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Madness4455

Dustloop Fantasy Story Fights

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I do not wish to spam the thread with "Who would win in a fight" topics. So I think it would be appropriate to discuss those here.

In topic, we only discuss these subjects about who would beat who in a fight in Blazblue story mode. This is only for characters who never met or fought within the story or perhaps characters who are not at full potential yet. Don't do fights that has already happened in story mode.

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Azrael vs Hakumen, I believe Hakumen to be stronger but he can only use 20% of his powers so Azrael could really give him a tough fight. It could go any way or just be a draw.

Hakumen vs Izayoi, Hakumen would win but still resist fighting her as she is Tsubaki.

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Azrael vs Hakumen, I believe Hakumen to be stronger but he can only use 20% of his powers so Azrael could really give him a tough fight. It could go any way or just be a draw.

Hakumen vs Izayoi, Hakumen would win but still resist fighting her as she is Tsubaki.

Hakumen has a better advantage. His sword can cut through anything and he has Time Killer. It takes time to charge but he could use it faster or infinitely at full power. Remember, Hakumen fought Azrael while protecting Celica. Pretty sure Haku is fighting distracted.

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Mind telling why you think Bullet could win?

Makoto is one of my favorite female characters but I think Bullet would win.

Makoto does have a strength advantage, she is physically stronger than Bullet and might be slightly faster than her too. But Bullet has way more fighting experience as soldier/mercenary and has been through wars which says so in her bio. Since it also says she is slightly racist to Beastkin, Bullet may've handled beastkin before. Furthermore, Bullet's attacks are more destructive and she is more agile and nimble than Makoto. Makoto is only a Intel Gatherer and the Intel Department mainly seeks info, they don't fight that much. Not saying they can't but they rarely fight at all.

Besides, Bullet probably had more training than Makoto. She was raised by mercenaries and probably was taught at a young age.

In conclusion, Bullet is pretty smart and resourceful. She did outwit Azrael when they were fighting in her chapter of story mode. Mercenaries are resourceful killers and Bullet is no doubt smarter than Makoto combat-wise. Makoto isn't really the kind of fighter who uses tactics, she just fights to win as possible. One more thing I want to point out is that Bullet's gauntlet looks like it packs a explosive punch so that gauntlet probably increases Bullet's strength but only on that one arm and her punches are explosive and destructive than Makoto's punches.

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Hakumen has a better advantage. His sword can cut through anything and he has Time Killer. It takes time to charge but he could use it faster or infinitely at full power. Remember, Hakumen fought Azrael while protecting Celica. Pretty sure Haku is fighting distracted.

Time Killer takes a long time to charge and Azrael would never let him use it.

 

His sword can't cut through anything.

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Time Killer takes a long time to charge and Azrael would never let him use it.

 

His sword can't cut through anything.

He is talking about if Hakumen was at full power. If he was at full power, he could charge it faster. Also, Azrael is way to careless in a fight, he thinks nothing will phase him at all.

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He is talking about if Hakumen was at full power. If he was at full power, he could charge it faster. Also, Azrael is way to careless in a fight, he thinks nothing will phase him at all.

Ah, I was going off the OP: "This is only for characters who never met or fought within the story or perhaps characters who are not at full potential yet."

It's pretty much impossible to tell how they'd both do at full power since we have no idea how powerful Azrael is with his limiters removed.

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Ah, I was going off the OP: "This is only for characters who never met or fought within the story or perhaps characters who are not at full potential yet."

It's pretty much impossible to tell how they'd both do at full power since we have no idea how powerful Azrael is with his limiters removed.

 

Hmm, well consider he's above average with his limiters and that Ragna was forced to use his Blazblue; Ragna generally saves Blazblue for truly strong beings. And if we take adaptations into consideration, he's strong enough to beat Hakumen(not at full power, but work with me) and Hazama/Terumi. 

 

 

So Az is probably around there.

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We only got a glimpse of Azrael's true power in his Astral. His punches are explosive but I doubt it could damage or kill Hakumen easily. The Susanoo unit is virtually indestructible.

We never get a glimpse of Hakumen at full strength. The only thing we know is that Ragna is terrified of 100% Hakumen which says it somewhere in the novels or some stuff.

Ragna said that current Hakumen is trash compared to 100% Hakumen. That pretty much tells us that Hakumen is probably too dangerous to fight at full power and is that strong. All Azrael has to his advantage is his strength and could be physically stronger than Hakumen.

