[VS] Gallon: The Wolf Man

[Lion's Eye]

Skankin, I had a question about air chains. Specifically, which are the best ones to use? I've been running into some problems with chicken blockers lately (Mostly Bulleta, and then a Q-Bee too). I know j.lk, j.mk, j.hk into st.lp is a good one, but sometimes I've noticed this doesn't always work either. Are there any others? My problem with the aforementioned chain is the knee has such a short range it's not always practical against Bulletas when trying to get over her missile and punish her chicken blocking techniques. I can walk under the missile but that can also be quite dangerous. I also watched a video recently that showed a Gallon doing I think j.mp into j.hk into st.lp and it seemed successful. Curious about that also. I've also done 8 jumps into j.mk, j.hk to keep the Q-Bee at bay, but if I'm looking to get in and do some damage via the air, what are my options?

Note: I'll probably ask you more specifically about these matchups and some others later but I was gonna try to do a little research first. Don't want to be pestering you all the time.

[PsychoShot]

Question, Skankin: What are the best ways to bait tech hits with Talbain?

[Skankin Garbage]

Skankin, I had a question about air chains. Specifically, which are the best ones to use? I've been running into some problems with chicken blockers lately (Mostly Bulleta, and then a Q-Bee too). I know j.lk, j.mk, j.hk into st.lp is a good one, but sometimes I've noticed this doesn't always work either. Are there any others? My problem with the aforementioned chain is the knee has such a short range it's not always practical against Bulletas when trying to get over her missile and punish her chicken blocking techniques. I can walk under the missile but that can also be quite dangerous. I also watched a video recently that showed a Gallon doing I think j.mp into j.hk into st.lp and it seemed successful. Curious about that also. I've also done 8 jumps into j.mk, j.hk to keep the Q-Bee at bay, but if I'm looking to get in and do some damage via the air, what are my options?

Note: I'll probably ask you more specifically about these matchups and some others later but I was gonna try to do a little research first. Don't want to be pestering you all the time.

Your longest air chain is not J.Lk -> J.Mk -> J.Hk. Actually, I'd probably never use that one. Instead, the longest chain you can do is J.Mp -> J.Mk -> J.Hp -> J.Hk. Also, another thing you can do is just do J.Mk xx Beast Cannon.

In the case of Q-Bee...this might be a little advanced, but you shouldn't even be trying to force an air block from her; if she is floating when she blocks your air chain, she can get a free combo every single time.

Question, Skankin: What are the best ways to bait tech hits with Talbain?

Can you elaborate? Why, exactly, are you trying to bait push blocks with Talbain in the first place?

[PsychoShot]

Whoops. Meant GCs.

[Skankin Garbage]

Well, imo there's only two things Talbain has to bait GCs:

1. C.Lk - This is your main way to do it. Even though the frame data is the exact same as C.Lp, the hixbot itself is much safer. Learn the spacing for max range when you're expecting GCs.

2. S.Mp - This is only good for GCs that don't reach forward (i.e Demon Cradles), and I suppose it could be good for baiting GCs that are really slow to start up, like Hsien-Ko's. In any case, I don't use it often; the hitbox is rather unsafe (with Talbain's vulnerable hitbox extending almost all the way down his extended arm), and it only has two active hit frames, making it rather hard to time as a meaty.

If anything, learn to bait GCs by just halting your offense for a moment; except for with characters who have no normal DP move (i.e Jedah, Rapter), they will just whiff their move, allowing you to counter-attack it.

[Kyle]

Here's some vids from KEN-gallon's youtube channel:

Shows Gallon strats & tacticts per a few titles. VSAV included

www.youtube.com/watch?v=83NRxtN1Y9Y

www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MGyg30OdH8

Original footage here: KEN vs BUZZ
www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFiHW9RNoSE

[Skankin Garbage]

Moment Slice is probably one of Talbain's best attacks. Moment Slice combos typically result in the highest Red Damage of any of Talbain's combos (Though ES BCs do more total damage), but the problem is that there aren't many setups for Moment Slice (where, on the other hand, you don't even need to set up an ES BC unless you're playing a very good player).

