Matchup Overview
Sin has some of the best pokes in the game. Slayer has some of the best counterpokes in the game. These two opposing philosophies are put to the test in this matchup, where counterhits are the norm.
- Sin's fS and 2S have incredible range, which makes it harder for Dandy Step to avoid them.
- Both moves lead to good damage and knockdown thanks to...
- Beak Driver (236H) is another great poke and even hits twice at close range. The 2nd hit wall bounces on CH, which makes it a painful callout for Dandy Step. However, the recovery is very long.
- Charged Beak Driver (236[H]) changes the properties of Beak Driver at maximum charge, giving it a better hitbox that can catch 6P, more blockstun, and the ability to wallstick. Sin can also partial charge just to delay his Beak Driver timing.
- I'm Sure I'll Hit Something (236H > HHH...) is a followup to Beak Driver that knocks down on the last hit, giving him a knockdown from fS and 2S at any range. This is very powerful, but Sin cannot use this recklessly because...
- Sin's specials cost Calories to use, and his Calories are tracked in the gauge shown above. Each special costs Calories, and Sin can cancel his specials into each other at a cost of additional Calories.
- Waiting for Sin to hit low Calories lets Slayer take risks more comfortably. When Sin has low Calories, his punish combos become much weaker and he won't be able to use multiple specials on block.
- Sin must use Still Growing (214H) to recover Calories. Sin can safely eat off a 2D knockdown or throw, but the startup and recovery on Still Growing are so long that it's very punishable if he cancels into it on block.
- Once Sin is low on Calories, the matchup becomes centered around Sin trying to eat. Slayer can so heavily punish a bad meal that Sin players sometimes even spend meter on Red RC just to eat.
- Though Sin definitely has better pokes than Slayer, Slayer has surprisingly effective counters to them. K Mappa, P Dandy Pilebunker, or 6P are all effective in neutral at the right spacing.
- Sin also has long counterhit states on many of his moves, including Beak Driver, Hawk Baker (623S, aka DP), and Still Growing. It's very reasonable for Slayer to stun Sin and win the round.
- Most characters have to respect Sin's approaches with Leap (214P/K), which is Sin's only special that doesn't cost Calories, but Slayer's 2S is a consistent antiair against Leap approaches.
- Even though Sin can vary the spacing on his Leap to play around 2S, Slayer's jP is also an effective counter since Slayer is one of the few characters that can always get a knockdown from jP.
- Sin does have a great way to catch Dandy Step with Elk Hunt (236K, aka Slide), which is almost guaranteed to catch both P and K Dandy Step.
- However, Elk Hunt's startup is slower if used from farther away. Therefore, much of the same options that cover fS, 2S, and Beak Driver can also hit Elk Hunt during startup.
- Of course, Slayer's 2H can specifically counter Elk Hunt. Since Elk Hunt slides into Slayer, this helps Slayer get a CH 2H > 6H combo more consistently. 2H can also beat Sin's 2S and 2D, so 2H has some useful coverage.
Sin's defensive options
Wakeup timings
Sin has really slow face up wakeup, but really fast face down wakeup. This limits what mixups you can do from certain knockdowns, for example a Slayer 2D knockdown into It's late is barely meaty against Sin with perfect timing, and Helter skelter will have a much bigger gap. It is still very much possible to do good mixups, it's just a bit more limited and you need to keep your setups tight.
Backdash
Covers a great distance in neutral and has a good amount i-frames, but has a very long total duration. This means even if Sin dodges your attacks during pressure, you can still have frameadvantage, and often times lead to a guaranteed punish. You can sometimes see Sin players try to use YRC to cut down on the recovery time on their backdash, but this can be dangerous as YRC is CH state during startup and is naturally punished by delaying your attacks anyways.
Hawk Baker (aka Sin's DP)
Cancelable on block and leads to combos on hit, however it has full CH recovery, short range, low active frames, and also it keeps Sin grounded in the same position. This makes it especially vulnerable to Slayer's pressure, which consists of a lot of i-frames, fishing for counter-hits, and disjointed attacks. You can use BDC and dandy step to easily avoid and punish Hawk baker for high damage.
- Since Hawk baker has 9 frame startup, it is also possible to sometimes YRC OS your attacks and buffer K pile as a punish.
- Hawk baker on air hit has way stronger combos than on stand hit, so avoiding 6K as a mixup sometimes can be a good idea.
Sin's 2P
Sin 2P is a good button for mashing, with good range, combos, whiff-cancels and framedata. However, it does have the weakness that because of it's high hitbox, you can often 2K under it as Slayer if you have the proper spacing. Other than 2P, Sin doesn't really have that many great abare options: 5P is 6f and crouched under, and 5K and 2K are 7f and have much longer recovery. This opens up some mix-ups and defensive ideas if you pay attention to spacing.
move
Overview
General info about how move is used in matchup and any notable properties such as damage, hitbox, frame data, etc.
Details
Bullet points on move. Most important info first, more specific/niche info last
Counterplay
How to counter move: punishes, counterpoke options, spacing, strategy, etc. May want to explore the RPS in certain interactions.
Combos
- c.S f.S > c.S f.S > 5PK > K mappa → will be spaced for 2K to go under Sin 2P
- c.S f.S > 5P > 2SH > 5K > j.K~D
- 2K > c.S f.S > 2KD
- 2K > c.S f.S > 5PK > K mappa → will be spaced for 2K to go under Sin 2P
- 2KPSH > 5K > j.K2K > j.D2K > j.S > dj.SHD
- 2K > 5P > 2SH same as 2KPSH
- 2K > 5P > 2KD
- It’s late > 2KD (meaty)
- It's late > c.S f.S > 5K > 2D (crouch)
- It's late > 2PSH > 5K > j.K2K > j.D > dj.PKD (Corner K dandy mixup, crouch-hit, and can not be meaty)
- It's late > 2PSH > 5K > j.K2K > j.D2K > j.P214K > BDOT (Corner K dandy mixup, crouch-hit, and can not be meaty)
- P pile ender has more advantage than 6P/2D
- 6K > c.S f.S > c.S f.S > 2KD
- 6K > 2PSH > same as 2KPSH
- CH 6P > K cwh > K mappa > c.S > j.SHD2K > j.PK > dj.KD / j.K > dj.HD
- CH 6P > K cwh > K mappa > c.S > EW > 6H > PUP > IL
- Bite > CH K mappa > c.S > 2D
- Bite > CH K mappa > 2SH > 5K > j.K > dj.H~D
- CH 5H > IAD j.D2K > j.PD > c.S f.S > j.K > dj.HD
Slayer