However, Azrael is too reckless and even though his durability is high, durability has a breaking point.

Hakumen's advantages is his sword, techniques, and his connection with Amaterasu.

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In the Hakumen's arcade mode, both of them fought to a stalemate and Azrael had to walk off while Hakumen says "Even you know when to back off."

 

 

As for Bullet vs. Makoto, I disagree that Bullet would beat Makoto. Makoto is able to manhandle Tager in her CS arcade and beaten the living hell out of Izayoi in CP arcade. Izayoi is one of the strongest characters ever and Bullet is unable to take on a muscle-bound prick like Azrael. Plus, Makoto held her own against Relius Clover back in her CS story mode.

 

Kagura's men couldn't keep up in capturing Makoto while she was trying to locate Tsubaki. A lot of characters compliment her physical prowess many times in story mode.

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@Freak_Show

 

Makoto and Tager were equal in the story. Tager could be holding back since he stated in his quotes that "If I use too much of my strength, Kokonoe gets mad at me." and that could mean that Tager doesn't entirely want to harm people and he is a gentle giant. As for Izayoi, she is not one of the strongest characters and she is a prototype Murakumo unit. She can only kill Observers or immortals. Izayoi never displays impressive feats at all. Azrael is OP as hell for half of the cast, even Kokonoe admitted in one chapter where Tager and Litchi were cornered by Azrael and Nu-13 that Makoto wouldn't stand a chance against those two, including Azrael. If those two were to fight, Azrael would overwhelm her and beat her horribly into submission.

 

Relius Clover was simply toying with Makoto and was studying her. Ever realize how Relius rarely shows a lot of effort in a fight? He barely even breaks a sweat against Platinum and sure as hell wasn't against Makoto. Makoto was wasting her breath fighting Relius. She already lost that from the beginning she and him met face-to-face.

 

Kagura's men can't capture her because she is fast but that doesn't mean anything in this fight. What I want to point out is that Makoto carelessly walks out on enemy territory and was exposed out in the open. Nothing ever crossed her mind in thinking "If I look for Tsubaki, I might get captured by the NOL or killed." That is reckless. Bullet knows how to keep herself hidden unlike Makoto.

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In the Hakumen's arcade mode, both of them fought to a stalemate and Azrael had to walk off while Hakumen says "Even you know when to back off."

 

 

As for Bullet vs. Makoto, I disagree that Bullet would beat Makoto. Makoto is able to manhandle Tager in her CS arcade and beaten the living hell out of Izayoi in CP arcade. Izayoi is one of the strongest characters ever and Bullet is unable to take on a muscle-bound prick like Azrael. Plus, Makoto held her own against Relius Clover back in her CS story mode.

 

Kagura's men couldn't keep up in capturing Makoto while she was trying to locate Tsubaki. A lot of characters compliment her physical prowess many times in story mode.

 

 

@Freak_Show

 

Makoto and Tager were equal in the story. Tager could be holding back since he stated in his quotes that "If I use too much of my strength, Kokonoe gets mad at me." and that could mean that Tager doesn't entirely want to harm people and he is a gentle giant. As for Izayoi, she is not one of the strongest characters and she is a prototype Murakumo unit. She can only kill Observers or immortals. Izayoi never displays impressive feats at all. Azrael is OP as hell for half of the cast, even Kokonoe admitted in one chapter where Tager and Litchi were cornered by Azrael and Nu-13 that Makoto wouldn't stand a chance against those two, including Azrael. If those two were to fight, Azrael would overwhelm her and beat her horribly into submission.

 

Relius Clover was simply toying with Makoto and was studying her. Ever realize how Relius rarely shows a lot of effort in a fight? He barely even breaks a sweat against Platinum and sure as hell wasn't against Makoto. Makoto was wasting her breath fighting Relius. She already lost that from the beginning she and him met face-to-face.

 

Kagura's men can't capture her because she is fast but that doesn't mean anything in this fight. What I want to point out is that Makoto carelessly walks out on enemy territory and was exposed out in the open. Nothing ever crossed her mind in thinking "If I look for Tsubaki, I might get captured by the NOL or killed." That is reckless. Bullet knows how to keep herself hidden unlike Makoto.

I think it's time I throw my two cents in.