The typical Moment Slice setups all require crossups; thus, the more obvious setups are to actually set up the spacing for a crossup J.Lk, or to do the Moment Slice OS: after knocking an opponent down, do a neutral J.Lk from the distance where your opponent would be directly under you if they attempted a forward roll. When the J.Lk connects, land and do the Moment Slice combination, while tacking an Hp at the end of it. If you are on the right side, you will do (J.Lk \/ C.Lp -> C.Mp xx Moment Slice). If you landed on the wrong side, you will still get (J.Lk \/ C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp).

These setups are gimmicky and obvious, though. What you need is a good way to incorporate it in your normal mixups, instead of largely telegraphed, elaborate setups that anyone can see coming a mile away. Unfortunately, the only good way at that point is to combo it off the dash. Unfortunately, the difficulty and setups can differ greatly from character to character; some characters will be very easy to hit with any setup, while some characters can only be hit by a crossup. Some characters can't be hit by Moment Slice from a dash at all!

Hence, I've made this list which indicates all the information you might need about comboing into Moment Slice from a dash attack on any character. Per each character, I've listed whether it's possible (and if it's just really hard), whether they can be crossed up by a D.Lk (or if they can ONLY be hit by Moment Slice with a D.Lk crossup to begin with), and which common dash attacks (D.Lk; D.Mk) and dash links (D.Lk, D.Lp; D.Mk, D.Lp) can be used. I've also compiled a list of some of the most simple setups, which you might using to establish the threat of a dash already:

Pursuit: This indicates whether or not a successful pursuit attack will set up a D.Lk \/ C.Lp -> S.Mp xx Moment Slice.

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: This indicates whether or not the following chain will set up a D.Lk \/ C.Lp -> S.Mp xx Moment Slice from point blank or roughly point blank. This setup can be used with the D.Mk, D.Lk Dash Link.

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: This indicates whether or not the following chain will set up a D.Mk \/ C.Lp -> S.Mp xx Moment Slice from point blank or roughly point blank. Notice that this setup requires a D.Mk, not a D.Lk like all other setups do. This setup can be done with the D.Mk, D.Lk Dash Link, and they might even be required in this setup against Jedah and Rikuo.

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: This indicates whether or not the following chain will set up a D.Lk \/ C.Lp -> S.Mp xx Moment Slice from point blank or roughly point blank. This setup is typically used to set up a crossup D.Lk, and thus it's going to be assumed to cross up unless noted otherwise.


As a bonus, since Dashing into Moment Slice doesn't work on the whole cast, I've added the most damaging chain combo that knocks an opponent down. This can also be useful on an opponent who can be hit with a Dashing setup into Moment Slice, as you won't always have meter. The three typical combos are:

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> S.Mk -> C.Hk
C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk
C.Lp -> C.Hp -> C.Hk

ONE FINAL, IMPORTANT NOTE: THESE SETUPS ALL ASSUME THAT YOUR OPPONENT IS CROUCHING. THERE IS NO GUARANTEE THAT ALL OF THESE SETUPS WILL WORK AGAINST A STANDING OPPONENT. Then again, why are you doing a dash if you think your opponent is going to be standing? And, of course, you can still land Moment Slice in other ways; this list is ONLY about comboing into Moment Slice off of a Dash attack.

Without furhter ado, here's the master "Dashing Damage" list:


1. DEMITRI

Possible: Yes

Crossup: Yes - unlikely

Single Hit? Yes, both

Dash Link? Yes, both

Setups:

Pursuit: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: Demitri might be the easiest person in the game to hit with this combo. Who knows why? Maybe cos he's just so damn fat when he's crouched. Either way, all setups work on him relatively easy, and - although I wouldn't go out of my way to set it up - you can even cross him up. The only real downside is that the Meterless Knockdown combo is the least damaging of any variant. ...Who cares? You can Moment Slice the shit out of Demi.



2. VICTOR

Possible: Yes (moderate)

Crossup: No

Single Hit? Yes

Dash Link? Yes

Setups:

Pursuit: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes (does not crossup)

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: Victor is a little difficult to hit with Moment Slice, but every setup works. If you are rockin' out against your opponent, I'd give it a shot; but, I wouldn't go out of my way to set it up.


