>j.2D>j.B>665B for a triple overhead. you can jump or airdash over them then use j.2D for a cross-up. also you can cancel any ground normal into 236D for an unblockable 236D+j.C set-up.

 

Lyra is good for attacking Nu's wakeup and locking her down, however Tus has the advantage of Tanking swords for you. Remember that when it comes to [other projectile] v.s. Puppet, puppet always wins.

 

Are you using stuff like 5B>3C>jump+6D>falling j.B>2C>6C>41236B>5B>5C>superjump>j.B>j.C>j.236C~j.214B>airdash for midscreen and 5B>3C>236C~214A>665C(one hit)> jump>j.C>j.236C~j.214B>falling j.B>2C>6C>41236B>5B>5C>4D>3C(>optional distortion) for corner?

 

These combos are optimal and only need to be slightly changed for jab/throw/a few hits before the 5B starters.

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Hm, all right. I'll be taking your advice on this. Getting Ignis out really isn't a problem for me unless I'm being heavily pressured from the get go and can't break free.

Thanks!

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Counter assault is great for Relius when you want to break free. Usually you won't spend your meter on anything but a round finishing distortion, a (whatever)>236C>rapid>665B>2C>6C>41236B>5B>5C>superjump>j.B>j.C>j.236C(~optional j.214B>airdash) solo relius combo, or a counter assault.

 

You're welcome! If you ever have any questions about Relius, and I mean ever,  bring it over to the Relius forums and we'll be happy to help. (Necro and I have nothing much else to do)

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There's a Makoto forum too. And we're currently running low on players lol.

 

If you have any questions about playing as Makoto, I'll do my best to try and answer them here (or you can post in the Makoto General discussion board to get feedback from every Dustloop Makoto).

 

Also, do you play online at all? If so, what's your PSN?

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I'll be sure to hop over to the character specific forums soon, then!

And I do play online, my PSN is Onilink154.

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Did you ask your friend what he thinks you are doing wrong?

Maybe you are doing something which he is always punishing without you realising it.

Maybe you are trying to punish something from him at a bad moment or try to mash at bad times.

Your friend probably knows better than us why he's winning and you are not.

 

As to how to get better at the neutral game, it's probably best to take that to the character specific forums.

 

losing 9 times in a row ain't too bad.

I think I lost 900 times in a row back in the day against Blood Gemini LOL (and I bet I still would if we would play each other again).

Ever since CP I've been on a bad losing streak too, but nothing that rivals the CT days where I lost 50 times in a row before clutching out my first victory :) (playing in Europe at US release date against people from a GG background with me never having played airdashers was painful)

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follow this thread's advice and keep playing, and you should get the hang of relius. makoto... if you're trying to get competitive, drop her. she will make you train hard for no reward. now if you're into that then fine. otherwise, put more of your time on the viable character.

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Nah, didn't ask him afterwords because I was really tired from a mix of work and lack of sleep, so I just passed out on the couch. I'll try to get on more matches with him soon. I'm sure he won't mind. He's been my sparring partner ever since I got SF. Hell, he pretty much taught me the game.

And yeah, I guess nine isn't that much, but it's sure more than I've ever lost in a row before, so that got me all frustrated.

As for dropping Makoto .. never. I have way too much fun playing her to just toss her out like yesterday's garbage. And on top of that, low tier characters are just fine to me. There was a point in time that I really only played Dan Hibiki, so the fun is more important to me.

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Nah, didn't ask him afterwords because I was really tired from a mix of work and lack of sleep, so I just passed out on the couch. I'll try to get on more matches with him soon. I'm sure he won't mind. He's been my sparring partner ever since I got SF. Hell, he pretty much taught me the game.

And yeah, I guess nine isn't that much, but it's sure more than I've ever lost in a row before, so that got me all frustrated.

As for dropping Makoto .. never. I have way too much fun playing her to just toss her out like yesterday's garbage. And on top of that, low tier characters are just fine to me. There was a point in time that I really only played Dan Hibiki, so the fun is more important to me.

This is a great mindset. Stick with who you enjoy using. It makes winning more rewarding

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I actually agree with dropping her.  Makoto (and to a lesser extent the other low tiers) all cause you learn really bad habits and disrespect your own options when you play other fighters/characters.

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I actually agree with dropping her.  Makoto (and to a lesser extent the other low tiers) all cause you learn really bad habits and disrespect your own options when you play other fighters/characters.

 

Huh? :P

 

Generally, I think playing a low tier character with bad options forces you to EXPLORE all your options - the best way to get wins with Tsubaki, for example, who has super terrible mixup and therefore needs to reset her pressure over and over, is to basically never do the same setup twice, and ALWAYS vary where you cancel, etc.  This keeps your opponent from being able to figure you out.  If you just play a high tier character, you're way more likely to just find a strong option and lean on it like a crutch.

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I agree. Always play who you enjoy the most, be it their design, moves, story, playstyle, or whatever. It's a game and you should be enjoying it. I also agree with the idea that having a low tier character does force you to think more on what you, as a player, can do instead of utilizing something that is naturally good in the top tier characters. I'm not saying this isn't necessary in the high tier characters, but I think you'll grow more as a player if you've got the determination to take the losses and learn with the underpowered character.

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Huh? :P

 

Generally, I think playing a low tier character with bad options forces you to EXPLORE all your options - the best way to get wins with Tsubaki, for example, who has super terrible mixup and therefore needs to reset her pressure over and over, is to basically never do the same setup twice, and ALWAYS vary where you cancel, etc.  This keeps your opponent from being able to figure you out.  If you just play a high tier character, you're way more likely to just find a strong option and lean on it like a crutch.

 

I may not be one to talk, but couldn't you just recognize you're using the one strong tool as a crutch and learn to rely on other things as well? I mean, sure, that could be a pitfall of playing a higher tier character, but once a pitfall such as that is recognized all one needs to do is work around it, which anyone possessing self control can plausibly do. I don't see that as a big enough reason to purposely seek out a low tier character to play, or to continue playing a low tier character you aren't having fun with. Also a low tier character could themselves be forced to rely too heavily on the one good thing that they have, like in the instances of Kaguras 6D~C and [2]8C being the go to tools for the overwhelming majority I've been subjected to facing. The only difference is that they don't have as many options to rely on once they do decide to look past those two as a higher tier character might.

 

Whether a player branches out and assimilates other strategies is entirely dependent on them, not their character. =/ If playing a character with less tools pushes you to innovate and strive for greatness, then more power to ya. I can dig the whole "obtains true power in the face of extreme and constant adversity" thing.

 

For whatever reason, the TC likes themselves some Makoto gameplay, and at the end of the day I believe that's what's going to keep them playing her.

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Sure, you COULD. 

 

But there's always going to be the sly lure of trying to do things the easy way.   With weaker characters, there isn't one.

 

No one is saying anything is absolute here.  Well, except for Poultrygeist, and that's why I stepped in to counterpoint.

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You can run the "My character is garbage" OS. Almost as good as "I don't even play this game."

That's the real problem with picking low tiers.

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Of course, I'm a little stubborn, so even if I tell myself, "I'm NEVER going to play this stupid game again." .. I usually just go right back the next day.

Wow, I've done this exact thing so many times I lost count. Anyway aside from the good old tried and true advice of "go hit training mode" I'll just say you should look for players around your skill level. This doesn't mean you should hunt for easy wins I'm just saying you should start small because getting smashed over and over again by good players can effect one's confidence towards the game.

Besides that if you have any friends that play this you should try and practice with them. Having people to compare notes with yields better results than trying figure everything out alone.

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