 

As GameSins pointed out, Makoto and Tager reliably tie with each other. Makoto did win the CS Arcade fight, but she did concede that Tager was stronger than the stories indicated. In CP Arcade, each of them has a win, but in CS Story mode, Kokonoe interrupted the fight before a winner could be decided ("Cut it out, both of you! That's enough, damnit!").

 

As for how she'd fare against Azrael, signs point towards "no", but all we really know is that Kokonoe said that Makoto can't handle a simultaneous encounter with Azrael and Nu-13. One or the other? Maybe, but I wouldn't hold my breath. Both? In your dreams.

 

I wouldn't say Izayoi's all that weak, seeing as while it was made to kill Observers, the Observed, and other theoretically immortal beings, it could still work on those below that level who do not possess the power of order (Jin stated, both the night before the fight and right after it, that the Immortal Breaker is useless against him). We never got to see it used on anyone other than him, but Story mode and Arcade mode (Tsubaki's CP notwithstanding) shows that without intervention, Tsubaki doesn't have a prayer of defeating Makoto, Zero-Type or otherwise. Since Hakumen stated that the power of order is akin to one's own willpower, though functioning on different levels, Makoto may be resistant to its power (someone who can jump between timelines without consequence is no pushover).

 

As for the fight with Relius, Makoto wasn't exhausted, but she did note that her hits weren't registering before Ignis bound her. We don't know where her physical limit is, but Relius knew that pushing her there was an exercise in attrition, which is why he had her bound while he experimented with her soul. Keep in mind that in Bloodedge Experience, Relius and Valkenhayn were partners, so he knows some things about how beastkin tick. Compare to Hazama, who could cut her down with overwhelming force, but beyond that literally can't do anything to her that's worse than what she's been through already unless Ouroboros is liberally used.

 

As for Kagura, Makoto is fast, true, but you have to keep in mind that she's also a competent spy, and would be at least familiar with basic rules of concealment. If she knew she was being pursued by NOL officers, she would try to blend in or cover her tracks until she could verify if they were Main Branch or Ibukido; rather than act directly to retrieve her, Kagura forwarded her information to Tsubaki as a diversion, and chose to strike while the iron was hot. ("Even if it's Makoto, give them a day and they'll narrow down her location. Catching her, though... that's something different.") Also, how many times has Hazama found her by surprise without relying on blind luck or stolen foreknowledge? Can't say it's a large number if the magnitude of Intel faux pas in Slight Hope is any indication.

 

Freak_Show is somewhat correct that Makoto's prowess is complimented, but the ones who do are usually the ones who are in the position to make that kind of call. In Story mode, Rachel explicitly calls her "a fighter of no little savagery" if she bests Tsubaki (knowing how hard Rachel is to please, that says a lot), whereas in Arcade mode commentary she is complimented by Bang, Hakumen and Valkenhayn - one ninja with a questionable choice in apprentices and two of the Six friggin' Heroes. Also, there's the matter of souls. With Bullet, we can only presume it's milquetoast; she is known to wield an incendiary armagus, which makes it safe to guess that it's the source of her Drive, and aside from her connection to Tager she's not even a blip on Relius' radar. Makoto, on the other hand, is the real deal; we know Relius' story with it, but Hakumen also brings it up in his CP Arcade commentary ("To think there are still souls in this world as pure as yours. I suggest you cherish that rare commodity, for the sake of us all..."). With Bloodedge Experience referencing that Drives are the power of a soul made manifest by the Azure, coupled with how little we know of Makoto's tonfas compared to every other weapon in the series and the fact she was never seen with them during her Academy years, I suspect that Makoto's Drive has less to do with her tonfas and more to do with her.

 