3. ANAKARIS

Possible: Crossup only (difficult)

Single Hit? Yes, D.Lk crossup

Dash Link? No

Setups:

Pursuit: No

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> C.Hp -> C.Hk


Thoughts: Completely impossible, except in the unlikely event of a crossup. I would have never guessed, since Anak seems to get the shaft in virtually every regard. However, the Meterless Knockdown combo is the strongest possible variant, and you'll have to go out of your way to make it miss. That's good, right?



4. FELICIA

Possible: Crossup only (difficult)

Single Hit? Yes, D.Lk crossup

Dash Link? No; in addition, D.Mk, D.Lk is impossible against Felicia

Setups:

Pursuit: No

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: Screw you, Felicia. I figured that testing this might help me find an edge in some of Talbain's harder matches, but you can only land this from a Dashing crossup and the timing is extremely tight. On top of that, you can only use the weakest possible Meterless Knockdown variant. Blah.



5. B.B HOOD

Possible: Yes - only by crossup or corner (corner is difficult)

Single Hit? Yes, D.Lk (crossup or corner)

Dash Link? No; Dash Links are impossible against B.B Hood

Setups:

Pursuit: No

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> C.Hp -> C.Hk


Thoughts: I would virtually never go for this in the corner. It's very random, and your success seems to be dictated by your spacing - you can't just be right on top of her when you go for it, and the exact range appears to be so pixel-precise that I couldn't even figure it out...either that, or it depends heavily on factors like how late you hit D.Lk before landing, and how fast you cancel S.Mp into Moment Slice. But, if your timing has to be that tight, why risk it? Besides, crossing her up is stupidly easy anyways, and that's very hard to mess up.



6. BISHAMON

Possible: Corner only (difficult)

Crossup: No

Single Hit? Yes, D.Lk

Dash Link? Yes, D.Lk, D.Lp; I could not get D.Mk, D.Lp to work even once

Setups:

Pursuit: No

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: No

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: I really thought this was gonna be different. You can land a Dashing Moment Slice off a D.Lp or the D.Lp, D.Lk Dash Link. Either way, it's pretty hard.



7. JEDAH

Possible: Yes (moderate)

Crossup: Yes (difficult)

Single Hit? Yes, D.Lk

Dash Link? Yes

Setups:

Pursuit: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> C.Lk -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: Well, it's not easy, but you can hit him with the combo in midscreen, the corner, and even by crossup. As for his Meterless Knockdown variant, the spacing is a little tight. If you're not landing your Dash attack off of one of the recommended setups, you might just opt for C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk anyways.



8. Q-BEE

Possible: No; Moment Slice does not hit Q-Bee when she's crouching.

Cross-Up: No; crossup is possible and easy to do, but Moment Slice still does not connect.

Single Hit? No

Dash Link? No

Setups:

Pursuit: No

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: No

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> C.Hp -> C.Hk


Thoughts: This didn't exactly take a long time to test. I already knew that Moment Slice was useless against Q-Bee because she can just crouch under it. The only valuable thing to take away is that you can do the most powerful Meterless Knockdown variant on Q-Bee, and since her defense is very low, it does a whopping 29% of her lifebar before damage scaling. Suck it, Q-Bee!

Also, this might be slightly out of the scope of this article, but if you are really looking to do damage to Q-Bee off a dash, you can use the old D.(something) \/ S.M(p) xx ES BC combo (in other words, replace the optimal S.Mk which will whiff Q-Bee, with S.Mp which will not). The full combo with pursuit will do exactly 50%. But, we are not looking at combos that deal with ES Beast Cannon right now. Moving along.



9. HSIEN-KO

Possible: Yes (difficult; corner impossible)

Crossup: Yes (difficult)

Single Hit? Yes

Dash Link? No; in addition, D.Mk, D.Lk is impossible against Hsien-Ko

Setups:

Pursuit: No

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> C.Hp -> C.Hk


Thoughts: I don't even know, dude. I know for a fact that you can land this combo on Hsien because when I began the tests, I landed the full combo on my very first try. However, absolutely none of the common setups work, I can't seem to hit her with it at all in the corner, and it's difficult to cross her up. Oh well - this fight is like a total blowout, anyways; having this on top of all of Talbain's other advantages would be ridiculous. Meterless Knockdown combo is as good as it gets though, so at least that's something.



