Baiken vs Dizzy

[Star-Demon]

I can't do things in this match.

What do you guys think about it?

EDIT: I wanna make every matchup thread I make myself the same.

**RESERVED - probably obsolete in a few months. Hellmonkey Nerina feel free to edit. :P **

Moving, Normals and Specials:
**RESERVED**

2S: **RESERVED**
Jumping:
J.HS:

Counters:
Sakura: **RESERVED**
Ouren: **RESERVED**
Youshijin: **RESERVED**
Mawarikomi: **RESERVED**

Baku:
P BAKU.
HS. SEAL DAT SHIT.

Getting out:
**RESERVED**

Getting in:
**RESERVED**

On Knockdown:
1. Drop a tatami on her head.
2. **RESERVED**
3. **RESERVED**

Remember:


Problems:

[Star-Demon]

Some observations so far:

Dizzy has really good air to ground normals that fuck my shit up. They are big and depending on when and where you jump to cover space or CH with Air tatami, you will eat an aggressive Dizzy's jumpins and garbage.

Going in on Dizzy with meter is very dangerous. Her normals protect her front very well and any hit turns into Axe-> Hand-> Ice Spike, and it hurts badly. If she feels so compelled, she mashes out emergency super and you eat blowback or burn meter blocking it, or in the case of the Grab super, you eat some damage and feel like an idiot.

Dizzy should not be allowed to summon, but this is difficult as Baiken doesn't have a fireball, and kabari is very slow. If you go in, either garbage is coming or you are going to eat IceSpike or Axe.

Hitting Dizzy with j.D air-to-air may seem like a good idea but Baiken requires some kind of followup after knockdown from j.D.

Air to air with Dizzy using j.s is also not a good idea. She will usually beat it out unless in a very bad position, she's usually avoiding it against Baiken.

2S is very useful, but be careful because DIzzy will make you eat spike/Axe if you don't know what to do next.

So - if anyone has any advice based off these - please post up.

[Shinjin]

Yet again; I'll keep this post short, as I could go on forever when it comes to matchups against at least half of the cast. There are a lot of details and specifics as always, but I'll focus on the general stuff.

This is a bit of a favorable matchup for Baiken.

This matchup mainly revolves around:

---------------------------------

Poking at midrange with f.S, 2S and Kabari, since her only move that beats them cleanly is the ice spike (236H) and they stuff raw summons

Using really low IAD Tatami and IAD jS to tatami, since it kills her summoning bubbles in the air and raw summons on the ground.

Chasing her down when she is using her air-movement to escape, with jP, iad jS and dashes (and antiair with jP or 6P)

Knowing how to escaping her mix-up game

---------------------------------

The way to go about is first and foremost stay on the ground, mixup up with dash fd-break / dash 2s and kabari. Since these options either close the gap and

The goal is to deny Dizzy from summoning stuff, and thus force her to rely on ice spike-counterpoke (that is why you have to mix up with dash fd-break, so you can punis it on block with either Ouren ir iad jS jP jK -> combo).

Her 2H is also really risky for her, block and punish. Yet again, this is why you also dash up and block. The poking with 2S and kabari is to force her to use these risky moves and punish them. Because when you have forced her into the corner with a knockdown; she should have a difficult time getting in a favorable position again. Just try not to be a idiot and use well thought out pressure and positioning.

The biggest hurdle you wil encounter in this matchup is when she has gotten a knockdown (ex. she hits you with a ice spike) or she succesfully reads your passive play (ex.you are baing ice spike with block, but she does a raw-summon instead) and gets a summon. Generally speaking, killing the fish is a bad idea, but sometimes using 6P to kill it and then jumping or using kabari can be an idea. It (of course) depends on where Dizzy is on the screen and what she is doing. If she is stupid enough to use an air-based okizeme (ex. iad-stuff), just Ouren out of there and get into a favorable position. The real trick is when she starts abusing her retarded throw range, since the only thing you can really do is to either break the throw or 1f jump of there (which a lot of times leads to you blocking a laser or a fish attack, and then you have to block her c.S since she option selects her throw, which then puts you in yet another unfavorable position).

There are also some details regarding how to react to 2p, 2p 2k, 2k 2d into jc etc. but I'll save that for another time...

-------------------

This matchup is focused on Baiken chasing down Dizzy and forcing her to use moves that needs tension in order to be safe (ice spike, 2h frc).

Dizzy has few defensive options, her best often being IB into 1f-jump and running away.

If Dizzy uses air-based okizeme, Baiken can just run away,if dizzy is on the ground and mainly abusing her throw-range, shit is tough for Baiken.

Dizzy has to use risky moves in order to beat Baiken, and if she guesses wrong she can die a quick and horrible death (ex: blocked 2H into BA 5H Kabari leads to huge damage knockdown and tons of tension for Baiken).

Baiken needs to be good at positioning herself well when chasing Dizzy, but is doable with experience.

IF BOTH PLAYERS ARE DECENT ENOUGH!

Cheers.

[excelence]

Some observations so far:

Dizzy has really good air to ground normals that fuck my shit up. They are big and depending on when and where you jump to cover space or CH with Air tatami, you will eat an aggressive Dizzy's jumpins and garbage.

...

Nope, actually Dizzy has very crappy jump normal, they're indeed Big but also extend her hit box to almost as big as her attack hit box, you can time your 6p as anti air to beat all her jump in (j.k, j.2s & j.h) and evade the laser fish at the same time or instant air grab her j.h on reaction.

Baiken j.s indeed kills Dizzy like Shinjin said, her only mid air attack that Baiken have no way to beat is iad back j.s

And just for information, Dizzy j.2s're invul to air grab, if you're using instant air grab to counter her j.h, she will start abusing this.

[Star-Demon]

Instant air grab? Yo dawg, you're gonna have to teach me that one.

[excelence]

You just need to time your 9.hs and let the hit box do the rest. you can try practicing by setting Dizzy do a deep jump in. j.h to get the feel of the timing.

[Star-Demon]

You just need to time your 9.hs and let the hit box do the rest. you can try practicing by setting Dizzy do a deep jump in. j.h to get the feel of the timing.

I tried it and landed it a few times, but I don't think I really understand how to do it right.

[excelence]

Well the basic of Air Grabbing is to have the opponent slightly a little bit above you, if you're not used with air grab as anti air it does feels awkward at first, but it'll came naturally with experience... or try playing HOS

[Hellmonkey]

Most jumps in Guilty Gear are 3 frames long. There are a few 4 and then a couple more exceptions.

There are two methods to 'instant air throw'. One is to throw back in the air, and one is to throw forward.

To throw back in the air, simply hit 7 (up-back), move your joystick or slide your finger to 4 (back), and immediately press H. Similarly, hit 9, 6H to throw forward.

Chances are if you are at this point, your execution is significantly slower than timing your movement and attacks within 3 frames of each other, so try to do it as quickly as possible. (on a joystick, you can get your input down to a consistent window of 2 frames or in some cases even 1 frame, on a pad this is much more difficult)



Keep in mind Baiken's air throw range is not that large, and that GG favors characters slightly under the other character to win air-throws. Also, Dizzy has j.2S which will beat out your airthrow. Other characters have quick air moves or air moves with big hitboxes that will prevent you from getting close enough. Try to throw using back air throw near the corner (which will throw them forward), to get a wallbounce combo.

[Star-Demon]

Nice - I'll try it. I had a feeling that something like 96H worked better.

but how do you read a jump and react in three frames? :O