And you're calling Makoto 'reckless'? Reckless is attacking an innocent doctor on naught but a hunch she knows someone's whereabouts ("How are you not in jail already?"). Reckless is fighting a losing battle where the losses outweigh the gains ("Ungh... this is... not good...! *runs*"). And last I recall, Makoto was aware that she was going to be attacked or killed if she went after Tsubaki; she even warned Noel of such herself (you'd think either Kokonoe or Kagura would tell Makoto up-front about the spell Tsubaki's under, or have Tager tip her off as a Plan B, but BlazBlue Mentorhood 101 apparently equates to "Tell your student not to invoke phenomenon X, but don't explain to them how phenomenon X works" - Rachel at least makes the goddamn effort sometimes, but not Kokopuffs). Bringing up Slight Hope again, between the files in Ibukido, escorting a wounded man towards the place he didn't want to go, and Hazama's off-hand comment, Makoto suspected that Relius was moving Jin away as bait for her, and the ending is dependent on how she deals with the resulting trap - the true ending works on the sound logic that she needs to account for all of her friends at once and utilize the resources available to her to that end. Likewise, when Hazama tries to coerce Tsubaki to go after Jin before he runs into Ragna, Makoto explicitly chose to stay behind; "Combat's not really my forte, so I'll sit this one out" was something Makoto knew from firsthand experience was bullshit, and leaving him unaccounted for would leave at least one of them dead, and if nothing else, Tsubaki might have a ghost of a chance of getting Jin up to lend a hand so they can go after Ragna together. Tsubaki was Hazama's last chance to off Jin (if he killed Tsubaki, Nu would gladly do the dirty work of killing Jin for him), and Makoto choosing to forestall him completely scuttled it. Are these the kinds of things a reckless person could manage? I doubt it.

 

And that's not going into the possibilities of what could have happened had Hazama and Izanami left her alone. Makoto had a plan going into Friendship, which while somewhat compromised due to Noel forgetting her advice and Tsubaki not questioning the nature of the orders she received from Hazama still went off as Makoto planned up until Hazama showed up and pulled Noel away. Had Makoto been allowed to stay with Noel for more than a few moments, Hazama would either need fresh mindrape material or he'd have to kiss Kusanagi goodbye, and that's if Takamagahara didn't just reset outright. In Bonds, Tager was a slight hiccup, but Tsubaki couldn't weather Hurricane Makoto on her own. Even with the Zero-Type, Makoto's prowess and determination caused Mind Eater to lapse; logic would denote that if she felt Tsubaki was fighting something from within, she would seek help in getting rid of it for good if she felt she couldn't manage it on her own. Doesn't it strike you as odd that not only does Makoto come closer to inflicting long-term damage to the villains' plots than the other protagonists' solo efforts, but the villains make an active effort just to prevent a repeat of that possibility? Again, not something a reckless person could manage, and damn impressive for someone who was never told about the brainwashing.

 

Also, considering the fighting styles of the ladies in question, Bullet is mostly reliant on straight, in-your-face combat, emphasizing grappling over strikes; while Makoto emphasizes strikes primarily, the techniques at her disposal are meant to punish, surprise and confuse attackers, meaning her art utilizes mind games as well - messing with people's expectations. So who's supposed to be more tactical again?

 

Freak_Show might be giving Makoto too much credit, but GameSins, gives too little. I can't really make a clean call on who wins this one, but the point I'm trying to make is clear: don't count Makoto out.

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@Cerotech

Makoto is one of my favorites, don't get my wrong. Also, if you are referring to the Asteroid Vision then let me point this out. All we know that she has more strength than Bullet but not every ability a character displayed in gameplay is mentioned in story mode. Its likely a game mechanic to give a player a advantage over another to win a match. The tonfas is not much of a big of a deal because Mori doesn't explain properly of certain things in the story nor does he care.

No she is a reckless even if she does know. Azrael is reckless as well and knew that Kokonoe has a trap for him but he didn't care and look where that got him.

Tsubaki caught Makoto in the open. Seems like Makoto wasn't hiding. She was out in the open. Since she was trying to find Tsubaki, what is she going to do when she finds her anyway?

Makoto doesn't have the capacity of Ars Magus at all. Bullet has better ars magus aptitude than Makoto. Bullet's fighting style is most likely based on H2H techniques. Bullet most likely is a better fighter than Makoto since she has more experience. As a Intel Officer, they rarely get into fights because its not their position to do so, they mainly gather Intel. Jin told Taokaka in Teach Me Litchi in one of the games.

Bullet's position as a merc is above Makoto's rank in two of the most powerful militias of BB. The characters of Blazblue that compliment her are possibly character over statements which happens in anime. Actions speak louder than words. Makoto may have impressive feats but feats can change and become bullshit in the story because...Mori. In a fight, I mainly look for who has a bigger advantage over the other.

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@Cerotech

Makoto did run out of breath when fighting Hazama and the reason why Makoto wasn't exhausted with Relius is because Relius barely puts the effort to fight his enemies, he merely toying with Makoto. Look at her arcade, Makoto was tired in her arcade ending after fighting Terumi in CS. She pretty does have a limit to her abilities.