10. J. TALBAIN

Possible: Crossup only

Single Hit? Yes, D.Lk crossup

Dash Link? No; Dash Links are impossible against Talbain

Setups:

Pursuit: No

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> C.Hp -> C.Hk


Thoughts: Normally, all of Talbain's bullshit works very effectively against himself. Here...well, it's not perfect, but landing the crossup combo is very easy, and the setup works nicely. Meterless Knockdown combo is the most damaging possible variant.



11. LILITH

Possible: Yes; much easier with crossup or corner

Single Hit? Yes

Dash Link? No; Dash Links are impossible against Lilith

Setups:

Pursuit: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: ...So. It's definitely possible midscreen, and all the variations that are set up by a single D.Lk will work. But, they are honestly very hard, for the most part. Thankfully, crossing her up is very easy, allowing for an easy Moment Slice. Also, for whatever reason, landing the combo against her when she's cornered is much easier. I would have guessed this would be the case against most of the cast; however, Lilith is one of the last characters I tested, and this was the first time I ran into this phenomenon.

TL;DR: Do it when you've crossed her up or when she's cornered. Meterless Knockdown combo is the weakest possible variant, but Lilith dies so fast it probably doesn't matter.



12. RIKUO

Possible: Yes (difficult; corner impossible)

Crossup: Yes (difficult)

Single Hit? Yes, D.Lk crossup

Dash Link? Yes, D.Mk, D.Lk

Setups:

Pursuit: No

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: I don't think it's worth it to try your luck against Rikuo. The only setups that work are the crossup, which is very, very hard to do against Rikuo; and the setup for Talbain's Dash Link, which aside from having the highest possible margin of error already, will whiff Rikuo unless you step just a hair forward before doing the dash. And, honestly, in that hair of a second, your opponent could very well do anything but sit there and wait to get hit by your dash. Meterless Knockdown combo is the weakest possible variant.



13. L. RAPTER

Possible: Yes

Crossup: Yes (difficult)

Single Hit? Yes, D.Lk crossup

Dash Link? Yes, D.Lk, D.Lp; in addition, D.Mk, D.Lk is impossible against Rapter

Setups:

Pursuit: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: Holy shit. Everything about this test has defied my expectations. As it turns out, Rapter might be one of the easiest characters to land this combo against. The only thing that's difficult is hitting him with a crossup - ironically, the only thing I expected might be feasible. It's possible to get him in the corner with either a single D.Lk or the D.Lk, D.Lp Dash Link; however, the Dash Link requires very accurate spacing and is easy to mess up. Since it's virtually impossible to miss otherwise, I'd say forego the Dash Link. Meterless Knockdown combo is the weakest possible variant...but who fuggin' cares? You can hit Rapter with a Dashing Moment Slice combo!



14. SASQUATCH

Possible: Crossup only (difficult)

Single Hit? Yes, D.Lk crossup

Dash Link? No; in addition, D.Mk, D.Lk is impossible against Sasquatch

Setups:

Pursuit: No

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: What. A. Dick. The only way you're ever gonna land this against Sas is if you cross him up, which is super-hard to combo into. To add insult to injury, your Meterless Knockdown combo is the weakest possible variant.



15. MORRIGAN

Possible: Yes (...kind of difficult?)

Crossup: Yes (difficult)

Single Hit? Yes

Dash Link? No; Dash Links are impossible against Morrigan

Setups:

Pursuit: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Lk -> C.Mp -> C.Mk: Yes

C.Lp -> C.Mp -> C.Mk -> S.Hp: No

C.Lp -> C.Mp/Mk: Yes

Meterless Knockdown: C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk


Thoughts: I dunno...it's like, hitting her with this combo is not as easy as possible, like it is against Demi or Rapter. But, on the other hand, it's not mind-bendingly difficult, like Hsien-Ko or Rikuo. It's easy enough that even though there's a margin of error, I'd still personally go for it. Meterless Knockdown combo is the weakest possible variant.

______________________

SIMPLER YES/NO LISTS

For the people who don't want to peruse the entire document, here are a lot of do/don't lists. I've made a lot of lists, depending on how people like to take in the information, so there's going to be a bit of redundancy.