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@Cerotech

Makoto is one of my favorites, don't get my wrong. Also, if you are referring to the Asteroid Vision then let me point this out. All we know that she has more strength than Bullet but not every ability a character displayed in gameplay is mentioned in story mode. Its likely a game mechanic to give a player a advantage over another to win a match. The tonfas is not much of a big of a deal because Mori doesn't explain properly of certain things in the story nor does he care.

No she is a reckless even if she does know. Azrael is reckless as well and knew that Kokonoe has a trap for him but he didn't care and look where that got him.

Tsubaki caught Makoto in the open. Seems like Makoto wasn't hiding. She was out in the open. Since she was trying to find Tsubaki, what is she going to do when she finds her anyway?

Makoto doesn't have the capacity of Ars Magus at all. Bullet has better ars magus aptitude than Makoto. Bullet's fighting style is most likely based on H2H techniques. Bullet most likely is a better fighter than Makoto since she has more experience. As a Intel Officer, they rarely get into fights because its not their position to do so, they mainly gather Intel. Jin told Taokaka in Teach Me Litchi in one of the games.

Bullet's position as a merc is above Makoto's rank in two of the most powerful militias of BB. The characters of Blazblue that compliment her are possibly character over statements which happens in anime. Actions speak louder than words. Makoto may have impressive feats but feats can change and become bullshit in the story because...Mori. In a fight, I mainly look for who has a bigger advantage over the other.

For someone who says Makoto's one of their favorite characters, you seem to be skewing more towards Bullet than you would otherwise imply. I wouldn't have a problem with this if some of the things you say about Bullet aren't fabricated out of nothing; I may theorize about Makoto, but I try to keep it plausible.

 

Asteroid Vision? I think we saw a facsimile of it in Remix Heart Chapter 5, so that argument just disappeared. It may be me, but a number of Makoto's abilities translate between story and gameplay, which is odd given Mori's track record.

 

And here we are at the 'reckless' argument again. I gave an instance where Bullet clearly acted where the gains were not worth the effort and instances where Makoto both chose to cut her losses and where to remain involved in which the gains were worthwhile (to Makoto, the well-being of her friends is worthwhile). How all that went in one ear and out the other with you I'll never know. The difference between a quick thinker and a reckless person is that the quick thinker has an exit strategy based off of what they know, whereas the reckless person doesn't (Azrael being a prime example of recklessness as you said). Using the Tsubaki issue as an example, Makoto did want to be noticed by Tsubaki, but tried to cover her tracks around everyone else; the reason Tsubaki found her first was because Kagura explicitly tipped Tsubaki off. And Makoto's plan was to bring Tsubaki back to NOL Kazamotsu, peaceably if possible, which doesn't rely on who finds whom first. Her whole speech was tailored to Tsubaki's sentiments to most efficiently carry out this task, and I suspect the only reason it failed was because Izanami explicitly intervened (the omniscient supercomputer that intervenes with reality is not something the average person would know about).

 

"Makoto doesn't have the capability of Ars Magus"? Really? What part of "Her ars magus aptitude is average, but her physical tests are off the charts" flew right over your head? Also, Makoto used a ventilation ars to protect herself from five years' worth of pent-up seithr ("After the destruction of Ibukido, the cauldron gates were closed and sealed so that seithr should not seep into our world", straight from the squirrel's mouth) - that, coupled with her 0.2% seithr erosion rate (ask Lambda-11 (CS) or Nu-13 (CP) in Arcade mode), should strongly imply that her mission to Ibukido was intended to be a suicide mission. Of course, Makoto's seithr resistance could also impair her ability to use ars magus; no matter how adept she may be at formulating it, she may simply be drawing in too little to sufficiently power it. On that note, do we even know what Bullet's ars magus aptitude is?

 

Also, do we have a backlog of what Bullet has been doing since she got off the bench after Azrael genocided her squadron? Just because she has experience doesn't mean it's worthwhile experience. Likewise, all we know about Makoto's mission history was that Ibukido was her last suicide mission (if not the only one), after which Hazama decided plausible deniability wasn't going to cut it with her anymore. And that's not including her training regimen at the Academy, let alone her pre-Academy backstory which, barring her sour mood in Heart to Heart and the glimpses Relius gives us in that bad ending, we know absolutely jack about. Who's to say Makoto didn't have to help fend off a round or two of ethnic cleansing? Given how much she puts her family and friends' well-being above her own if push comes to shove, I'd have to say she had to deal with at least one.

 

Likewise, do we even know Bullet's rank within the mercenary hierarchy, let alone her own squadron? How can you say she outranks Makoto if we don't even know that much? Further, what's the point of using military ranks to compare characters' combat abilities anyway? The "Almighty Janitor" trope exists for a reason - Hazama and Relius are villain-grade, Jin is the shonen rival, and Kagura would have been the war hero Jin was if he hadn't other obligations, so they get a pass, but in case you forgot this "noncombat officer" is known to be a better fighter than at least two combat officers superior to her in both rank and ars magus aptitude, so that argument doesn't hold water, either.

 

As for the compliments, limiting ourselves to the Six Heroes, Valkenhayn is expected to be cordial and complimentary to those around him, so you may get a pass with him, but Hakumen is not beholden to those rules, speaks his mind whether he is welcome to it or not, and that he is still impressed with Makoto despite the immense power gap should say enough already. And I told you how difficult to please Rachel was. I'm willing to take what those two say with greater weight because they're so hard to please, so I don't understand where "character overstatement" plays into the equation, especially when feats can be linked to advantages we are otherwise not privy to. And while we're outside the fourth wall by this point, BlazBlue monkeys with anime tropes to its own discretion, meaning any expectations based on gender and medium are a crapshoot at best. Further, Makoto consistently ranks higher than Bullet on the popularity polls (the two most recent polls had Makoto sixth amongst all BlazBlue characters (to Bullet's ninth) and third amongst all Arcsys ladies (outranked by Noel and Dizzy alone, while Bullet didn't make the top five)), and Makoto has stronger connections to the overall plot while Bullet is only linked through Kokonoe and Tager (mostly the latter), so that's a lot more fans Mori stands to piss off if Makoto jobs to Bullet. While Mori being contrary for the sake of riling up his fans is why I refuse to call the match straight in either girl's favor, I'm sure even he knows there are lines you just don't cross unless you're intent on torpedoing your company's consumer base.

 

I'm going to level with you. The only two things I hate about Bullet are not her fault; those would be [A] how her more insane fan zealots love blowing her character out of proportion (questioning your sanity with this is why I went on this campaign in the first place) and how little potential for characterization she was given out of the Chronophantasma newcomers. Point B can also be said for Azrael, which when you think about it is the greater crime; so much of the newcomer share was given to Kagura and Celica that the rest of them had to feud over the scraps, and that what was supposed to be our introduction to the world of mercenaries in BlazBlue and our sneak peek at greater Sector Seven's operations are so underdeveloped as characters is particularly tragic, and we're left wondering if they will actually mean more than their limited roles will allow. While Amane had little overt characterization, he still has greater potential due to that air of mystery and intrigue, which leaves Bullet and Azrael in the dust. That said, said lack of potential makes it hard to like her in turn, leaving her as "meh" all around from my viewpoint, which only makes the zealotry even worse.

 

@Cerotech

Makoto did run out of breath when fighting Hazama and the reason why Makoto wasn't exhausted with Relius is because Relius barely puts the effort to fight his enemies, he merely toying with Makoto. Look at her arcade, Makoto was tired in her arcade ending after fighting Terumi in CS. She pretty does have a limit to her abilities.

And didn't Makoto pant a little after her two-stage fight with Tsubaki in CP Arcade? She does have a limit, but she comes back pretty quick. And you ignored the part where I mentioned Relius had experience with Valkenhayn; he could carry on the fight, but it would be very unlike him to be so wasteful; the fight was an experiment to see how her soul held up under brute pressure, and once Relius was done with that, he advanced to the next phase in the manner he saw as most efficient.

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Wow, a fight between two characters who have never met in story mode being based purely on fan speculation/bias going nowhere? Next you'll tell me the sky is blue.

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Wow, a fight between two characters who have never met in story mode being based purely on fan speculation/bias going nowhere? Next you'll tell me the sky is blue.

That is what the topic is about. Characters who never met or aren't at their full potential. Yes, we use speculation but it must be accurate.

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@Cerotech

 

 

Bro, I like Makoto because she is the most badass female out of the trio along with Tsubaki and Noel because Makoto doesn't need a power boost like those two and is funny but not as funny as Bang or Taokaka. This is me being honest and not being a fanboy like DBZ fanboys.