The following characters can be hit with DMS (Dashing Moment Slice) combos, midscreen and corner, very easily:

Demitri
L. Rapter


The following characters are easier to hit in the corner:

Lilith (also easy with crossup)


The following characters are best to hit with a crossup:

B.B Hood
J. Talbain




The following characters can be hit with DMS combos with a slightly higher margin of error in the midscreen and corner:

Victor
Jedah
Morrigan



The following characters are very difficult to hit with DMS combos, yet it can be done midscreen:

Hsien-Ko
Rikuo


Corner only...and the corner combo is very difficult:

Bishamon


Crossup only...and the crossup is very difficult:

Anakaris
Felicia
Sasquatch


The following characters can not be hit by Moment Slice while crouching:

Q-Bee


I wouldn't try crossing these characters up with a DMS combo:

Demitri
Anakaris
Felicia
Jedah
Hsien-Ko
Rikuo
Rapter
Sasquatch
Morrigan
Victor (crossup impossible)
Bishamon (crossup impossible)
Q-Bee (because fuck you, Q-Bee)


I wouldn't try DMS combos in the corner against these characters:

B.B Hood
Bishamon
J.Talbain
Anakaris (corner impossible)
Felicia (corner impossible)
Hsien-Ko (corner impossible)
Rikuo (corner impossible)
Sasquatch (corner impossible)
Q-Bee (STFU)


Strangely enough, you shouldn't try DMS combos midscreen (not counting crossups) against these guys:

B.B Hood
Hsien-Ko
Lilith
Rikuo
Anakaris (impossible without crossup)
Felicia (impossible without crossup)
J.Talbain (impossible without crossup)
Sasquatch (impossible without crossup)
Bishamon (impossible except with corner)
Q-Bee (impossible except with hax)


Overall safe to try midscreen (not counting crossup):

Demi (easy)
Rapter (easy)
Morrigan (moderate)
Victor (moderate)
Jedah (moderate)


Overall safe to cross up:

B.B Hood (easy)
J. Talbain (easy)
Lilith (moderate)


Overall safe to hit in the corner:

Demi (easy)
Rapter (easy)
Lilith (easy)
Morrigan (moderate)
Victor (moderate)
Jedah (moderate)


Meterless Knockdown master list for C.Lp -> C.Hp -> C.Hk:

Anakaris
B.B Hood
Q-Bee
Hsien-Ko
J.Talbain


Meterless Knockdown master list for C.Lp -> C.Lk -> S.Mk -> C.Hk:

Jedah


Meterless Knockdown mastery list for C.Lp -> S.Mk -> C.Hk:

Demitri
Victor
Felicia
Bishamon
Lilith
Rikuo
Rapter
Sasquatch
Morrigan

[Narroo]

Okay, I just want to know: HOW THE HECK DO YOU GET BEAST CANNON TO DO WHAT YOU WANT!?

My god, that stupid move does random things every time! I can neither get it to change directions at a predictable time interval, nor get it to go in the direction I want!
Seriously, I can mash all 3 P buttons immediately after doing Beast Cannon, and when and if he does it is random. Pushing one button instead of mashing doesn't help; it makes it worse.

On top of that, he goes in seemingly random directions: Got my stick crammed up into the 9 Corner? How about straight up, or even backwards instead?!

It's getting rather frustrating; I'm trying to practice in arcade mode, and Boss Talbain can get all 5 hits of ES Beast Cannon to connect while I can't even get the right direction or timing.

[Kyle]

KEN Gallons BLOG:

http://blog.livedoor.jp/kengallon/

[Korey]

Okay, I just want to know: HOW THE HECK DO YOU GET BEAST CANNON TO DO WHAT YOU WANT!?

My god, that stupid move does random things every time! I can neither get it to change directions at a predictable time interval, nor get it to go in the direction I want!
Seriously, I can mash all 3 P buttons immediately after doing Beast Cannon, and when and if he does it is random. Pushing one button instead of mashing doesn't help; it makes it worse.

On top of that, he goes in seemingly random directions: Got my stick crammed up into the 9 Corner? How about straight up, or even backwards instead?!

It's getting rather frustrating; I'm trying to practice in arcade mode, and Boss Talbain can get all 5 hits of ES Beast Cannon to connect while I can't even get the right direction or timing.

What I tend to do is double tap the punches as I input the motions. What's important to realize is to do the input slower or faster depending on the character. But for now, focus on getting 6,9,7,9,2 as your first shape down.