 

Yes she displayed that in Remix Heart but is it displayed or mentioned in story mode? No, not really sadly. All Mori is doing is showing her amazing strength as a beastkin, nothing else. A lot of game mechanics of a character's abilities are never showed or mentioned in story mode. They are likely put their to make the character more appealing or perhaps gain a better advantage over the other. Makoto is not really a fighting strategist at all nor is she resourceful. I know she packs a punch but she doesn't think in a fight nor does she have a plan to win.

 

Oh so she wants Tsubaki to notice but does Makoto again think about this? What if Tsubaki found her and has multiple NOL soldiers surrounding Makoto? Does she ever think about that? Tsubaki could've had some NOL officers accompanying her or whatnot. Not only that but Hazama and Relius would've set a trap on her if they can since she was out in the open. Relius Clover and Hazama both knew Bang and Bullet were working together in the Sector Seven section. If they somehow knew what the hell those two were doing, there is no doubt they'd know about Makoto's whereabouts. Makoto knows better than that. I can understand she cares dearly for Tsubaki but has she forgotten two of the most dangerous villains of Blazblue who attempted to stop her from reaching them in CS?

 

My bad. Her ars magus aptitude is average. Doesn't mean she knows or could demonstrate a lot of it. Her physical status is off the charts because she is a beastkin which I am already aware of. Haven't I not said "Makoto is physically stronger than Bullet"? and the vent ars is nothing compared to some of the ars certain characters use. I'm sure every NOL soldier can use that kind of ars on certain missions. Bullet has some unknown ars magus as stated in her bio where she generates flames and thermal energy from my perspective. It's possible her ars magus aptitude is higher due to more training and fighting. Nu-13 scanned Bullet and said Bullet's combat ability is level B+ in Bullet's arcade. That could mean something alright.

 

Her "worthwhile" experience is heavily implied in her bio that she has been through many wars. That is possible evidence that Bullet went more fights than Makoto which I doubt gets into many. Tsubaki told Jin that "she doesn't seem like the kind of person who would hurt anyone". When she being picked on by other students, Makoto doesn't bother to fight back, only taunt or evade their assaults. There is no evidence that she has fought violently in the past. All we know is that she used to hate humans and doesn't want to deal with their crap. However, you of all people should know how bad Mori is at writing because a lot of things in Blazblue are not properly explained no does he care to explain. He only leaves pieces and hints.

 

As for her being a better fighter is simply your opinion. It's possible Noel is powerful than both of Tsubaki and Makoto. It's badass she doesn't rely on power boosters like those two but that doesn't mean she is better than both of them. Makoto had some degree of potential in CS which characters have stated like you said but Relius Clover suddenly dropped the "I'm going to rebuild her soul however I can" attitude and decided to focus on "I'm going to become the new Amaterasu and rebuild this world." He even ignored Makoto in the Sector Seven section ending and Makoto comically said, "Aww. He didn't even noticed me" or something. To me, it's like Mori just dropped Makoto's potential. Since her potential was dropped, it's likely character overstatement which is done in a many anime shows if you watch or had experience with anime. And didn't I say feats can change and crap? Mori could stupidly rewrite Makoto's feats and make it where she beats Izanami. Feats change over time in fiction and become bullshit and sometimes are worthless. I mainly go by advantages and disadvantages over a characters' special ability or power. For example: Azrael vs. Terumi. Azrael's advantage is strength and Terumi's advantage is his Nox Nyctores that stirs up emotions and is smarter than Azrael. I go by that to see who has the biggest advantage over the other.

 

Popularity doesn't matter in fighting debates nor do I care if a character is popular. I know Makoto is more popular but that doesn't mean anything in this particular debate. I like Bullet because of he attitude. I know Makoto is a tomboy but Bullet takes the cake of being a real tomboy and I have a thing for tomboys. Bullet rarely shows her feminine side which to me is kind of cute and funny. I don't just like the character based on potential, only on personality and attitude.

 

 

To answer for Madness4455, Izayoi isn't that strong like Nu or Mu(Noel) and as for " he could carry on a fight" . It's merely speculation over a beastkins' fighting abilities. Beastkin are no doubt stronger, faster, and possibly have more stamina or endurance than humans. But it's possible humans know ways to best beastkin.

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